band personnel.

Billy Murdoch · From: Glasgow, Scotland, U.K.

Hi All,
Within easy distance of my home there are not many venues for country bands,I would guess there are about half a dozen country music clubs,usually one per weeknight.
Most bands are four piece and I find it so annoying to go to these clubs and often find that the band members are a mix and match of the players in two or three of the circuit bands.I know a couple of bass players who work with two outfits,a singer who works with three,and a steeler who has worked with more than four bands during a very short time.
It would appear that they are determined to keep all the work to themselves.The club organisers do not seem to worry and the patrons are usually so tied up in tripping over their own feet to notice.
How is it in YOUR area?
Best regards
Billy

Tommy R. Butler · From: Nashville, Tennessee

W0W... This must be a world wide occurrence !!!

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

it's the same with the working "bandstand" players where I am as well. I think this is very common.

I think practically it is because band leaders want to have players show up that have a known resume'. Most bands do not really rehearse all that much so the need or desire for a player who is already "with the program" allows for a smooth gig.

Here in Charlotte I am somewhat known by players around town and get calls now and then to just show up and play, you know.."be there by 8:30 we start at 9:30"..

Down the road in the next town I am a totally unknown outsider, "Who do you play with? How long you been playing" ?

"We'll call you if we need you "

I don't think it is as much as keeping all the work for themselves as it is having a group of players that are confident with each other .

When we are looking for a sub player we have a GO TO list as well, we need and want someone who we know will be a good fit. A 4 hour gig with an unknown who really isn't up to snuff can really be a problem on a demanding gig. I see and understand both sides of this situation.

It is indeed a tight little circle where you have to earn your way in. If there is an opportunity to show up, setup and jam with a band on the gig, that would be the right way to break the ice. The playing/songs come first in these cases. If a player fits in they may be part of the little circle before the night is over.

In these situations, Melody lines and Intros to common songs will carry the day ( or night ).

there is nothing better then to have them say.."Kick off Swinging Doors"..

and you do....

it's a resume item...

On the other hand if you are looking for a gig where there already is a seasoned Steel player on the gig ...you're in the wrong place looking for a gig anyway.

Don Discher · From: Sault Ste Marie,Ontario,Canada

I play bass in two bands and rhythm,steel,fiddle and vocals in my band.Just not enough new country musicians coming along.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

I play in three and sometimes four bands in this area as needed. My wife and I have our own band which usually plays two to three nights a month. If you're wanting to play a lot there's just not enough work anymore for one band to work a lot. In our local country music association for the monthly jamborees I played in 7 out of the 11 we held last year either on lead or steel. I have a friend who plays bass and another on drums who do the same thing. This way we can work 3 to 5 nights a week if we wanted to. All you have to do is be established in one area where people know you and keep up to date on music.........JH in Va.
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Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!!

Bo Borland · From: South Jersey -

It's the same up here. There are a couple of bars in the tri state area, a couple southern rock bands that call themselves country and a couple of country bands that can play anything and cater to the dance crowd.
If anyone needs a sub they know who can cut the gig and who can't. It's nice to know you can call a tune, current or not and have confidence that your sub will know it.
_________________
Bo Borland
Rittenberry SD10 , Derby D-10, Quilter TT12, Peavey Session 400 w/ JBL, NV112, Fender Blues Jr. , 1974 Dobro 60N squareneck, Rickenbacher NS lapsteel, 1973 Telecaster Thinline, 1979 blonde/black Frankenstrat
Currently picking with
Mason Dixon Band masondixonband.net

Billy Murdoch · From: Glasgow, Scotland, U.K.

I have no problems with a player depping for someone who is sick or on holiday.
My complaint is that when you go to see a band who have Fred Jim Bob and Joe playing on a Monday as band x you do'nt really want to go to the same club next Monday to see Fred Jim Bob and Pete calling themselves band y.
I played with a good band some years ago and I sat in with a couple of other bands for a few gigs,the band leader called me and said "make up your mind who you are with" He did'nt want me being in other bands which played the same places.
I suppose at the end of the day We are all mercenary and will play at the drop of a £ or $.
Best regards
Billy

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Billy I certainly agree and find it to be a conflict of interest. IF someone is fronting band X and then goes and fronts band Y, I see that as a problem .

We have the same issues around here, you go to a club to see an artist , or singer, and they have the same out of control Lead Guitar player playing the same licks as he did when you saw him last time with HIS band, or worse, when he filled in with YOUR band.

And I guess it can happen this way too..you to see a local Country band with a Steel Player and it's the same Steel player you saw last week with another band. Around here at least that player is a great player and a good friend.!

It happens...and it ain't gonna stop happening..

Unless you start your own band and go get your own gigs...

Today, I am going to jam with a new bunch of players that I have never met, they invited me to perhaps play a few gigs with them

same situation..

If they end up playing a few gigs in the SAME clubs that I have been playing the past few years.....guess what

Same Tele' player and Steel player !

ME !

Probably the same songs too ... Sad

Russ Tkac · Posted 29 Jul 2007 4:45 am

What is Swinging Doors?

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

The Great Carnak says..

"I'm thinking Merle Haggard"

and the the hidden question is:
Define Swinging Doors

Is that the answer ?

Billy Murdoch · From: Glasgow, Scotland, U.K.

Tony,
I guess the doors swing both ways.
Just watch you do'nt get your fingers caught in them. Smile

Good to hear that the music scene seems to be "Universal"
best regards
Billy

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

[/quote]

. There were at least 5 or 6 players that day that played in more than one band. Made for a full day of inbreeding jokes....[/quote]

Is that like Brother Daryl playing Banjo in a band with his other Brother Daryl who also plays Banjo ?

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

[quote="Jim Sliff"]

Ernest Cawby · From: Lake City, Florida, USA, R.I.P.

Here in Quitman we have had as many as 4 steels set up at one time, I did not set let the others do it, John Le Master, Larry Bulluck, Jack conyers, forget the other, they just take turns on breaks work wonderful, so many ways to get theree on the same guitar. A real study of how to play a song. We hjave lot of drop in singers so much talent around here it is great the are all good.

ernie

ernie

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

I've played in 4-5 bands at the same time, for various reasons, mainly when I was playing all the time. Yeah, we make jokes about the musically incestuous nature of it, but most of the time, these were very different styles - ranging from old-school blues and jazz to rockabilly to Americana and roots rock to surf-punk to very traditional country and bluegrass. But there are a number of advantages.

First - if you're trying to make a living playing music on "the circuit", you generally need to play a lot. Unless you want to travel widely, it's easy to saturate the market with one band, or even several bands with a single style. There are some people around here who push, more or less, the same thing around as different bands, and after a while, it does start to sound in-bred and homogenized. But if you can really segment each band and get a core of musicians who are really comfortable in a bunch of different styles, it sure does cut down a lot of practical problems. If you have a good rhythm section who really can lay it down across the spectrum, why not use them? How about the nightmarish scheduling problems from using a bunch of different people in each project?

Second - when I was playing a lot, I got pretty bored playing the same thing day in and day out. I have tried bands which play a wide variety of styles all under one umbrella, and it almost never works out. Inevitably, when marketing and booking a band, the first question is "What do you play?" Although it's a good idea to be able to play a variety of stuff, I really think markets have segmented so much in the last couple of decades that you need to be able to give them a clear and unequivocal answer - "Yeah, we're a country band." or "We play blues." Sometimes, you can mix and match at the gig - but I think a band needs a musical identity. Having different bands in different styles lets you get that identity, while still getting to play a bunch of different music.

So I think, to some extent, this has become inevitable among a lot of hard-working local or regional musicians. I go by the music - if the same musicians really play a bunch of different syles well, who am I to argue whether or not it's in-bred?

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Yesterday I went to a JAM with a new group of players that I met for the first time. And yes it turns out they play some of the same clubs I have been playing for the past few years around town..

yesterday I played on the Strat, no Steel.

I played songs I have not played in decades, and I played some common tunes that I have been playing FOR decades, they sounded totally different as I was sharing leads with a very fine Honky Tonk keyboard player, a very rhythmic in the groove Bass player and funky drummer who sings like Steve Perry.

Next time I go hang with these guys I am bringing the Steel and we will play a few more common tunes..or..maybe not..

The short of it is that if we decide to play a few gigs together they will most likely be in some of the same clubs that we all have played in previously,same players,different lineup,different Music .

It sure was fun playing the Strat this time out...

Kinda looking forward to the next time...

"What a Marvelous Night for a Moondance"

tp

Tim Whitlock · From: Colorado, USA

In this neck of the woods the "country clubs" all basically want recent vintage top 40 hits for the legions of line-dancing zombies. Therefore, it's not unusual to see the same sidemen backing up this week's Garth/Toby/Tim wannabe, and why shouldn't they? It's more or less live karaoke anyway.

Musicians playing original music, or anything akin to traditional country music (think Hank, Ernest, Buck, Webb, etc) need not apply. Bitter? You bet!!

Ernie Pollock · From: Mt Savage, Md USA

Wow!! You guys have bands in your area that actually use steel guitar!! That must really be nice, up here in the western part of Maryland, there are no bands using steel guitar at all, at least that I know of. I know all the pickers & they are all looking for a band that will have them.
My wife & I have our own little group with just tracks & her on Conga drums & both singing, I back myself up on steel, play some instrumental & things like that, but we do it mostly for very low or no pay, but damn, you don't have to depend on anyone but yourself. But I sure would enjoy sitting back & playing steel in a real band again, but I guess thats just not going to happen up here in Rock & Roll, & Just Gosh Awful Music area that this is.

Ernie Sad

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Barry Blackwood · Posted 31 Jul 2007 7:00 am

Billy, the more things change, the more they stay the same .....

Ernie Pollock · From: Mt Savage, Md USA

to Jim above: the Gosh Awful Music is the kind with just an electric guitar that is distorted & too damned loud, all nite long, in a band that has everything miked & all mikes are as loud as possible, so that you cannot, talk, hear or do anything but suck up cigarette smoke if you care to stay & lose your hearing!!

Ernie Whoa!

Stu Schulman · From: Ulster Park New Yawk (deceased)

Hmm?I play steel guitar with a young lady who is a great singer/songwriter,Another young guy who also is a great singer/songwriter,an Alt Country Band,A band of rock guys who wrote a Cd's worth of hysterical trucking songs,I also play with a great Texas Fiddle player "Keith Junot"and A Loud-Ass rock/blues band,not to mention various American Legions,and VFW's with some older Western Swing players.In my other life I play guitar in a Soul/R&B/Blues band...I consider myself very lucky to have all these folks who like me,and what I do.I have never heard anyone say eehh It's his sorry ass again!Not that I'm that great I just work really hard at it,and I never ever hustle anyone's gig.I live in a smaller town than most.I also get to share most of the steel guitar session work with my friend Greg Booth.I don't see a problem with seeing the same people rotating in different bands.Oh! I did hear a complaint once from a customer when our band backed up Buddy Guy's brother Phil,the customer wanted to know why we were backing Phil and why didn't he bring his band.Phil told him that the club wasn't paying enough to fly up his whole band from Chicago and that we were his favorite players in town.Just Maybe these players that you keep seeing are the cream that has risen to the top.
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Dave Harmonson · From: Seattle, Wa

I think Dave Mudgett was reading my mind. These days I can't count how many different bands I'm playing with and I really enjoy the variety. I've got my own band that does mostly traditional country and I love it, but I sometimes play with bands doing more current material, sometimes mostly rock, and a couple of bluegrass bands I play with. From 1981-1996 I played in one band and we stayed busy through that whole stretch. I had various different versions as people left and got replaced, but still after a while it did get to be boring. Last Saturday I played guitar with a loose knit party band doing mostly oldies, Sunday I played an acoustic duo, Tonight I played with my 3 piece country band (no drums). Saturday I'm playing steel for a guy doing mostly originals that are pretty much current country sounding, and Sunday I'll be playing with some folks from Georgia who I haven't met yet doing original roots country. I think maybe it's a bit like Waylon sang "I've Always Been Crazy But It's Kept Me From Going Insane". By the way, Stu, I understand you're an old friend of Chris Middaugh. We're trying to get a band going with two female singers, but as yet we've had trouble getting everyone together. Chris is great player and we're toying with the idea of having both steels set up.

Robert Leaman · From: Murphy, North Carolina, USA

Here in western North Carolina, there are many fine musicians. Steel guitarists are few and far between but there are some. The principle problem is dependability in that almost all commit to a gig but few actually show up to play the gig and fewer are on time. Of all these people, any one of them will sit on the porch and pick with you all night and complain if you quit before 3 o'clock in the morning.

I'm know that some play with several different bands and I believe that dependability is the biggest factor. Many "no shows" limt the number of available musicians.

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