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Topic: Opinion on old Emmon steel peddle… |
Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 12 Mar 2023 6:00 am |
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Curious what you Emmons guru’s think about this particular D-10.
Bolt-on changer, necks, headstock. Mixed 60’s and 70’s bellcranks.
Late 70’s endplates, possibly cabinet (not sure how to distinguish). Late 70’s pedal rack , possibly earlier.
New fretboards from Jerry Roller's parts stash, and new pickup wound to the ReSound 65 specs by the fella who winds for Emmons Co. currently.
Would like to gain some clarity on this steel.
Thanks 
Last edited by Mike DiAlesandro on 1 Apr 2023 8:11 am; edited 4 times in total |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Andy Gibson
From:
Tennessee USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2023 7:16 am
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| Is that a Bobbe Seymour Frankenstein push pull? |
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TRAP TRULY
From:
Mobile , AL
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Posted 12 Mar 2023 1:50 pm
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| I'm no expert, but a bunch of those old 60`s Emmons guitars had knee levers added to them with 70s parts. Dont know about that one. Is the pedal stop bar metal or wood? |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 12 Mar 2023 5:08 pm
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| TRAP TRULY wrote: |
| I'm no expert, but a bunch of those old 60`s Emmons guitars had knee levers added to them with 70s parts. Dont know about that one. Is the pedal stop bar metal or wood? |
Trap - the pedal stop bar is metal. I think they used a wood stop bar originally, and then switched over to metal in the later years? |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 12 Mar 2023 11:22 pm
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What is the the pedal-to-pedal and cross shaft spacing? On later PPs w/ narrow pedals, mid-'70s on ->, the cross shaft and pedal spacing is narrower, ~2-1/2". If it's wider than that then it's most likely not a late '70s body. Spacing would have been a wider on most of the earlier bolt-on and cut tail guitars (but not all), closer to ~2-3/4". The pedals on this guitar look like they are the wider style that have been cut down, the sides of the pads appear to have vertical edges, not rounded over. It's hard to say from the pics but worth a closer inspection. The black bobbin pickups are worth pondering too, if original Emmons those might be quite old...
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All lies and jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest - Paul Simon |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 13 Mar 2023 6:14 am
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| Ian Worley wrote: |
| What is the the pedal-to-pedal and cross shaft spacing? On later PPs w/ narrow pedals, mid-'70s on ->, the cross shaft and pedal spacing is narrower, ~2-1/2". If it's wider than that then it's most likely not a late '70s body. Spacing would have been a wider on most of the earlier bolt-on and cut tail guitars (but not all), closer to ~2-3/4". The pedals on this guitar look like they are the wider style that have been cut down, the sides of the pads appear to have vertical edges, not rounded over. It's hard to say from the pics but worth a closer inspection. The black bobbin pickups are worth pondering too, if original Emmons those might be quite old... |
Thanks Ian - the pickups are new, purchased from the company that supplies the new Emmons Co. with their supply.
Yes, you are correct, these are cut down wider pedals, I forgot about that.
Here is a photo of the pedals ---
Would the pedal spacing indicate the year of the cabinet as well? That's a good clue if so, which I imagine is so.
Here is a photo of the pedal pullers on the cross-shafts--- looks to be 2 1/2" spacing
And some scalloped bellcranks ---
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Cody Stewart
From:
Traverse City Michigan, USA
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Posted 13 Mar 2023 2:53 pm
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I’m no expert, but the serial#, according to my knowledge indicates 1978ish. The pedal and shaft spacing along with the metal pedal stop bar are correct for 1978ish. Most of the bell cranks look period correct to the 70’s guitars. The long knee levers could have been from any era really. Looks like whoever was working on it sure got in a hurry when they rodded it. Yikes! The slot head screws going through the changer end plate into the necks are also an interesting choice. My guess is someone wanted to make themselves a Bolt on and put one together with parts they sourced. I sincerely doubt it came from Burlington that way.
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Bolt On’s: Red Belly, Brown Belly, 73 Sho~Bud Pro~II, Fender’s/Peavey’s. If it doesn't sound like 1968, then I probably won’t like it. |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 13 Mar 2023 3:21 pm No expert, but...
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| How does it play and sound? Because, in the final analysis, that's all that really matters! 👍 |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 13 Mar 2023 4:18 pm Re: No expert, but...
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| Donny Hinson wrote: |
| How does it play and sound? Because, in the final analysis, that's all that really matters! 👍 |
Donny - it plays and sounds real nice in my no expert opinion!
The reason I posted this was for clarification so that if someone was to purchase this from me, they would have an unbiased opinion of what it is and what it isn't.
Cody- thanks for your opinion on this, I like your viewpoint as well. Yes, obviously this is NOT a pristine closet queen 66 Emmons bolt-on...
My curiosity is how would a person just happen across a set of bolt-on necks, changers and keyheads that were in need of a cabinet, endplates, etc...?
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 13 Mar 2023 7:31 pm
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| Mike DiAlesandro wrote: |
| ...Would the pedal spacing indicate the year of the cabinet as well? ...looks to be 2 1/2" spacing... |
It's a clue but not anything definitive. 2-1/2" pedal and cross shaft spacing would be consistent with a later '70s guitar (and with the serial number), but narrow spacing is not uncommon on earlier guitars. I have an early '70s wood neck fatback here that belonged to the late Chris Ivey, that guitar has 9 wide pedals, spacing is 2-3/8". I presume that was done to allow the extra pedal to fit comfortably, I've seen this on other guitars. I also have an S10 fatback here that is the same age, wide pedals. Spacing on that one is 2-3/4", which is consistent with other older guitars I've seen. So, who knows...
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All lies and jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest - Paul Simon |
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Henry Matthews
From:
Texarkana, Ark USA
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Posted 15 Mar 2023 10:24 pm
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Something is strange. The serial number has a D after it which would make it a 70’s guitar. Metal neck bolt ons were discontinued in late 60’s. After that were all wood neck bolt ons. Was thinking serial was an invoice number until I saw the D.
Still a nice guitar though. Don’t think came from factory like that.
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Henry Matthews
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes. |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 17 Mar 2023 2:42 pm
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| Henry Matthews wrote: |
Something is strange. The serial number has a D after it which would make it a 70’s guitar. Metal neck bolt ons were discontinued in late 60’s. After that were all wood neck bolt ons. Was thinking serial was an invoice number until I saw the D.
Still a nice guitar though. Don’t think came from factory like that. |
Yes Henry, I can't figure out the details myself. The necks attach with 6-32 slotted screws, with 2 longer screws that go threw the endplate under the changer.
It's obvious it's been rebuilt. A lot of the collar set screws are longer than the factory ones, and the keyhead had a marker indicating it was the E9th one.
I pulled the E9th changer and neck to clean it up an possibly get more clues. Someone had jeweled the outside of the neck, so I wanted to wet sand and polish it back to a nice shine.
As you can see, the decal was replaced with a badge, a metal one actually. I am thinking the mica was replaced as well, it's in really nice shape for a near 60 year old guitar.
Here is a picture of the changer fingers, perhaps someone in the know might see something that indicates the era they were machined. I noticed a ledge on the one side of the lower fingers, is that common?
And a photo of the cabinet with the changer out of it....
And a photo of the changer being reassembled.
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Kelcey ONeil
From:
Sevierville, TN
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Posted 17 Mar 2023 6:52 pm
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Everything but the necks and a few bell cranks are from the mid/late 70's, it therefore would have came with the badge rather than a decal. It looks like someone simply swapped the original necks for the Bolt On necks, it is most certainly not an original 1960s Bolt On. There were more than a few Bolt Ons that the aprons bowed out so severely that the pedal shafts fell out, perhaps someone salvaged the parts from such a situation.
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Co-owner and operator: Emmons Guitar Co. |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 19 Mar 2023 4:30 am
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| Kelcey ONeil wrote: |
| Everything but the necks and a few bell cranks are from the mid/late 70's, it therefore would have came with the badge rather than a decal. It looks like someone simply swapped the original necks for the Bolt On necks, it is most certainly not an original 1960s Bolt On. There were more than a few Bolt Ons that the aprons bowed out so severely that the pedal shafts fell out, perhaps someone salvaged the parts from such a situation. |
Thanks Kelcey. Do you think the changer and mounting pillows are original bolt-on parts, and what differences if any would there have been in the changer specs from a bolt-on to a cut-tail?
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Kelcey ONeil
From:
Sevierville, TN
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Posted 22 Mar 2023 6:44 am
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Mike,
I would say the changer mounts are original to the necks, the changer fingers themselves haven't changed since 1964, so the finger would work with either one.
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Co-owner and operator: Emmons Guitar Co. |
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Mike DiAlesandro
From:
Kent, Ohio
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Posted 22 Mar 2023 7:03 am
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| Kelcey ONeil wrote: |
Mike,
I would say the changer mounts are original to the necks, the changer fingers themselves haven't changed since 1964, so the finger would work with either one. |
Thanks Kelcey, I appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge.
With all the orders Emmon's Guitar Co. is receiving, I bet you see compression springs, collars and Allen keys in your sleep!
Best of luck on the continued success of the Emmons Co.
Mike D |
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