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Topic: Lap steel |
Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 1:51 pm |
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Recently finished making this .. and just checking! If the harmonic is accurately over the 12th fret does that mean the bridge is in the right position, and scale length spot-on etc etc?
I know how to adjust for bridge positions on mandolins and Telecasters but not sure how to check on a lap steel!
I'm teaching myself to play & want to make certain my slide-positioning is accurate.
Thanks!
Last edited by Chris Tulloch on 26 Feb 2021 7:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 2:00 pm Re: Lap steel
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| Chris Tulloch wrote: |
If the harmonic is accurately over the 12th fret does that mean the bridge is in the right position, and scale length spot-on etc etc?
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No. That will only tell you that the fretboard is properly centered. But you don't know that it is the proper scale for the nut to saddle length. Also check the 24th fret harmonic and the 5th fret harmonic. If 12 lines up but the other ones don't, it is the wrong fretboard for the guitar. If they all line up, you are good to go. |
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Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 2:11 pm
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Thanks Jon - yes just checked .. 5th & 24th line up ok. Many thanks
Chris |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 2:22 pm
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| Great! |
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Jeff Highland
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 10:22 pm
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No need to check harmonics at any location, Just measure the distance from face of nut to 12th position marker and then from 12th to the break point on the saddle ( where the string leaves contact with the saddle) If these measurements are the same you are good to go, otherwise move the saddle position till they are.
Don't bother checking harmonics or barred notes they will not tell you anything with accuracy, just measure distances.
_________________
Duesenberg Fairytale
1949 Supro Supreme
1950 National New Yorker
2008 Highland Baritone Weissenborn
2020 Highland New Yorker.
2020 Highland Mohan Veena
2021 Highland Weissencone |
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David Matzenik
From:
Cairns, on the Coral Sea
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Posted 21 Feb 2021 10:55 pm
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| Jeff Highland wrote: |
No need to check harmonics at any location, Just measure the distance from face of nut to 12th position marker and then from 12th to the break point on the saddle ( where the string leaves contact with the saddle) If these measurements are the same you are good to go, otherwise move the saddle position till they are.
Don't bother checking harmonics or barred notes they will not tell you anything with accuracy, just measure distances. |
That's what I would say, also. It is interesting the frets can be slightly out, as with my early Rickenbacher, but it doesn't make any difference because steel guitar intonation is by ear.
_________________
Don't go in the water after lunch. You'll get a cramp and drown. - Mother. |
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Bill Groner
From:
QUAKERTOWN, PA
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 1:42 am
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That is one beautiful lap steel Chris. Congrats.
_________________
Currently own, 6 Groner-tone lap steels, one 1953 Alamo Lap steel, Roland Cube, Fender Champion 40 |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 4:22 am
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| Jeff Highland wrote: |
| No need to check harmonics at any location, Just measure the distance from face of nut to 12th position marker and then from 12th to the break point on the saddle ( |
If you have the wrong scaled fretboard for a given instrument, you can center the 12th fret perfectly and have a completely wrong situation. A very well known situation. |
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Joe Elk
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 5:11 am
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Nice looking steel!!! Quick question How do the controls work!
Joe Elk Central Ohio |
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Jeff Highland
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 11:21 am
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| Jon Light wrote: |
| Jeff Highland wrote: |
| No need to check harmonics at any location, Just measure the distance from face of nut to 12th position marker and then from 12th to the break point on the saddle ( |
If you have the wrong scaled fretboard for a given instrument, you can center the 12th fret perfectly and have a completely wrong situation. A very well known situation. |
But then there would be a gap at the nut.
Really not a common situation.
Measuring will tell you.....parallax error and the fact that you cannot see the contact point on the string under the bar and your hand, prevents using harmonics or barred notes from being an accurate method of checking intonation.
_________________
Duesenberg Fairytale
1949 Supro Supreme
1950 National New Yorker
2008 Highland Baritone Weissenborn
2020 Highland New Yorker.
2020 Highland Mohan Veena
2021 Highland Weissencone |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 3:57 pm
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Want to see how crazy you can get? My luthier, Ben Bonham, actually adjusts below and above 12th fret distances slightly to compensate for the fact that the tension is less in the middle and you are likely to press the string down a bit more there, making the note a bit sharp...like compensated tunings vs. straight-up, you can get pretty deep into it...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Jeff Highland
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 4:09 pm
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That's a beautiful instrument Steve
_________________
Duesenberg Fairytale
1949 Supro Supreme
1950 National New Yorker
2008 Highland Baritone Weissenborn
2020 Highland New Yorker.
2020 Highland Mohan Veena
2021 Highland Weissencone |
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Cliff Swanson
From:
Raleigh, NC
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 6:46 pm
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| That's a really nice looking guitar Chris. Did you build from plans, kit...do tell. |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 22 Feb 2021 6:48 pm
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Nicely reminiscent of the National New Yorker...one of the most beautifully iconic of all lap steels...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Jeff Highland
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 23 Feb 2021 11:47 am
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As for "set-up" Chris, probably the most important thing is cutting the nut slot depth so that the tops of the strings are in one plane. This really makes a difference to playability.
_________________
Duesenberg Fairytale
1949 Supro Supreme
1950 National New Yorker
2008 Highland Baritone Weissenborn
2020 Highland New Yorker.
2020 Highland Mohan Veena
2021 Highland Weissencone |
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Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 6:27 am
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Oops! Just read all your helpful replies .. sorry, somehow your answers hadn't trickled through to me! (in order) Thanks Jeff & David .. I’ve been playing it & it all seems OK, thanks. Re: the positioning of the frets, I got a friend to CNC cut the slots in the perspex for the frets. And re: string heights, that’s one thing I noticed too & while slackening the strings to fit the (finished) fretboard I tweaked the slot depths so they’re much better.
Thanks for your help & advice.
Chris |
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Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 6:27 am
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| Bill Groner wrote: |
| That is one beautiful lap steel Chris. Congrats. |
Thanks Bill |
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Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 6:33 am
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| Joe Elk wrote: |
Nice looking steel!!! Quick question How do the controls work!
Joe Elk Central Ohio |
The knob near the bridge is tone .. using a 1 meg pot which really gives that "boo-wah!" sound. The other knobs are volume and mix ... the mixer knob (should) allow turning one pickup as single coil into a humbucker using both pickups; however it doesn't work as impressively as I'd hoped. I probably need to dig in & check the wiring, but as it's the first time I've ever soldered up a guitar it's a bit crude in there & as it "works" I'm loth to upset things!! Maybe one day. It sounds sweet on both p/u's anyway.
Thanks
Chris |
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Chris Tulloch
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 6:39 am
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| Cliff Swanson wrote: |
| That's a really nice looking guitar Chris. Did you build from plans, kit...do tell. |
Thanks Cliff. No plans (well, my own) based, as you have guessed, on a New Yorker. I HAD planned to make a copy of a Gibson EH 100, but the lump of Ash I found was too narrow. I made everything apart from the tuners (cheap - will replace one day) and the Chinese fender-style bridge plate, and 2 Carvin AP-11s I'd had hanging around. The rest was one huge learning curve!
The black & white body is pickguard material, cut by router & guides. I cut the square aluminium plate the same way. The fretboard is 3mm perspex (a friend CNC'd the slots) with styrene strip for frets. The bridge is just a bit of ally rod I had from somewhere, tapped.
Thanks everyone for your interest!
Chris |
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