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Topic: Terrible sound while sliding |
Frans van Winkel
From:
Netherlands
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Posted 17 Oct 2020 4:35 am |
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Hi everyone,
while practising my first lesson on lapsteel (C6) it seems to me that the 2nd, 3th and 4th string (thin to thick), don't sound good if I put my tonebar over the neck and mute the strings with the rest of my hand.
Only with the tonebar, without muting, it's kind of acceptable.
If I look from above over the neck, these strings, at least two of them, seem to lay a little lower then the rest.
I have a Fender Champ.
There are no screws or whatever to turn on (I believe).
Is this resolvable?
Earlier I had the lapsteel disassembled and put it all together again.
Thanx so far,
Frans |
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Allan Revich
From:
Victoria, BC
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Posted 17 Oct 2020 9:03 am Re: Terrible sound while sliding
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| Frans van Winkel wrote: |
Hi everyone,
while practising my first lesson on lapsteel (C6) it seems to me that the 2nd, 3th and 4th string (thin to thick), don't sound good if I put my tonebar over the neck and mute the strings with the rest of my hand.
Only with the tonebar, without muting, it's kind of acceptable.
If I look from above over the neck, these strings, at least two of them, seem to lay a little lower then the rest.
I have a Fender Champ.
There are no screws or whatever to turn on (I believe).
Is this resolvable?
Earlier I had the lapsteel disassembled and put it all together again.
Thanx so far,
Frans |
Hi Frans, yes it is resolvable.
The first thing you want to look at is technique. Are you putting enough pressure on the bar? The best way to know if it’s you or the guitar is to ask an experienced player to try your instrument.
Next option is to change the strings so that you have a nice, even, decrease in string gauge. Avoid instances where there is a “bridge†formed by the steel where one or two strings don’t come near the bar when it’s laid flat over the strings.
Last option is either correct or replace the nut.
The Fender Champ is a nice old lap steel, so don’t get discouraged! It will work out fine.
_________________
Current Tunings:
6 String | G – G B D G B D
7 String | G6 – e G B D G B D (re-entrant)
https://papadafoe.com/lap-steel-tuning-database |
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Frans van Winkel
From:
Netherlands
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 3:32 am
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Thank you, Allen.
I realy didn't know one has to press the bar for a good sound, that's to say, I always thought that, laying the tonebar over the 6 strings without pressing, there should be a clear tone with all 6 strings.
In that case I think my bar is too light and I have to order a heavier one.
The strings should be okay; La Bella Hawaii lap steel C6 tuning.
I don't realy understand your: 'Avoid instances where there is a "bridge" formed by the steel where one or two strings don't come near the bar when it's laid flat over the strings'.
In my opinion, when two strings don't come near the bar when the bar is laid over the strings, these strings are laying to low, or not?
That's what I ment in the beginning with my question:
Bar flat over strings and while muting with 3 fingers, 2 or 3 strings sound awful and my conclusion: these strings are laying to low.
So maybe my pressure is not strong enough?
Frans |
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 6:01 am
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| Frans van Winkel wrote: |
Bar flat over strings and while muting with 3 fingers, 2 or 3 strings sound awful and my conclusion: these strings are laying to low.
So maybe my pressure is not strong enough? |
The tops of the strings need to be perfectly level where they break over the nut. Possible solutions:
1) Heavier string gauges on the strings that sit too low.
2) A heavier tone bar or applying heavier pressure.
3) Leveling nut slots so all strings are on the same plane.
What are the gauges on your individual strings? A Champ has a 22.5" scale. A string set intended for use on a longer scale instrument could cause problems. On my 22.5" scale instruments tuned to C6, I generally install these string gauges :
E: .017
C: .020
A: .024p
G: .026w
E: .030
C: .038 |
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Bill Groner
From:
QUAKERTOWN, PA
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 6:08 am
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| Jack Hanson wrote: |
| Frans van Winkel wrote: |
Bar flat over strings and while muting with 3 fingers, 2 or 3 strings sound awful and my conclusion: these strings are laying to low.
So maybe my pressure is not strong enough? |
The tops of the strings need to be perfectly level where they break over the nut. Possible solutions:
1) Heavier string gauges on the strings that sit too low.
2) A heavier tone bar or applying heavier pressure.
3) Leveling nut slots so all strings are on the same plane.
What are the gauges on your individual strings? A Champ has a 22.5" scale. A string set intended for use on a longer scale instrument could cause problems. On my 22.5" scale instruments tuned to C6, I generally install these string gauges :
E: .017
C: .020
A: .024p
G: .026w
E: .030
C: .038 |
You sound like you are pretty new Frans.
P = plain
W = wound
I remember when I first came on the forum, P & W didn't make sense. Lots to learn.
_________________
Currently own, 6 Groner-tone lap steels, one 1953 Alamo Lap steel, Roland Cube, Fender Champion 40 |
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Frans van Winkel
From:
Netherlands
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 10:07 am
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I saw a video of Troy Brenningmeier and he adviced GHS 0.15-0.17-0.22-0.26-DY30-DY36.
Searched for it here but couldn't find it.
Now I have the La Bella's: 0.15-0.17-0.20-0.24p-0.28w-0.32.
Not a big deal, I suppose.
I think I have to press a bit harder on the bar and, at the same time, not press to hard on the muted strings, just lay my fingers on them, because otherwise they won't touch the bar.
Thanx again Jack. |
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Frans van Winkel
From:
Netherlands
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 10:09 am
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| Thanx again, Bill |
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Allan Revich
From:
Victoria, BC
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 10:09 am
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Generally, you will need some pressure on the bar, but very little. Too much and you’ll be bending every note sharp, and you’ll struggle to play in tune.
Hopefully, a new set of C6 strings will solve 90% of the problem, and the rest will sort themselves out with a bit of practice.
_________________
Current Tunings:
6 String | G – G B D G B D
7 String | G6 – e G B D G B D (re-entrant)
https://papadafoe.com/lap-steel-tuning-database |
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JB Bobbitt
From:
California, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2020 12:53 pm
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Will a set of strings for open G or D tuning, e.g.:
16-18-28-35-45-56,
have this problem if strung over a straight metal rod, without grooves or other compensation for string height at the nut?
Thanks a heap,
-jbb
_________________
"Time is an enemy"
-Bob Dylan |
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