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Topic: Volume pedal height |
Jeremy Threlfall
From:
now in Western Australia
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 2:32 am |
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I have always used an Ernie Ball volume pedal, despite them looking quite tall. On a mission for a bit more space under the guitar, I recently considered going to a Goodrich 120. Imagine my surprise, then, when I discover the EB is 2 5/16" tall and the 120 is 2 3/4! I would have to go to an L-120 to get something shorter. And at 2 1/4, it's not saving much space. I think I'll just stick with the EB, it's a good feelin' solid pedal.
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Jeremy Threlfall
From:
now in Western Australia
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 2:43 am
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My Carter VP is only 1 13/16" tall, but despite recently changing out the shoulder bushings on it, it's still a bit wobbly along its axle, so it's not in the good books. Besides, the EB has 1 5/8 travel, a full inch more than the carter, which makes for a better feeling pedal (or maybe just what I'm used to).
I'm interested to know people's preference for height/travel
(I'm measuring 'travel' as the vertical movement of the rear edge of the pedal)
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 3:20 am
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while height is a factor it's more important to practice and play with the V Pedal at the same height all the time.
Early students should use a piece of 2x4 on the floor instead of the V Pedal, it gets you to keep your right foot firmly planted and not using it like a Gas Pedal.
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 4:55 am
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| If you are using the Ernie Ball with a pedal steel, you would be well advised to insure that you are using a 500k pot as the typical 25-250 k pots in them will defeat the highs. Also, because of the pivot point between the top and the bottom, the majority of the time your foot is in a substantial toe-up position and a number of players find this to be uncomfortable. I suppose it is all about what you get used to. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 5:01 am
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I'm 5'8". I prefer the "standard" height pedals. I have a Hilton and an older Goodrich 120 (that has an original Allen Bradley pot in it). I bought a Goodrich L10K but never liked the feel of that and sold it.
The Ernie Ball's are made for a guitar player that stands up, not for a steeler that is sitting down. Hilton even makes a model for those that stand up. |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 5:16 am
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Of course Jack's info is correct concerning the design, but whatever works for you. I have a couple Goodrich pedals and an old Ernie pedal that I use a lot. Sometimes I like the longer volume taper with the EB better than the Goodrich. I find it smoother to find my volume level doing back and forth two-footing on the C neck.
The longer travel is a hindrance for some players, especially underneath the guitar for very tall people, but I'm not so it works fine for me.
When I started playing in the late 70's everybody said the EB was no good for pedal steel and I had to have a Goodrich so I do.
If the Ernie Ball is working for you, that's all that matters. |
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Jeremy Threlfall
From:
now in Western Australia
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 6:08 am
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I think it's the "toe-up" feeling I've gotten used to, and prefer - and I can feel the EB has a long taper. I've got two of them, both with 500/470 K pots in them
I'm happy to learn the EB is the same height more or less than the L-120
And that anything lower than that just doesn't feel right/normal to me
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Last edited by Jeremy Threlfall on 26 Jun 2016 8:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 6:37 am
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| Tony Prior wrote: |
while height is a factor it's more important to practice and play with the V Pedal at the same height all the time.
Early students should use a piece of 2x4 on the floor instead of the V Pedal, it gets you to keep your right foot firmly planted and not using it like a Gas Pedal. |
I used the 2x4 method when I was just starting. I was switching from drums to PSG, and my foot wanted to keep going up and down, like I was playing a bass drum. It worked.
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Pat Chong
From:
New Mexico, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 7:03 am
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There is a difference with EB volume pedals, though, and that is where the pivot point is.
When the pivot point is farther back, (like on the Hilton) then the action is like a gas pedal in the car. With the pivot point more central on the EB, your knee goes up and down with the operation and alters where your knee hits the levers. It may hinder the operation, it may not.
Just a thought..........................Pat |
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Jeremy Threlfall
From:
now in Western Australia
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 7:28 am
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That's true, Pat. Your leg ends up in the same position at full throttle, but moves more from the ankle or knee depending on the pivot.
I am now motivated to take some measurements do some geometry and work out the relative movements involved in operating my EB and Carter pedals, just for fun. And to show probably how little it actually matters. I play with my Es on the right, so I'm used to those levers sliding along my leg sometimes as I shift the volume pedal anyway
I'll get to that one day ...
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 10:57 am
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Then, do you really need to be working the volume pedal all the time? (NO).
I did an entire CD project for a singer about 15 years ago. I used the volume pedal to set the level and never touched it again through out the entire recording sessions. |
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Dave Dube
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 5:02 pm
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Well there is more than one way to do most things, just as every teacher should know there is more than one learning style. For those of you who learned by putting your foot on a block of wood, more power to you. To me the old block of wood is another piece of dogma like "It's all in the hands." These ideas fit with some ways of thinking, but they are not absolutely true.
I followed the advice to hold that pedal still and quite frankly, it held me back from sounding the way I wanted to for quite some time. Then I started paying attention to what I saw and heard. The following link demonstrates some fine picking. Watch the right foot. If you watch enough players, this is a common sight. Watch and listen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT1TvjnlYHM
The folks on this thread seem to approve: http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=302991
Now I will be the first to admit that Jack and Richard are probably a hundred (or two) times better than I can ever hope to be, and I am not even remotely suggesting that anything they did or do is wrong. Obviously the path they came by delivered results for them, and that is all that matters. Jack is right when he points out that you don't always need to be working the pedal, but you do need to know how to use one.
On my path I came to the steel from acoustic bluegrass. A volume pedal was not part of my rig or experience before. For me, the longer I put off moving the pedal, the longer I failed to develop an appreciation of all that it could do. Oh, I could hear it on recordings, but I just had no clue how it was being done until I found it while playing with the pedal. When I started to use the thing, I learned pretty quickly that I did not want it to be a vibrato, LOL. That said, though, listening and watching and then spending time using the pedal and honing technique may put you further ahead than putting it off. It depends, though. To be fair, you can't expect to learn everything at once I suppose. So I guess you have to choose what is important to you. The nice thing about the VP lesson is that you can learn to use one on any entry level guitar. For me the VP was probably one of the most important lessons I learned in that it delivered the biggest improvement in my playing and enjoyment. My mileage varied. Yours may too.
Caveat: I have seen it written on the forum by some, that unqualified people should not post opinions. While I doubt that anyone on this particular thread has said those things, let me just clarify my qualifications in case some future reader may object.
I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL PLAYER. I have owned and played many steel guitars over the the past 25 years. I have ears and eyes and know how to use them and my critical thinking ability has been demonstrated to be functional and useful throughout my career. My intelligence has been independently confirmed and documented by a number of organizations and was not found to be deficient. If someone prefers to give credence to an idea because of the person it belongs to (or some combination of personal attributes) rather than judging the idea on its merits, then please step to the left, as the line for the emperor's new guitar starts there.  |
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Dave Dube
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Posted 26 Jun 2016 5:21 pm
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Actually, if you use a buffer in front of the VP you probably don't need to worry about losing high frequencies. So a cheap buffer ($30-40 on ebay, for instance) can make an inexpensive pedal workable and far more cost effective than some of the other options out there.
Check this link from last year. Brad Sarno and Georg Sortun made some good comments. Bear in mind though the other thing that is important is the pot taper but since Jeremy is comfortable with what he has, that is not an issue. I think the EB JRs have two tapers with choice controlled by a DIP switch.
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=287432&highlight=250k+pot+buffer |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 27 Jun 2016 8:22 pm Volume pedal height
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| There is many ways to adjust a volume pedal to fit your foot. First is the amount of movement it takes to turn the pot from low to high which is usually app. 320 degrees of travel. The larger the pulley used on the pot shaft, The longer the pedal travel. The real short travel VP's have a ring with set screw that goes on the pot shaft to attach the string. The string actually runs on the bare pot shaft. Then the low and high stops can be changed to give you comfort with your ankle position. Good Luck and Happy Steelin. |
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Jeremy Threlfall
From:
now in Western Australia
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