Dmi7b5 G7#5 Cmi7 in E9 tuning

John Goux · From: California, USA

Howdy folks.

I'd like to see examples of how you would play these 2 chord progressions in the E9 tuning.

Dmi7b5 G7(nat 5 or #5) to Cmi7.

Dmi7 G7 Cmaj7

These are 2 5 1 progressions, in minor and major keys. Very common progressions in jazz and pop songs.
Like...Autumn Leaves, Stella By Starlight, Black Orpheus, Blue Bossa, minor blues progressions.

I'd really like to play chords though these kind of songs, if not solo. If you play straight triads, it sounds pretty square.

It seems like there should be 4 inversions of each of these chords, one for each chord tone to be in the top voice.

I'd like to create some exercises to play these chords, and connect them with voice leading in a musical way.

I realize this is not stock and trade E9 stuff. I know the architects of the E9 tuning used both necks on their guitars, and probably moved to C6 to play these kinds of songs. But it must be in the E9 tuning as well.

I imagine there are a bunch of you who can do this really well, in E9.

Thanks in advance.
John

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

IIRC, Dm7b5 is also Fm6. When playing with others, I'd let them cover the D, and lay the Fm over it. 4th or 16th fret with A pedal or 9th fret with lowered EsEs.
Do you lower your Bs?
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Jonathan Lam · From: Brooklyn, NY

Its important to realize the root is probably the LEAST important note in the chord. especially in the range that pedal steel covers, use that to your advantage.

For example, F min 6 on the 11th fret, with AB depressed and E lowered
could express
Dmin7b5
Bb13
E7 altered
etc...
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Mike Neer · From: NJ

I guess you are probably looking for actual positions to play this in, but it would do you a lot of good and anyone who wants to play this music to study jazz harmony and listen to as many recordings of these tunes as you can. There are a lot of substitutions that players use in cases like this to make things more interesting.

For example, one bar of each of Dmin7b5 to G7 to Cmin7 would be a bit mundane, since those chords contain many of the same tones. One thing you can do, like was said above, is to make the following substitutions:

Fmin6 - Abmin6 - Cmin6 (you could play the melodic minor scale of each chord for a nice sound)

or

Since a tritone substitution does not have to be the same chord quality as the chord you are subbing for, Ab7 can substitute for Dmin7b5. Ab7 - G7 - Cmin7 is very common. Throw a iim7 chord in front of each of those dominants, and you'll get:

Ebmin7 - Ab7 - Dmin7 - G7 - Cmin7 (each ii-V gets one bar)

Further tritone substitution:

Ebmin7 - Ab7 - Abmin7 - Db7 - Cmin7

It's so much fun to play around with this stuff. Some works, some doesn't. There are tons more. Listen to the greats.

PS: don't forget to tell the bass player!
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Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

The Dm7b5 is an F minor with a D in the bass, so if you're playing with a bass player, you could just play an F minor chord and let the bass play the D note.
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John Goux · From: California, USA

I'm going to post some examples of my own. J

Jim Robbins · From: Ontario, Canada

I like the sound of sliding a ii half dim up three frets to become 7th, b9, 3rd & b13 of the V chord. Perhaps because it is so easy.

A&B pedals down, lower E to D#/Eb gives you a half dim with root on the 8th string using the 7th / 1st string for the 3rd. Some of the pedal / KL moves around that voicing work for passing tones or other partials. B pedal gives 4th to b5th on the half dim, #9 or b3 - 3 on the V. 7th string whole tone raise gives 3rd to 4th on half dim. A pedal moves not so useful although if you half pedal down or use the B-Bb lever you can get 6-7 over the half dim & 5- b13 over the V.

Tim Herman · From: Alberta, Canada

I have a standard Emmons setup on my left leg.
I lower my 6th string a half step with RKL. Strings 4,5,6,8 and 10 with A pedal down, plus LKL (raising 4th and 8th), plus the 6 lowered a half step give me a Dm7b5 at the 7th fret.
Notes from low to high are G#, C, D, G#, C.
Then G7 at 8th fret, same strings.
Cm at 8 with 6th string lowered half step by RKL.

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

I'm trying the tablature feature in MuseScore, and so far it's pretty easy to use, except that I have to move the slurs around one at a time to show which notes are held/bent and which are re-attacked.
Also I haven't found a way to put any text besides fret numbers on the tab staff. So where you might put 8A or 8## (which I like better) I can only put 8, and indicate pedals where the lyrics would go.

Also I haven't figured out yet how to show the tuning at the left edge of the tab staff. It is basic 12 string ext E9.

Your most basic 2-5-1 in C major

On my tuning I have a lever to lower string 7 a half step and whole step so I don't have to re-attack the low C, and can even play a G7-5 on the way:

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Your basic 2-5-1 in C minor, omitting the D for simplicity:

Alternative, adding the D on the bottom:

Often you play 2 5 without going to the 1. And just the 2 voices that move are often enough to convey the 2 - 5:

which is one of many places to play it. Anywhere that you have a major 3rd interval will do.

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

half pedal A makes a nice flat 5 on the d minor:

And the same notes on the same strings are easier one fret higher if you have a lever to lower string 7:

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

More 2..5 in C minor, this time at or near fret 3

The trouble with this one is bad temperament on the A flat. The F lever is tempered to give G#, which is much too low for a good sounding A flat in this progression unless it goes by real quick. Instead of the F lever on string 8, I would lower string 7 a half step for the A flat. I can wiggle that around its half stop for a pretty chord sound.

Better yet may be to play the D half dim at fret 4, lowering strings 5 and 9. You can still slide down to the G7 without re-attacking:

but you lose the ability to play a high G note over both chords, which may be important melodically.

There are plenty more ways to play 2..5 (1) but for now back to learning more about MuseScore to see if it can do better tab for pedal steel.

John Goux · From: California, USA

Thanks Earnest! Those play nice. I'd never though of some of those inversions.
Obviously you are tweaking the notation program and know that string numbers and pedals next to the fret number make it easier to read the tab.
John

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

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