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Topic: Which C6 pulls are most important |
John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 2 Jul 2009 3:29 pm |
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C6 neck with 2 pedals and 1 lever (RKL)...
Which pulls would you choose?
I've been playing my back neck non-pedal with this tuning:
G
E
C
A
G
E
C
Bb
A
F or G
Any ideas appreciated...
J A
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 3 Jul 2009 8:56 am
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| Tab: |
1 2 RKL
D
E...........F
C..................B
A
G.....F#
E...........D#
C
A
F.....F#
C.....D
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Of course if you are dead set on that open tuning you listed, I would change pedal 1 to lower the 6th string G to F#, and on string 10 (either F or G - I would use an F) and take that string to F#. String 1 to G#. Pedal 2 and knee lever I would leave as I listed. Of course, you didn't list what type of music. I'm assuming typical western swing, rock, etc that we use that neck for now. For straight country, I would set the pedal changes differently.
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Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 55 years and still counting. |
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 6 Jul 2009 9:27 pm
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If I was limited to 2-p's & 1-k, I think I'd set it up like this:
| Tab: |
C6–––P-1–––P-2–––K––––
G––––G#–––––––––––––––
E–––––––––––F–––––––––
C––––––––––––––––D––––
A––––––––––––––––B––––
G––––F#–––––––––––––––
E–––––––––––Eb––––––––
C–––––––––––––––––––––
A–––––––––––––––––––––
F––––F#–––––––––––––––
C––––D–––––––––––––––– |
Pedal #1 & the KL gives you a D13 Chord and Pedal #2 & the KL gives you a G7 Chord.
_________________
<marquee> Go~Daddy~Go, (No), Go, It's your Break Time</marquee> L8R, jb
My T-10 Remington Steelmaster
Last edited by John Bechtel on 6 Jul 2009 11:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Tony Glassman
From:
The Great Northwest
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Posted 6 Jul 2009 11:23 pm
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I'd choose to buy, trade or fabricate one more pedal!
I don't think I would live with anything less than the standard pedals 5,6 and 7 plus the 3rd string 1/2 step lower KL. |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 7:37 am
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| Tony Glassman wrote: |
I'd choose to buy, trade or fabricate one more pedal!
I don't think I would live with anything less than the standard pedals 5,6 and 7 plus the 3rd string 1/2 step lower KL. |
I've thought about giving up my C pedal on the E9 neck...I don't use it at all, but someday I suppose I might figure out what it's for. 
Seems like P5 and P6 are pretty standard and I just have to choose between the P7 and the 1/2 step lever.
One thing that I can do pretty easily is add a knee lever for the P7 - doesn't seem like that and the lower are used at the same time.
Since I'm pretty happy playing non-pedal C6, I don't want to make things too complicated, just add some notes in the right place to facilitate extended chords and different voicings.
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 8:41 am
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John; Oh, contrare! You can combine the P7-change and the KL (½-tone) Lower, but; you then also need to add a split/tuner rod to the KL, which is very simple to do! When you combine the two-changes, you have this:
| Tab: |
C6_____P7______KL_____P7+KL________
G______G_______G________G__________
E______E_______E________E__________
C_____[D]_____(B)_____([C#])_______
A_____[B]______A_______[B]_________
G______G_______G________G__________
E______E_______E________E__________
_____G6/Em7__C6+Maj.7__Em6_________ |
So, it would be “more practical” ‘not’ to have the P7 and the KL changes on the same knee! However, it would be practical to have both changes on knee-levers to get this D9-Tuning!
| Tab: |
C6_P__KL1__KL2_P+KL2_P+KL1__K1+K2__
G__G#__G____G____G#_____G#____G____
E__E___E____E____E______E_____E____
C__C__[D]__(B)__(B)____[D]__([C#])_
A__A__[B]___A____A_____[B]___[B]___
G__F#__G____G____F#_____F#____G____
E__E___E____E____E______E_____E____
C__C___C____C____C______C_____C____
A__A___A____A____A______A_____A____
F__F#__F____F____F#_____F#____F____
C__D___C____C____D______D_____C____ |
A lot with a little!
_________________
<marquee> Go~Daddy~Go, (No), Go, It's your Break Time</marquee> L8R, jb
My T-10 Remington Steelmaster |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 3:28 pm
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If I'm following, then, John, it would work to have P5 and P7 on pedals, P6 and the 1/2 step lower both on right knee levers...
I'll have to study up on the chart with all the combinations. There's a lot there.
Thanks for all the info.
_________________
John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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Tony Glassman
From:
The Great Northwest
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 5:45 pm
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I'd still rather add a pedal because:
1] Using pedals 5 and/or 6 with the 3rd string 1/2 tone drop is a must, so putting either pedal on a "same knee" lever is a sacrifice.
2] Pedal 7 is often flicked quickly (kinda like pedal A on the E neck) which is difficult to do with a lever. Also, pedal 7 combines nicely w/ the 3rd string knee lever for different reasons on all-pull or P/P guitars.
IMHO....At some point, not having this basic set-up will probably become frustrating if you're expecting to play most "mainstream" C6th pedal steel. |
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 5:58 pm
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No! You do not want P-6 and the 3rd str. ½-tone Lower changes on the same knee! To get all the usable combinations you need P-5, P-6, RK and LK. [Commonly referred to as (2-p & 2-k)] My personal-opinion is that you would want this copedent:
| Tab: |
C6__(LKR=P7)__P5_____P6_____RKL____
G_____________G#___________________
E____________________F_____________
C______D_____________________B_____
A______B________________or-(RKR)___
G_or-(LKL)____F#___________________
E____________________Eb____________
C__________________________________
A__________________________________
F_____________F#___________________
C_____________D____________________ |
_________________
<marquee> Go~Daddy~Go, (No), Go, It's your Break Time</marquee> L8R, jb
My T-10 Remington Steelmaster |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 7 Jul 2009 7:04 pm
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Okay...that makes sense, John.
It remains to be seen whether we can rig the proper split on this old changer using spare and fabricated parts, but it's worth a try.
Tony, as concerns playing mainstream C6 stuff, I don't know where I might end up. As I mentioned, I'm playing non-pedal now and I feel like I have a long way to go before I've gotten the most out of that. My goal in adding these pulls is to get some versatility within the limitations of my set up and not do something that's so goofy that it ruins any chance of playing and learning more on a standard C6 pedal someday.
I'll be off to Jim Flynn's shop tomorrow and I'll have a better idea of what we'll be able to do. Having a goal in mind is helpful and I do appreciate all the good advice.
J A
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 9 Jul 2009 6:53 am
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I got the steel over to Jim Flynn yesterday...he'll be able to get me fixed up.
The priority is to get the E9 changes moved around to more standard positions and then see what we can do with the C6. It looks like for now we'll go with the P5 and P6 and the RKR 1/2 tone lower. We'll see about adding the P7 sometime in the future.
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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