cross rod bars round to square conversion? Fendery P-up MSA?

Whit Krogh · From: Colorado

I would like to be more easily able to mess with different tunings and the round cross bars make that more time consuming. Is there any way I can change these to square, for ease of clipping and unclipping the pull rods? Also I would like to add some knee levers in the middle, or left knee c6 pedals position, of my msa classic. Where can I find these? Also I would like to get a brighter, more fendery pick up for my msa classic, what kind is this?. I thought I read about a set up where you can change the pick ups between songs how is this achieved? If these questions have been addressed please direct me to those discussions. Thanks for all this.

Jeremy Threlfall · From: now in Western Australia

I would have thought it would be cheaper to go out and buy a guitar with square shafts and the pickup you want.

It would certainly be cheaper to modify the round crossbars you have to enable you to fir the bellcranks you want, rather than replacing the whole shaft (like, grind 'em flat on two sides?)

I could be wrong

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

It could be done, but it would requite rebuilding the entire undercarriage and replacing all the cross rods and bell cranks, as well as finding a way to fit the square cross rods into the round holes designed to house the original rods.

You might be better off buying another guitar that already has square cross rods.
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Whit Krogh · From: Colorado

could i take the existing round rods to a machine shop and make smaller square rods with round ends? in other words square the center sections of the rods?

Bill Hatcher · From: Atlanta Ga. USA

Jim Palenscar · From: Oceanside, Calif, USA

Just about anything can be done that you can dream up, as has been said- it's just that there are times it's not financially practical. That being said, there are Delrin bushings that have a round O.D. with a square I.D. for such conversions and that would require all new cross-shafts and bell cranks. An alternative would be to get square cross-shafts, cut to length, and have the ends turned round on a lathe. If so - remember to leave enough room the the pedal rod connectors as well. New bellcranks would still be required. Remember to machine where the original stops are as well.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

With all the changes you want to make, it'd be far easier and cheaper to get a new(er) guitar with most of those features. If you machined the round cross rods to a square section, they be too weak and have too much flex in them.

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

It's quite simple. Get some square tube stock with the same inside measurement as the holes used currently on the guitar. Press in the correct sized dowel pins. They'll be lighter than a solid rod, and no machine shop required.

Scott Howard · From: Georgetown, TN, USA

I can send you some pics of my MSA that I changed to square crossrods. The main problem is the bushings for the body. I purchased a small mill and lathe to turn the rods down to fit the new bushings. I bought new bellcrancks from Fessenden.I retained the MSA pedal pullers by using a 5/16" Broach
( abought 80 bucks 4 years ago )and pressing it through the pedal puller. It doesn't leave it completely square but puts four nice nothes in the corners and has not given any problems.
It can be done if you have some mechanical skills , and tools but this is a major operation and after I started I was bound and determined to finish it. It plays great and now that is easier to change the setup, I leave it alone and can't remember the last time I changed something on it.
Would I do it again ? NO !!! If you do not have the tools and equipment to do it you will spend more it gearing up to do it than you could buy a used steel for. If you have to pay someone to do it you are going in the hole even worse.
I am not trying to dicourage you but just letting you know what you are in for. Scott

John McClung · From: Olympia WA, USA

Get a different guitar and be done with it, lots of time left to practice and play, my friend!

BTW: I've got a Carter with square rods, and a Mullen with hex rods, and I strongly prefer the hex rods, the connection is a lot tighter, and it's real hard to get bell cranks to stay put when tightening the set screw on my Carter.

Plus in all other ways the Mullen is just such a great axe!
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Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

John McClung · From: Olympia WA, USA

Charlie makes a good point, and having built-in extra bell cranks in places where you might want to add them is a good idea.

If your copedent is simple, then he's also right about minute timing, you can rotate a bell crank anywhere it needs to be to time perfectly with other pulls. And it's not all that hard to losing a couple of bell cranks, pull out the rod, and add the new crank.

I should know, I played MSA's for 28 years: first a D-10, then a D-12. But that D-12 was incredibly loaded with great changes, 10 pedals, 10 kl's, so it was getting really hard to make any changes without a lot of rod moving and occasional bell crank removal from a crossrod here and there.

Modifying my Mullen D-12, 9+10, is a snap by comparison.
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Whit Krogh · From: Colorado

Thanks for all the info. This sounds a bit more involved than I imagined. I think I may just add some extra bell cranks so i don't have to take the whole rod out if I need to change the pulls.

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