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Topic: Beginner Seeks Guidance (6 string electric) |
Mike Yacullo
From:
Jersey City, New Jersey, USA
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 12:48 pm |
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Hi everybody.
I've come into posession of a very cheap 6 string electric (Artisan EA-1). At the moment I've got it tuned like a Dobro (since I got my hands on a dobro video) but I'm a bit overwhelmed by all the tuning choices, and I'm hoping that you all can help me.
If I had to boil down the type of stuff I'd like to play to 3 artists (lap steel wise anyway), I'd say: Hank Williams, Neil Young, and Son Volt.
What tunings (and string gagues?) would be suggested for these types of sounds? I understand that there may be many different answers...
As far as instructional material goes, do the Cindy Cashdollar videos apply to 6 string? Some places on the net it says 6 or 8 string and some only say 8 string. I can't find the video locally to confirm. Are there other electric 6 string videos out there?
Thanks a lot for bearing with all these questions. Any help is appreciated!
Mike |
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Chris Walke
From:
St Charles, IL
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 3:34 pm
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The Cindy Cashdollar video is a valuable resource. She teaches basic bar and right hand technique and gives you a Hank Williams song to work on. She says in the beginning of the video that you can work on the material with a 6-string by leaving off the bottom 2 strings of the tuning. That's not the way most 6 string players tune c6, but it works for this material.
C6 is a versatile tuning and it's a great start. Another learning resource to consider is the book/cd set for C6 lapsteel (written for 6-string) by DeWitt Scott.
If you want to start out with the dobro tuning, you can try the Dobro edition of Fretboard Roadmaps (book & cd, for both dobro and lap steel), but there isn't much in the book about technique.
Out of all of these, I'd learn toward the Cindy Cashdollar video.
BTW - don't get your head in too much of a spin over tunings. There are a lot of options and you have plenty of time to explore once you get your feet wet. Most important thing to concentrate on now is bar and picking technique. If you can find a teacher in your area, that's the absolute best option to take. One-on-one instruction will teach you more than any video or book. [This message was edited by Chris Walke on 21 July 2004 at 04:39 PM.] [This message was edited by Chris Walke on 21 July 2004 at 04:40 PM.] |
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John Pelz
From:
Kettering, Ohio, USA
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 4:09 pm
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Hi Mike,
In addition to the Cashdollar vids, there is Jerry Byrd's Steel Guitar Seminar" video. Don't let the "Hawaiian Steel" part fool you -- this video covers the basics (and then some!), which really can be applied to any style.
Looking at some of these non-pedal string-sets will give you an idea of what gauges are appropriate for which tunings.
Also, this string-gauge chart from John Ely's site has been extremely helpful to me; you might want to check it out.
Like Chris says, though, try to not get overwhelmed by all the different tuning-choices. I'm a beginner myself, and have been using C6 exclusively so far. At this point, proper bar & picking technique is the thing to concentrate on; you can always experiment with different tunings later. And Chris is absolutely right: "One-on-one instruction will teach you more than any video or book." If at all possible, find a teacher.
There's also a ton of great information right here at the SGForum. Using the "search" function at the top right of this screen will allow you to mine all that good info. |
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Peter Jacobs
From:
Northern Virginia
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 5:08 pm
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Hi, Mike -- even thoug I've been at it for a few years, I still feel like a beginner. Since I'm a banjo player, I tuned to open G, and I find it's really versatile (look at what reso players like Jerry Douglas, Mike Auldridge, David Hamburger, and Rob Ickes can do with G-tuning, as well as bottleneck players like Bob Brozman). If you're doing, you may need to go to a heavier set than you would for C6.
Open E -- a lot of blues guys use this -- you need it to play Dust My Broom. It's actually got a lot of similarities to G. And of course, as you've already read, there are a lot of proponents of C6, although I've never tried it.
Like the others said, start somewhere and work on bar technique and picking. I started with G because it's familiar, now I find I can make a lot of sounds that fit the music I'm playing (I play in an Americana band), so I'm sticking with it.
It would be so much easier if these things had frets...
Stay with it and have fun!
Peter |
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Charlie Campney
From:
The Villages, FL
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 6:44 pm
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Hi Mike ! ! I'm in the same situation as you are. The number of tunings out there is very confusing. I have tuned to a dobro tuning for the time being if for no other reason than that I have found a lot of tabs for that tuning. Presently I am just practicing scales and getting familiar with the bar and picks. And I am also working on some of the lessons on the Folk of The Woods site, here: www.folkofthewood.com
They have some pretty good information there for a beginning dobro player.
Good Luck ! ! |
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Travis Bernhardt
From:
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
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Posted 21 Jul 2004 10:57 pm
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Just another vote for "find someone who can show you."
-Travis |
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Donald Ruetenik
From:
Pleasant Hill, California, USA
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Mike Yacullo
From:
Jersey City, New Jersey, USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 5:19 am
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Thanks for the warm welcome all.
This advice is just what I needed, I really appreciate it. |
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 5:20 am
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Mike - Welcome to the Forum. Good advice from all of the above posters. I just wanted to add that in regards to your musical preferences, your lap steel is perfect for the Hank Williams stuff, and that's a great place to start (C6 recommended - use John's link to order a set of properly guaged strings).
The steel you hear on the Neil Young records, however, is pedal steel and most of it beyond the scope of your 6 string lap steel. Not sure about Son Volt. The alt-country guys use pedal steel, and also sometimes lap steel (often with distortion) for more of a slide guitar effect. Enjoy your steel guitar! |
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Gary C. Dygert
From:
Frankfort, NY, USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 5:33 am
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If you already play standard guitar, one of the E tunings lays out nicely from that. As others have mentioned, pick a tuning and learn the heck out of it. Then experiment later. And find somebody who plays and will show you some stuff.
------------------
No-name lap steel and reso in E6 and E7
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Bill Leff
From:
Santa Cruz, CA, USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 5:46 am
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And pick up a copy of our own Andy Volk's book on lap steel guitar. It's not an instruction book per se, more of a reference, and a very fun read if you are interested in all aspects of the instrument.
You can buy one directly from Andy. Check
out the link here:
http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum18/HTML/000088.html
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 5:52 am
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Take a look at the following:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
E E E E E E E E E
B B C# C# C# C# C# C C
G G# G# A A A A A A
D D D E E F# F# G G
A B B A C# E D# E E
E E E E A A B C C#
If you will look at the way each tuning evolves from left to right, it may take much of the mystery out of tunings. In all likelyhood, the evolution of the Hawaiian guitar started when Joseph Kekuku in the late 1800's dropped a railroad spike down his spanish Guitar and it slid down the strings. Now follow along:
(from above)
0. Standard Spanish guitar tuning.
1. E7th
2. C#minor (E13th)
3. A (low bass)
4. A (hi bass)
5. A6 (F#min7)
6. B11
7. C6 (Amin7)
8. A7/C6
Now let's analyze it in more depth. The first one is obvious. When the Portugese (spanish) introduced the Hawaiians to their instrument, they of course tuned it the same.
However, when Joseph Kekuku used a steel bar, it was only natural that the newly created "Hawaiian Guitar" be tuned to a chord. Thus the most obvious one was E7th. I rather imagine this is what he did.
In 2, you have the first time, the basic spanish guitar tuning was messed with, in all likelyhood. That then started the experimenting.
Look at 3 and 4. And think about the IV chord in the key of E. Hmmmmm? And look closely at the probable evolution. The only difference is the 2 bass strings.
Remember the earliest playing of the Hawaiian guitar, was played very much like a melody player on the Spanish guitar, where the rythm was thumb picking the bass strings and the melody was of course picking the treble strings with the fingers.
The low bass mostly likely was a result of that. Hi bass simply was the next step towards all melody, I imagine.
From here, things began to evolve quickly, with more and more Hawaiian players (and now non-Hawaiians also) joining the fray. And it has not stopped yet. It is said there is over 100 different tunings. I have only listed 8.
I call attention to E13, A6 and C6. There is little doubt that these 3 were and are by far the most popular. However Dobro did drop it down to G major or other similar tunings.
And many variations have come along, especially with the advent of more strings; and of course the pedal steel guitar has blown it wide open.
But if you look at them, and study them, they ALL have one basic goal. And that is to permit a straight bar to compete with other musical instruments that are not limited in its ability to create intervals and/or chords.
May Jesus bless you in your endeavors into the world of steel guitar,
carl[This message was edited by C Dixon on 22 July 2004 at 06:59 AM.] |
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Gary C. Dygert
From:
Frankfort, NY, USA
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Posted 22 Jul 2004 9:13 am
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| Carl, great post! |
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