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Topic: Ever heard of the "Russian Dragon"? |
Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:07 am |
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What a great name for a product that speeds up or slows down music files! But I can't find it on the web. Anybody know about it?
J'beaux |
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Jerry Erickson
From:
Atlanta,IL 61723
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:14 am
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| I don't know about the software, but there used to be a rackmount box that was used in the studio to compare say a click track to a real live tempo. It's been a while..... |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:17 am
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Oh, I'm aware of several products that do these functions, but I'm particularly curious about the Russian Dragon, just cuz I like the name so much!  |
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Michael Johnstone
From:
Sylmar,Ca. USA
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:19 am
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| That's right - all it did was a comparison between a fixed tempo and live music and then showed the discrepencies on a graph so you you could tell the drummer with impunity if he was "russian" or "dragon". There are much better tools for those kinds of problems these days - like "Beat Detective". -MJ- |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:21 am
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Ah, okay, I see now. Thanks, guyz.
jc |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:21 am
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I believe it was distributed by Replay Technologies inc. and the original website, www.russiandragon.com in no longer accessible by the DNS. Harmony Central has the same link above to it and it is also dead. Here is a link to Replay, click here , that has what may be the same software. I have used similar programs that were freeware/shareware and the results were just phenomenal. I was able to slow down some very fast licks done by steel without changing the pitch or relative timing one iota and still get every note crystal clear. Unfortunately after learning how the lick is played, I can only play it at half speed myself! These are great tools.
Greg
Greg's Web Page
MSA/Steel King Sounds |
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Dave Van Allen
From:
Souderton, PA , US , Earth
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:27 am
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Jim- here's what I found- it was a device specifically to aline sequential MIDI stream data
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| So what do we do about these millisecond differences? And how can we possibly guarantee that two MIDI notes will occur at the exact same time? Here's the product pitch: a tool that sent me scurrying to find all the faults with my own production studio.?Jeanius, a company in San Antonio, has provided the recording world with a tool to simplify the judgment and analysis of all these time errors. It is called the Russian Dragon (RD-R and RD-T), named for its ability to accurately perceive if your audio is "rushin'" ahead or "draggin'" behind a reference source you supply. The idea for the unit came from Audio Engineer/Designer Marius Perron and his drumming brother, who had always wished they had a mechanism to judge how closely he was playing to the sequenced tracks. Marius made the prototype to remove both guesswork from the sessions and tension from not knowing who was right. The unit gave honest feedback to the drummer, the engineer, and the producer. Description: The Anatomy of the Russian Dragon?The Russian Dragon is available in a small rack-mount version (the RD-R) and a less expensive tabletop version (RD-T). I opted for the rack-mount model.?The RD-R is an uncomplicated single-space rack-mount unit with 1/4-inch inputs on the back and the front. The top input (channel 1) is used for the reference and the bottom input (channel 2) is used for the other audio event you will judge to be dragging (slow), rushing (fast), or dead on (what Jeanius calls "snake eyes") relative to the reference. The unit features an input level control and four LEDs for visual confirmation of audio and amplitude adjustment. A large row of 25 colored LEDs indicates the timing differences from a tenth of a millisecond to 99 milliseconds. The LEDs are adjustable in 1-9 millisecond increments as set by a selector knob marked "ms per LED." A trigger LED indicates the presence and duration of the two signals. The duration is adjustable by a "Mask Control." By increasing the length of the Mask Control, you can eliminate accidental re-triggering of the timing LEDs. This allows the unit to ignore delay characteristics or extraneous sounds that would make analysis difficult. |
I think they are specific Hardware solution to a MIDI problem.
Great Name though, you are right about that....
there's a Band called Russian Dragon Band too, aparently have a myspace page
the Amazing Slowdowner is a fine package for manipulating sound files to speed up or slow down without changing pitch, good for learning those rapid flurries of notes off of old recordings (or new ones )[This message was edited by Dave Van Allen on 21 June 2006 at 11:30 AM.] |
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Joey Ace
From:
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 10:27 am
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I once saw one sell on eBay for around $200.
It looks like outdated technology, but the name is way cool!
Here's an article from 1994: http://www.notable.com/index.php?page=about [This message was edited by Joey Ace on 21 June 2006 at 11:29 AM.] |
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Dean Parks
From:
Sherman Oaks, California, USA
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Posted 23 Jun 2006 7:56 am
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Those were used in aligning various click/MIDI synth/drum machine sources, as I recall. Now you can just look on the digital file and slide whatever wherever.
-dean- |
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John Macy
From:
Rockport TX/Denver CO
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Posted 23 Jun 2006 1:16 pm
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I am looking at mine right now, though it's been a while since I used it. It was really great when replacing drum sounds with a sampling delay like an AMS--you took the orginal snare hit off the sync head on the analog machine, and lined the sample up with the RussianDragon. Like Dean said, it's all visual now, and a lot easier...
Still looks good in the rack, though... |
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Chip Fossa
From:
Monson, MA, USA (deceased)
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Posted 24 Jun 2006 1:18 pm
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Jim,
www.audacity.com is a shareware program and will do just what you're looking for. Slow down/speed up and not change key. Notes are very clear [at least to my ears]. |
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John McGann
From:
Boston, Massachusetts, USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 24 Jun 2006 2:02 pm
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"Russian Dragon" is the stage name of an ex-friend of mine who owns a drum set. His real name is Phil Constantly. You may have played a gig with him yourself...
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http://www.johnmcgann.com
Info for musicians, transcribers, technique tips and fun stuff. Joaquin Murphey transcription book, Rhythm Tuneup DVD and more...
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 25 Jun 2006 4:42 am
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Thanks for the recommendations of various other programs I could use, but let me be clear: I am not looking for any kind of program. I just thought Russian Dragon was a cool name and wanted to find out what it is and what it does. Thanks anyway, though.
jc |
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Tommy Detamore
From:
Floresville, Texas
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Posted 3 Jul 2006 8:18 am
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I notified my friend Marius Perron, inventor of the "Russion Dragon", of this thread. He asked me to post this for him. It is interesting to note that the name was coined by the great steeler, Randy Rinehard!
"Hi Marius Perron here. In the ‘80’s we were recording to 2 inch tape. People were doing a lot of MIDI sequencing, but sequenced drums were not as exciting as real drums. So, we would get my brother, Laurent, to come into the studio and overdub live drums. And even though he is a very stable drummer, there were times that we could hear that he was off, but it was hard to decide if he was ahead or behind the click. And at 5 AM it was hard to decide if he was FAR OFF ENOUGH to make him try it again. My brother said it would be cool if there was a box that would TELL a drummer what he doing wrong…
So I put some CMOS circuits together with some LED’s and built a prototype. The name “Russian Dragon” came from a monster San Antonio musician/steel guitar player named Randy Reinhard. Randy was kidding around in the studio one day about somebody not playing close enough to the click and he said, “He’s a Russian Dragon”. I thought that would be a good name for the box. (Thanks, Randy).
I found an attorney in the phone book and had the device patented. I bought a software program called “Tango” to layout the printed circuit boards. It would only run on a PC, so I bought my first computer – a 386 with a 40 megabyte hard drive. My wife, Jeanine, invested money to market the box. She came up with the name for our company: Jeanius Electronics (since her name is Jeanine and my name is Marius…) She would solder the circuit boards in the kitchen, do complete assembly and packing in the living room, and take orders on the phone. I was spending time with desktop publishing software putting together the next month’s ad for the trade magazines: Mix, Electronic Musician, Modern Drummer, EQ, Keyboard, etc.
Every year we would rent a booth at the trade shows (NAMM and AES). We had two models: a rack version ($500) and a table top version ($250). We didn’t make a lot of profit, but we did get to meet and chat with some very smart engineers and producers. I remember selling a unit to Dean Parks (one of the members of this forum) at a California trade show…
In the early ‘90’s sales started slowing down – people were using computers and could SEE and FIX the timing problems. In 1993 we had our first child, and our priorities changed. We assumed the Russian Dragon would die a long, slow death… But then in 1998, we were contacted by a company called “Interactive Metronome” who had discovered that you could use our technology to treat kids with ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder)!!!!!! So we sold them our patent. Part of our agreement was that we could so longer produce or sell any Russian Dragons. You can check out their video demo here: http://www.interactivemetronome.com/im/cli_add.asp?dsp=4
I was pleased last month to read that Mike McKnight http://www.mcknightsoundsinc.com/askmike.html is now using a Russian Dragon to make sure his computers are in sync:
The 3 systems need to be in sync as much as possible in my world, but I don’t want a central synchronizer because if that dies then the whole show stops. So what I do as inelegant and Stone Age as it may sound, is I have a JL Cooper CS10 that I use to stop and start all 3 rigs via MIDI. Sometimes they all start together and are very close to being in perfect sync, but sometimes they go their own way. I have a Russian Dragon (no longer made unfortunately) that I send a click to from my A and B systems to confirm that I’m at least within 30 Ms or so of being in sync. The thought process here is that if a system dies the oh crap factor will dictate that it’ll take me a second or 2 to realize what is happening and switch to the backup system anyway, so on the rare occasions I have to do this the drummer adjusts very quickly and all is well.
Thanks,
Marius Perron
PS. Who is the heck is “Replay Technologies Inc” ????"
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Tommy Detamore
www.cherryridgestudio.com
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 4 Jul 2006 5:49 pm
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"The Russian Dragon" ---- one of my mates is married to her !!!
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 4 Jul 2006 7:58 pm
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Thanks, Tommy! And, of course, Marius! Great to have the story, right from the Dragon's mouth! 
It must be a good feeling to know your invention is helping kids with ADHD. |
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Frank Huysveld
From:
Belgium
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Posted 5 Jul 2006 3:00 am
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http://www.xs4all.nl/~mp2004/bp/
hi everyone
try this link
is beautiful program for music
speed licks to slow down and more.
i use these much .and works good
frank
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Zumsteel D10 ...8+4
peavey session 400
lexicon 550
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Joey Ace
From:
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 5 Jul 2006 9:30 am
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| Wow, thanks Marius and Tommy. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 5 Jul 2006 11:45 am
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| Randy was kidding around in the studio one day about somebody not playing close enough to the click and he said, “He’s a Russian Dragon”. I thought that would be a good name for the box. (Thanks, Randy). |
Funny how names come about. I wonder if Randy actually meant "He's rushing/dragging".
great topic! |
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Tommy Detamore
From:
Floresville, Texas
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Posted 6 Jul 2006 5:24 am
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Bob, knowing Randy as well as I do, you can bet on that! He's got an incredible wit and sense of humour....
TD
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Tommy Detamore
www.cherryridgestudio.com
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