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Topic: Fender Steel King |
thurlon hopper
From:
Elizabethtown Pa. USA
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Posted 28 Mar 2006 11:34 am |
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| Went ot afriend's house couple of weeks ago, and he had just bought a new Fender Steel King amp and did a comparo of the fender against a Webb 614E and Evans SE-200, and the Fender sounded cleaner and clearer than either of them. So now he is considering selling one his Evans and the Webb. Don't know his asking on either but that says something very positive about thr FSK. The Derby really sang throught the FSK. |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 28 Mar 2006 12:24 pm
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I sold my Webb and until recently ran my steel into a Boss RV-5 to a Peavey Nashville 112.
The three things I liked most about the Webb were: the reverb, the tone and the fact that it is the coolest looking amp on the planet when powered up with all those lights on the front panel.
With the RV-5 I no longer miss the Webb reverb as it sounds easily as smooth and deep.
The Nashville 112 has some warmth but I have to get it by cutting the midrange and then its sounds a little muddly and string separation suffers. The Webb had tube like warmth even without cutting back on the highs or mids.
I have been on the fence for months now about trying the FSK. It sure has gotten great reviews and even boutique amp owners like the longtime Webb and Evans owners are going to the FSK.
Actually, now my 112 sits it the corner and I practice through a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. At low volumes it has great tone IMHO. Makes me want to try a Mesa Boogie Mark IV but who can afford that (has to have the custom wood cabinet)?
Thanks for posting your experience with the FSK for those of us on the fence about buying one.
My web site
Greg |
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Larry R
From:
Navasota, Tx.
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Posted 6 Apr 2006 9:02 pm
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| A fellow steeler brought his SK over to let me try it. It sounded great. The tone is sort of a cross between a Fender amp and a (warm sounding) Nash 400. It's unique and of it's own. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 6 Apr 2006 11:56 pm
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| I'm sold on the FSK. I've been using one for about 6 months and I love it. The tone and the settings are not like a Peavey, so that takes some getting used to (if you're used to Peaveys). My bandmates have described the sound as "warm" and "growling"... so that a Good thing! My Peaveys are long gone. |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 3:41 am
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I've been on the amp search for quite a while. I tried a Nashille 112 but just didn't like it. Last weekend I bought a Steel King and that amp is amazing. After going through at least 6 amps trying to find one I liked, the Steel King is by far the best sounding amp I've played: not by a little bit - by a dramatic leap. The only explaination of why it seems less popular than the Peavey is that Peavey has done a masterful job at marketing to the steel community and Fender has not.
But I'm about to sell all my amps and buy a second Steel King. I finally found my perfect set up. |
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Jeff Agnew
From:
Dallas, TX
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 4:16 am
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| Quote: |
| The only explaination of why it seems less popular than the Peavey is that Peavey has done a masterful job at marketing to the steel community and Fender has not. |
Bill, in all fairness you should also factor in over 30 years of being the only major manufacturer to pay attention to the steel community, producing fine products (at a fair price) that can take an extraordinary amount of abuse, unparalleled customer support & service, and access to a responsive company representative right here on the forum. And more than a few folks find Peavey's sound to be what they are looking for.
All this is to take nothing away from the FSK; by all accounts it is a fine amp. But to state that Peavey sells more steel amps than Fender simply because of their marketing is ludicrous.
I'm glad you've found the sound you're looking for and hope you enjoy your FSK for many years. A great product will stand on it's own without the need to slam the competition. |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 5:57 am
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Since when is it a slam against Peavey to say they are good at marketing? As a business man and marketer I can tell you the success and failure of any product rests with marketing. If you are good at marketing, you'll succeed.
Peavey has a strong presence at the major Steel shows. Fender does not: that is marketing.
Peavey has a representative who monitors this forum, Fender does not: that is marketing.
Paying attention to the steel community for years: that is marketing.
With all due respect, to think that marketing is not responsible for their current position in the steel community is just naive. |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 7:07 am
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This actually brings up a very interesting discussion that I've been thinking about since the Dallas show: the importance of marketing.
It probably deserves it's own thread so this one isn't hijacked however. |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 7:20 am
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I have recently been liking my Nashville 112 a lot more with the Mid control set at -15. Maybe it is breaking in also as it sounds warmer with time. It is a great amp IMHO.
Overall I like my Fender Hot Rod Deluxe about as well. It has a warmer and at the same time, clearer tone. Great practice amp at low volumes. Wonder if the Mesa Boogie F-50 might be similar in warmth but a little more power.
Last night I stopped at the World of Music in Erie, PA and stumbled on a used Fender Steel King on consignment. Got it for a very low price. It's mint with the footswitch still in the original sealed packaging. Haven't powered it up yet so I'll post my opinion of it later. I never realized how compact this amp is, never having seen it in person. It is easy to transport with the casters installed and it's 60 some pounds but not a bulky 60 some pounds! Weight is not a big consideration for me.
Seems like this is a great era for steel players in terms of amp selection. The choices are so varied and the used amp market is thriving. I am thrilled that both Peavey and Fender have a market presence in the steel arena. I'm also appreciative of the fact that we can log on here, do a quick search and get so many useful opinions on so many amps. I spent a few days going back over posts on the Webb 6-14-E, Nashville 400 (w/ reverb/tone mods), FSK, Nashville 112, Boogie tube amps, Fender tube amps and even some of the Carvin and Stewart amps before seeking out a FSK. What a great resource we have here and it's more useful to me than similar reviews done by non steel guitar players on other sites.
Greg |
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Jeff Agnew
From:
Dallas, TX
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 8:16 am
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| Quote: |
| ...to think that marketing is not responsible for their current position in the steel community is just naive. |
That's not what I said. Of course, good marketing is part of any company's successful product. I'm saying it's not the "only" reason they're successful. Your original statement was:
| Quote: |
| The only explaination of why it seems less popular than the Peavey is that Peavey has done a masterful job at marketing to the steel community and Fender has not. |
Note the use of the word "only". Meaning that there is no other reason. Such as sound, features, reliability, etc. It also implies that there is no substance behind their product and that, absent that marketing effort, they would not sell more amps than Fender.
Your point seems to be that if steel players listened to the FSK and a Peavey amp side-by-side more of us would choose the Fender because the tone is so outstanding. (paraphrasing your original post.) That may or may not be true. Lots of folks choose Peavey, many because they prefer the tone. Are you saying that the large number of raves about the 112 tone (I'm not among them, BTW) are because Peavey is better at marketing? Or that none have compared the FSK and Peavey tone and decided to go with Peavey anyway? |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 8:29 am
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"Note the use of the word "only". Meaning that there is no other reason. Such as sound, features, reliability, etc. It also implies that there is no substance behind their product and that, absent that marketing effort, they would not sell more amps than Fender."
Yes, I would say that the main difference is marketing. Most people don't make decisions between two amps based on a solid side by side comparision. they make it on the basis of what everyone else is playing (I'm not saying all, I'm saying most). Peavey has done a great job of making sure their amps are on stage at the major Steel Shows. they make sure they get endorsements. they make sure they have a strong presence both here and other places. Much of the sales are based on that effort and that effort is marketing 101.
My question: are you saying the Fender Steel King is inferior to the Peavey 112 for: "sound, features, reliability, etc." Because if you are not, than marketing is the only differentiator.
And if you are saying that, I would have to disagree, haveing owned both: in my opinion the Fender Steel King is far superior in the sound department and comperable in the features department. Of course, that is my opinion having played both, and based on my particular set up and style. But obviously others agree. (as I'm sure there are others that disagree).
My point is that Fender has done a bad job of marketing. Peavey has done a masterful job. Even if Fender and Peavey were exactly the same, it doesn't explain the lopsided presence at the major trade shows. The only thing that does is marketing.
The way I read your position is that the Fender Steel King is inferior to the Peavey and that is the reason why it has more market share. My position is that Peavey has more market share because of better marketing. And it is my personal opinion that the Fender Steel King is superior to the 112.
I believe we are still allowed to express equipment preferences here, no? |
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Gary Lee Gimble
From:
Fredericksburg, VA.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 10:42 am
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| Quote: |
| has a representative who monitors this forum, Fender does not: |
Fender does so, I believe his name is Sam. He may not post nearly as much as his competitor, maybe due to a short fall in a marketing budget or busy taking orders for new amps?
| Quote: |
| Fender has done a bad job of marketing |
Top line sales are probably acceptable, inclusive of their full line. They (Sam)certainly did a bang up job merchandising the Fender room last year at the ISGC by garnishing the room with a Fender 5 string banjo. I still cherish the looks I received from some folks as my buddy and I traded off pickin a few 5 string dittys. |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 10:50 am
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| Well, Sam, if you are reading this: I love the Steel King! |
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John Fabian
From:
Mesquite, Texas USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 11:08 am
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| Quote: |
| Most people don't make decisions between two amps based on a solid side by side comparision. they make it on the basis of what everyone else is playing (I'm not saying all, I'm saying most). |
And this OPINION is based on what???
In my opinion, most steelers no longer can be described using the "Lemming" or "Monkey See, Monkey Do" Theory of steel guitar and steel guitar accessories purchases.
With the amount of information available today and the proliferation of steel shows and jams, a lot of steelers get to inspect, use, and listen to various products.
Sam is the engineer who was primarily responsible for the FSK design.[This message was edited by John Fabian on 07 April 2006 at 12:09 PM.] |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 11:33 am
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It is based on years of marketing experience. I don't think I saw a single Steel King at the Dallas show. (not that their weren't. I just didn't see them). I certainly didn't see an area, like Lonnie's amp show, where I could really do a side by side comparison.
In my opinion, most instruments of any kind are sold to amateur musicians. Most amateur musicians like to play what their heroes play. That is why we have celebrity endorsements. They sell instruments, amps, etc.
I'm not sure what you are complaining about with my statement, John. You are dealer for both Peavey and Fender, aren't you? Are you saying one is better than the other?
I guess I'm missing why people are getting their panties in a bunch. My point is:
1. Fender Steel King is a great amp. I liked it better than the Peavey. I owned both.
2. I don't think Fender does as good a job as Peavey in marketing itself to the Steel community.
Either you believe point 2 or you think Fender has inferior products.
Or, I guess the alternative is that you think Fender and Peavey sell equally as well, but that would surprise me.[This message was edited by Bill McCloskey on 07 April 2006 at 12:52 PM.] |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 11:47 am
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I can assure you that Sam Marshall and his team do monitor this Forum.
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Gary Lee Gimble
From:
Fredericksburg, VA.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 12:22 pm
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| You'd think as many years Fender has been around, they've tackled the marketing aspect. Could it possibly be Fender is satisfied with their current FSK volume and don't want/need additional units sold? Maybe word of mouth has surpassed the need to procure a marketing plan and the amp is selling itself? |
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John Fabian
From:
Mesquite, Texas USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 12:23 pm
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You could have tried the FSK, the NV112, and the NV1000 along with the Fender Jazzmaster Ultralight in our room (or our showroom if you're in the area).
I'm not complaining about your statement, I'm just pointing out that you are painting a lot of steelers with a broad brush that may not be accurate. The efficacy of celebrity endorsements tends to be over-rated with regards to the steel guitar industry.
I am not saying brand P is better than brand F or vice-versa. That is an individual conclusion made by each customer.[This message was edited by John Fabian on 08 April 2006 at 12:32 PM.] |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 1:21 pm
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John,
I'm sorry I missed trying out the Jazzmaster. It looks pretty cool. In fact, I went to the music store to see if I could try one out when I bought the Fender steel king |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 2:28 pm
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"Maybe word of mouth has surpassed the need to procure a marketing plan and the amp is selling itself? "
What is more likely is that Fender corporate can't or won't justify the marketing dollars that need to be spent and Peavey has a history here so marketing dollars are much more easily justified and spent.
I don't know the reason. I just know they created one hell of an amplifier. |
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Gary Lee Gimble
From:
Fredericksburg, VA.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 2:42 pm
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| Quote: |
| dollars that need to be spent |
I hate it when someone spends my money for me |
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 7:30 pm
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If I own an amp. the I like best, I don't even care if you built it! [Whomever your are!]
------------------
“Big John”
a.k.a. {Keoni Nui}
Current Equipment
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Rand Anderson
From:
Cardiff, California, USA
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Posted 7 Apr 2006 9:46 pm
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Sam Marshall spends a lot of time in r&d and amplifier design for Fender and SWR(bass amps owned by fender). He was kind enough to take time to give me a tour of Fender plant in scottsdale. His job is not marketing, his desk is cluttered with transformers and pcbs. I see him at shows and even in the backup band a couple times(great guitar player). Fender as whole spends a lot of time making 40 foot strats for the phoenix suns and marketing averill lavigne signature models to wannabee teen idols, but beware the sleeping giant....gretsch, sho-bud.........
Mike Brown on the other hand is always helpful with customer issues and mods. He listens to customer demands and tries to implement their ideas. I have seen him say "send that session 400 back to me and i'll hook it up". I doubt Mike takes home a marketing bonus for that. He is a great asset to Peavey and the steel community.
Point is they both really dig steel guitar and music in general and both want to push the technological envelope. However their hands are tied by their prospective companies remains a mystery. I feel that they both go to bat for this community and both build great products specifically for us. The steel guitar market is a tiny niche segment of the music industry.
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Jeff Agnew
From:
Dallas, TX
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Posted 8 Apr 2006 6:53 am
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| Quote: |
| Yes, I would say that the main difference is marketing. |
That's a contradiction with your first statement. It can't be "only", which is exclusionary, and "main", meaning there are others, at the same time.
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| they make it on the basis of what everyone else is playing (I'm not saying all, I'm saying most). |
If we were talking about teenagers buying the latest model played by their shredder hero I might agree. Concerning steelers, I disagree. Surmising that "most" steelers buy in such a manner is pure conjecture.
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| My question: are you saying the Fender Steel King is inferior to the Peavey 112 for: "sound, features, reliability, etc." |
Didn't say it, didn't even imply it. I made no comparison between the two models. Please read my messages again.
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| in my opinion the Fender Steel King is far superior in the sound department and comperable in the features department. |
This is what I wished you had said in the first post. It's an honest opinion, with which folks are free to agree or disagree.
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| My point is that Fender has done a bad job of marketing. Peavey has done a masterful job. |
Also a valid opinion.
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| The way I read your position is that the Fender Steel King is inferior to the Peavey and that is the reason why it has more market share. |
Sheesh. Not even close. You're reading things into my words that aren't there. I was very careful to avoid claiming one was superior/inferior to the other. I can't make that statement, nor can you. You can of course state honestly that you prefer one over the other.
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| My position is that Peavey has more market share because of better marketing. |
Agreed. I never claimed otherwise.
For the sake of clarity, and hoping not to belabor the point -- my disagreement with your original statement is because you said the only reason a steeler might choose a Peavey (any model) over the FSK is because Peavey does a better job of marketing. There are a host of other technical, personal, economic or other non-marketing reasons why a steeler might choose a Peavey over the FSK. Or vice-versa.
[This message was edited by Jeff Agnew on 08 April 2006 at 07:54 AM.] |
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Gary Preston
From:
Columbus, Ohio, USA
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Posted 8 Apr 2006 8:24 am
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I will have to agree with Bill . You can see more people with Peavey amps and other eguipment than Fender . Or at least thats what i see here in Ohio . I would not say this is the way it is everywhere . As far as sound goes i have a Fender Vibrosonic with the 15'' J.B.L. (factory ) that i bought new in 1976 and it still is the best sound of any amp that i have played through ! And yes i do have some of the others also . Again this is just my openion .
It seems to me that it is the end users that do have some say so about the equipment that they like the best . I do think that some players have made a sacrafice for sound with the weight issue . This is my openion based upon what works for me only . G.P. |
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