Desert Rose Band

erik · Posted 4 Feb 2001 7:15 am

Well, i finally got around to purchasing their Greatest Hits (A Dozen Roses) CD. This is a fantastic CD. Every thing about it is top notch. I remember hearing all these (great)songs on the radio when they were on the charts. The sound of the recording is excellent. Not something easy to do when you are combining cuts from various albums. The musicianship is of course, first rate. And, i've always felt the pedal steel style of JDM was the identifying mark of that band. The insert has great artwork and all the lyrics, plus a picture of the band. I commend whoever was responsible for this project - not trying to cut corners for $ sake. High quality stuff, folks!

Jason Odd · From: Stawell, Victoria, Australia

Hi Erik, there's a certain painful ironic element to that release.
It's a US compilation, which includes some tracks from their last album, which was not released in the USA.
So in a way it was kind of like "well, we really couldn't be bothered with your album, but now you're gone we'll just borrow a couple of tracks here"

Still, it is a good compilation, it's just a shame that they had to fade away due to record company mismanagement.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

I always loved that band's music being from LA and getting to hear Jay Dee live over the years a lot just made 'em even better. The thing that always frosted me was that I'd see articles or even record jackets with just the pictures of the three singers! There was a write up in Country Song Roundup one time which only had a picture of John Jorgensen, Herb Pederson, and Chris Hillman (who was a mediocre singer at his best). What made that band was the great playing. The interplay between JayDee and Jorgensen was flawless and the bottom and drive put in by Bill Bryson and Steve Duncan made the package complete. I'd liked to have heard Herb on more vocals. The only one I remember him doing that did anything was their cut of Hello Trouble. I just don't think the other three who didn't contribute to the vocals got a fair share of the spotlight when it came to publicity. In my opinion, they're the ones who sold those records. John Jorgensen of course contributed his share to the music but I think he could have seen to it that JayDee and company got a little more of the credit for the band's success. They sure as hell deserve it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

------------------
Have a good 'un! JH U-12

[This message was edited by Jerry Hayes on 05 February 2001 at 05:35 PM.]

erik · Posted 5 Feb 2001 5:55 pm

Chris Hillman was the creator and primary song writer. So, in that sense the band would have never been if it weren't for him. But yes, it was a total band effort.

Jason Odd · From: Stawell, Victoria, Australia

Hmm, in an discussion with Jay Dee, he mentioned that part of the reason he left the band was due to the fact that they were a band in every sense of the word, except for the promotion and press, which Hillman apparently encouraged. It wasn't this alone that led to Jay Dee leaving, he's never been a big fan of internal politics, touring heavily and a few other factors all added up.
I think that it was truly bizarre to see only three members on the sleeves, and it always struck me as a rather tasteless manouver.

Herb Steiner · From: Spicewood TX 78669

I'm not saying that what I'm about to write applies to the Desert Rose Band, and my friend Jay Dee can certainly comment about his experiences, but from my experience:

Singer/songwriters who do not have a record deal or publishing contract (and the publishing deal is what makes the MOST AMOUNT OF MONEY) need a band to create their "sound" and build popularity. It's in their best interests in the early stages to convince the musicians that "we're a band, guys, and we have to sacrifice and pull together... then we'll all get rich." Once high-powered management and the marketing guys get their hands on the project, however, things change.

The songwriter is convinced by these money guys what he has really held in his heart and ego for all those years: that he is in fact the driving engine behind it all and that the musicians are merely expendable and replaceable parts, to be chucked in the circular file whenever problems pop up, like a blown out water pump in the Ferrari he just bought.

So, when times are tough it's "Geez, we're a band, right? We gotta sacrifice for all of us." But when things are fat, it's "boys, the management and I have decided that we have to, um... make certain changes in our direction." Sound familiar to anyone?

I've seen this happen from personal experience and the experiences of my friends. Money is behind it all, and I accept that, and I accept the fact that the musicians are the most expendable parts of the organization, or at least they're perceived to be by the decision-makers.

If you've read the story of the Byrds, you've read that in the early days of the "Turn Turn Turn" era, the airplay was great but the gig money was still relatively low. Roger McGuinn and Gene Clark were driving Ferraris bought with songwriter royalties, while Mike Clark and Chris, who didn't write the songs, were still knockin' around in used cars. I don't think that lesson was lost on Chris.

------------------
Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

Tommy Minniear · From: Logansport, Indiana

I believe Herb has given a logical explanation of how things probably came to pass with The Desert Rose band. The "let's be a band" thing has problems on all levels. It is just that the stakes are a lot higher on the level they were on.

------------------
Tommy Minniear

Neil Hilton · From: Lexington, Kentucky

I have an old cassette version of "dozen roses" - might have to dig that out this evening for a listen...... as fits prophetically with the string of posts here, if I recall correctly, the last song on the album is something along the lines of "the price I pay" - with blistering work from Jorgenson.

erik · Posted 6 Feb 2001 3:59 pm

You are correct Neil, that tune is some hot pickin'.

Still, it must be recognized that the person who is writing the most material in the band/group is going to have the control. There is no one forcing the others to stay.

In a somewhat related story. I recently read up on an old favorite rock group of mine called Molly Hatchet. I knew that one guy was the leader, writng the most tunes and playing the most solos, etc. What i didn't know was that band members were getting resentful that he was getting huge royalty checks for his writing. So, he would toss some names on the songs to keep people happy. But, if it wasn't for this one guy, the others would have only been a good bar band.

Getting back to the DRB, i think each member was a very important piece of the complete sound... but without songs there is nothing.

Jason Odd · From: Stawell, Victoria, Australia

Good point, and I think Herb illustrated the most likely scenario very well, although each band of course has their own version of these wonderful politics.

Songwriters, well they're okay, but most of them can't pull together a solid tune with out a band building it up, if you work it up in the studio with just a songwriter demo to build on, it tends to sounds like every other Nashville product of the time.

With a band support network Hillman was prolific, and they didn't just rely on his songs either.
Hillman actually used the core of the group as an acoustic touring outfit, but beefed it up with steel and drums as soon as he could.
They had a great sound and make the clean 1980s production trends work for them in a big way.
Personally I'm a fan of the first two albums, the rest are pretty fine and with a little more rock in some later efforts you'd think they'd be more to my taste, but I still prefer the first two, which also produced top #10 singles, not bad for their age and image at the time... sometimes the real thing beats the gloss.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

Here's a fact that can't be denied by anyone! The Desert Rose Band lost it's edge when Jay Dee left! He was replaced by Tom Brumley and even though I'm a big fan of Tom's too, it just wasn't the same. When Jorgensen left he was replaced by a guy of his own choosing. I saw them on Nashville Now with Tom Brumley and the new guitarist and although the vocals were the same and the band was tight, it just didn't have the same sparkle and overall sound like the original. I think they were probably one of the best bands ever assembled in the history of music and will always be one of my favorites in their original form. A good album to try to score which is a forerunner or the DRB is a Chris Hillman album called appropriately "Desert Rose". It has Jay Dee on it and guitarists James Burton and Bob Warford. Herb Pederson is also on it and some fine Dobro playing by Al Perkins and fiddle by Byron Berline. The Desert Rose Band evolved from this one for sure. It's from Sugar Hill records circa 1984, and the album number is SH-3743. I have a vinyl copy but if you contact Sugar Hill they might have it on CD or cassette. The address on the album is: Sugar Hill Records, P.O. Box 4040 Duke Station, Durham, North Carolina 27706.

------------------
Have a good 'un! JH U-12

JB Arnold · From: Longmont,Co,USA (deceased)

I have a little different perspective on Hillman, being in Boulder-He was here during the late 70's and early 80's, and in fact, his original backup band was Firefall, before they got much hotter than he and he went on.

But Chris, who you've got to admit is a genius, (and by the way, one MONSTER mandolin player) always had some kind of issue going on. Seems like everything he got involved in out here turned into some sort of fiasco, generally with him cast in the role of the bad guy.

He did a solo show down at the old Ebbets field (Chuck Morris' old place, before he went to work for Fey). Chris was doing his sound check, which sounded fine to me, but man, he was having a fit at the sound guy-screaming at him in front of all the crowd, cussing, man it was kind of over the top and VERY uncomfortable for the audience. And that happened at one time or another almost every time I saw his solo act. The tech guys hated his guts, at least the ones I knew.

Then, he released an album called "Slipping Away", an absolutely stunning piece of work-I mean brilliant-and he got a TON of critical acclaim for it-but for some reason it didn't sell. Maybe he hacked off the people at asylum or something, but there are 10 fabulous songs on that album and he got screwed. Anyway, He did a special show at the Harvest House for the release with some big name backup people (Timothy Schmidt, Rick Roberts) and there were 2 shows, only the audience for the 1st show sat for 90 minutes until they finally got started (and Chris was acting rather wired). They played 25 minutes and then told the crowd they'd have to go so the late crowd could come in. Everyone refused to leave, and it got real ugly. The local press really drubbed him on that one.

The follow up to that album he made to deliberately sell records and get airplay-only it was pretty lame, and the critics hated it, accused him of selling out, and the label dropped him over poor sales.

There are other fairly hideous storied floating around that I'm sure are true, but I only got 2nd hand, so I'll leave those out. But Chris' reputation here was tarnished by bizarre, angry behavior. The rap on him with the local players was that he was a VERY talented guy, but paranoid beyond belief and very manipulative. Word filtered back from Nashville that he hadn't really changed much, but that was a long time ago. A couple of folks who went with him from here came back as discards, which surprised no one.

Just my limited experience-but this is a small town, and I wasn't alone in my perception of the guy.

John

------------------
Fulawka D-10 9&5
"All in all, looking back, I'd have to say the best advice anyone ever gave me was 'Hands Up, Don't Move!"
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel

Jason Odd · From: Stawell, Victoria, Australia

Chris is a major talent, but he has an attitude that seems a little overly bitter.
In interviews he can come off as stand-offish, even a 1965 Byrds interview I've read has Chris pleasent but mainly silent.
Now here's guy who was a silent member of a band for some time (the Byrds) and a major figure overshadowed in another band (the Flying burrito Brothers), by Gram Parsons.
Hard to compete with a Hank Williams type death mythology, like that around Parsons.
It tends to dominate the image of Chris for years.
Still, he is apparently really against any FBBs rarities coming out, and has given no support to the possible issue of a FBBs 1969 live set coming out.

Neil Hilton · From: Lexington, Kentucky

JB - interesting notes from a segment of what has obviously become a long and storied career path for Hillman....

and on that note, I've been inclined on a couple of occasions to order the two recent albums that he's cut on Rounder - curious to know if any of you guys have given either a listen. If I recall correctly, both are with Herb Pederson and Tony Rice, with Rounder's bluegrass focus, don't know if any steel is included, but likely full of mandolin and dobro - anyone familiar with these albums???

Jason Odd · From: Stawell, Victoria, Australia

They are fine bluegrass albums, I do recommend them if you like bluegrass, they are quite different to the CHris & HErb 'Bakersfield bound' CD (which you can buy off the forum).. Chris did have a solo album in 1998.

I think Hillam is a little wary of the whole country-rock history that hangs around his neck, but he seems to have a genuine love and nostalgia for his bluegrass days.
In early 2000 there was a reunion of the Haphazards (here most of the Rice brothers started), Herb & Chris and others who played with them around the bluegrass era in CA.
Don't think any of that has been issued, but maybe I'm wrong as I'm not familiar with the most recent release.
Jason

Neil Hilton · From: Lexington, Kentucky

Jason - I do have some Del McCourey, J.D. Crowe, Rice Bros., etc, and really do enjoy some of that Rounder bluegrass, so may get these Hillman efforts with the label.

I gave a quick look on their website - the lineup for the 1999 release is as follows:

C. Hillman - vocals, mandolin
H. Pedersen - vocals, guitar, banjo
L. Rice - vocals, mandolin
T. Rice - guitars
F. Travers - dobro
Ron Simpkins - bass
Rick Simpkins - fiddle

There is also a 1997 album, same exact lineup only with the dobro work from Jerry Douglas. - Neil

All times are GMT - 8 Hours	Jump to: