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Topic: THE ANSWER!!! Excel ordering questions |
Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 11:46 am |
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(See my 1/31/24 post for The Answer...)
Thinking about getting one of these (just a simple E9 S10)...might have found the issues and solutions from al the threads here...a few questions still remain, and please add any other advice you may have!!
A couple of folks here have struggled with issues/repairs (one complete refund, one "send it back to Tokyo for repair", one "I'm considering going to Tokyo for a fix")...so it really is important to get it right the first time out...
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Models - The Superb and Robostar are the models that can be ordered?...is there another? What are the differences? I believe that the hardware is the same? What is the Exstar?
Major issue seems mostly to be the string breakage thing...but the tuning head that is horizontal travel, with longer travel, and without the sharp vertical break angle from the newer model vertical travel one, seems OK? Or is the tuning now back to the changer side with just a solid block on the keypad side?
I'd go with 24 ¼ scale, not 25 ½ to avoid breakage also?
Pickup - I've been a happy Telonics guy, but perhaps the Excel pickup is designed for that guitar and is a good choice? Any advice?
The split tuning tiny screws are hard to access and don't have enough travel...I'd simply ask for a split rod raise to be added to RKL, like Williams does...(for string 6) to touch up the G#>F# after tuning G#>A and G#>G?
Half stop for 2nd string D#>D>C# - seems to be a few different mechanisms for this??
Other things to know?
Thanks!
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor
Last edited by Steve Lipsey on 31 Jan 2024 4:10 pm; edited 7 times in total |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 11:54 am
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Split tuning is a tiny set screw but I've had no trouble adjusting it on any of my Excels.
My Excel Robostar has an updated tuner and now has no string breakage issues (web site shows the fix):
https://www.gregcutshaw.com/Excel%20Robostar/Excel%20Robostar.html
The Excel OEM pickup is the same on all my guitars and I thinks it's awesome (ymmv).
There are many variations possible in the Superb line such as keyed, keyless and the guitars do get design updates frequently. If you see an exact guitar you like, send Excel a picture of it and tell them you want that exact guitar down to the changer and tuner design. One variation on the Superb is the 12 string E9/C6 with changeover lever (not a universal).
Last edited by Greg Cutshaw on 4 Jan 2024 5:34 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 4:40 pm
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I asked for an Alumitone pickup out of curiosity and was delighted with it. It's amazingly clean and colourless, although you might prefer something with a sound of its own. I'm kind of a hifi guy.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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scott murray
From:
Asheville, NC
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 5:55 pm
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the ExStar is the "Superb II" model, not sure if he still offers the original Superb but it sounds like he'll make you just about anything you ask for.
_________________
1965 Emmons S-10, 3x5 • Emmons LLIII D-10, 10x12 • JCH D-10, 10x12 • Beard MA-8 • Oahu Tonemaster |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 7:19 pm
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Difference between Robostar and Superb?
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Stew Crookes
From:
Paris, France
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Posted 3 Jan 2024 11:22 pm
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| Steve Lipsey wrote: |
| Difference between Robostar and Superb? |
I have a Robostar (which I’m so far quite happy with) and one major design difference is the Exstar tunes at the changer side and the keyhead side only holds the ball end of the strings unlike the keyhead tuning system on the Robostar. I have a similar tuning mechanism to Greg’s Robostar and cannot break a string no matter what I do.
There appears to be no 12 string Robostar available and there's just fewer options with that model in general for example the long scale length is only available on the Exstar/Superb. I’m speculating here, but I think the Robostar might have its changer based on the previous generation of Superb - sure looks similar.
Initially Mitsuo said that there would be only 10 Robostars made, and seeing as there's already at least 5 in circulation, wether he will evolve the model or make more than 10 remains to be seen.
A small difference is that the pedal and lever stops on the Robostar are fixed travel (they’re positive and feel good, they’re just not adjustable like they are on the Exstar).
I really like the factory single coil pickup - its a great sounding guitar and really rings but isn’t harsh at all. Acoustically, it sounds fuller and much louder than my EMCI (though both sound great amplified).
It’s super light and on hardwood the RKR can make it scoot a bit on the C# lower, but it’s fine on carpet - that’s my only ‘complaint’ which is pretty minor to have such a portable, pro steel! I’ve not played an Exstar so can’t comment if this is also the case, which seeing as it’s only marginally heavier wouldn’t surprise me but I don’t know.
_________________
Music mixer, producer and pedal steel guitarist
stewcrookes.com |
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Larry Allen
From:
Kapaa, Kauai,Hawaii
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Posted 4 Jan 2024 12:08 pm Excel
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Steve..I’m not a single Coil PU player, I have Telonics 84PW in my Excels.. 
_________________
Excel steels & Peavey amps,Old Chevys & Motorcycles & Women on the Trashy Side |
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Michael Stephens
From:
South Hadley, MA
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Posted 5 Jan 2024 2:56 am
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| Another thumbs up on the standard Excel pickup ---- I think it sounds great. Full, clear, rich, not harsh. |
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Pete McAvity
From:
St. Louis, Missouri USA
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Posted 5 Jan 2024 10:55 am
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As far as string breakage, I believe that was only concerning the 3rd string of the E9 neck on the 25.5" scale Superbs. It's a thing. I have a circa 2010 Superb D10 & wear a welder's mask when I change strings (not really). Purportedly, Mitsuo discontinued this scale length as a standard & abhors changing the high G# on these himself. Its a simple physics issue at that length, and if the string isn't to the highest metallurgic specs (they generally aren't, and nearly if not all string brands source their plain strings from the same producer), it's gonna break on a 25.5", but not on a 24" neck. That said, I'll bet Mitsuo WILL make you a 25.5" scale guitar, but it will come w/ a warning and guaranteed ass pain.
That said, my guitar is worth the hassle.
_________________
Excel Superb D10, Sarno Black Box or Freeloader, Goodrich L120, Boss DD5, Baby Bloomer, 1965 Super Reverb chopped to a head, feeding a mystery PA cab w/ a K130.
They say "thats how it goes". I say "that ain't the way it stays!" |
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Mike Vallandigham
From:
Martinez, CA
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Posted 5 Jan 2024 11:12 am
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My first Excel has the long scale, and second one that I ordered myself has the short scale. I really don't see a difference between the two, which is when I specified the short on the one that I ordered myself.
I think the Excel pickup is fine, a standard single coil.
I'd go with that unless you have your own preference, then go with that. Mitsuo can accommodate you.
Not much else to add - but I've always have a pretty easy time dealing with Mitsuo, he's always been very responsive and my guitar came pretty fast.
My best tip is to remember that there is a language barrier - with us, not Mitsuo! - so keep your communication simple. No Dickensian passages when trying to tell him what you want. Short and simple gets the job done. I made a PDF with everything listed out: copedant, color/finish, height, scale, etc. Then everything is clear. |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 31 Jan 2024 4:01 pm
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Well, got a lot of input, in this thread and on PMs...seems that most Excels are great and people love them....BUT there are a lot of string breakage issues, on BOTH long and short scale, and there are communication and repair issues (at least a few folks are out the entire purchase price with no help on their issues), so there is a significant risk to buying one...
The Williams guitars really do it all (no crossover steel, but pretty much everything else), great tone, light, reliable, great standard copedent, with first-class support - Bill himself just answered the phone on a Sunday, and shipped me a part on Monday, for my old keyless steel (tuning block got stripped; I'm sure I overtightened it) .
The 1-year wait is the issue...but I located a very newish Williams S-10 keyless, with a Telonics 84 - just what I was looking for - and went for it. It isn't one of those lovely Williams lacquer ones - it is a black mica - and I was unsure (although under the mica is some pretty maple) - but it arrived and looks totally awesome, elegant and mean at the same time...and reminiscent of all those old black mica Emmons steels (those must be why people always say that "Black ones sound better"). Plus it matches my Milkman amp...
Thanks to all of you for helping me along this road...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Larry Allen
From:
Kapaa, Kauai,Hawaii
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Posted 31 Jan 2024 4:28 pm
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Steve. My only guitars that always broke the 3rd were Sho-Buds. I have had several Excels and NEVER broken a 3rd .012.. first Cobras then Live Steel , now D’Addario..NYXLs..both long and short scales..changing twice a year. Playing 8+ hours a week..Larry
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Excel steels & Peavey amps,Old Chevys & Motorcycles & Women on the Trashy Side |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 31 Jan 2024 8:52 pm
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Well...it sounded great before, but this minor change made it sound amazing!
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Steve Mueller
From:
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
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Posted 1 Feb 2024 9:15 pm
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Congrats on your new Williams! It's lovely. You made the right decision!!
_________________
2016 Williams D12 8 x 8, 2015 Williams D12 8 x 8, 2023 Williams S12 4 x 5, Milkman Amps, 1974 Gibson Byrdland |
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