| Author |
Topic: How do you go about learning a tune by ear? |
Lloyd Graves
From:
New York, USA
|
Posted 5 Mar 2023 3:23 pm |
|
As the thread title says, I'm wondering how different people go about learning a tune from a recording.
I've learned Aloha Oe Blues from Stacy Phillips' transcription, but that is just the first half of the recording. The second half is similar and I have mostly worked it out on the fly. And then there is Sol Hoopii's version - particularly his solo the second time through! Such tasteful playing! I haven't gotten much of that at all yet.
Do folks just slow the tune down and learn section by section? Do you transcribe as you go? Are there other techniques in missing?
Thanks! |
|
|
 |
David Knutson
From:
Cowichan Valley, Canada
|
Posted 5 Mar 2023 4:09 pm
|
|
I generally find that if I can hum it or whistle it, I can find it on my steel. Then it’s a matter of finding the most efficient way to play it in a given tuning. But getting the melody firm in my brain is the best start for me.
_________________
David K |
|
|
|
Paul Seager
From:
Augsburg, Germany
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 6:30 am
|
|
Lloyd, I start off as David suggests. I attempt to sing the line and then begin finding it on the steel.
Where there maybe a lot going on or a line is too long or difficult to sing, I record the tune into Audacity then, using the label feature, divide the track up into logical sections and set each section to loop until I have it. If necessary I use the Audacity "Change Tempo" effect.
Transcriptions help a great deal where the tuning may be unclear and especially if someone like Stacy Phillips has done the heavy lifting! But I've learned not to underestimate how long it takes to learn a tune and by ear and even with transcriptions, applying them seems to work best through listening.
_________________
\paul
Bayern Hawaiians: https://www.youtube.com/@diebayernhawaiians3062
Other stuff: https://www.youtube.com/@paulseager3796/videos |
|
|
|
Mike Neer
From:
NJ
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 10:15 am
|
|
Learning to play by ear is simply the best way of learning how to stylize and play specific grooves and articulations. The notes are the notes, but the articulation and rhythm of phrases is what makes them stand out. The faster you learn that, the sooner you'll be on your way. The notes are already there on the neck; the picking is up to you. Listen for picked notes, glisses, vibrato, tone, all of that, and then just find the notes. It helps if you know the tuning if you are trying to recreate someone's part, and also it helps if you learn phrase by phrase rather than note by note.
_________________
Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links |
|
|
|
Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 10:26 am
|
|
First, I listen to the tune enough times until I get it firmly embedded into my thick head. Then, I grab my Colo flattop box and figger out the chord changes. Next, I go to the steel and play along until I get it "close enough." Finally, I play it enough that I'm tired of it and move along to something else.
There are most likely better methods, but I've been doing it like this since the 1960s. It works for me, and I'm too set in my ways to change now. |
|
|
|
Lloyd Graves
From:
New York, USA
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 11:08 am
|
|
Learning the chords... I often forget that. Thanks. It really does help when I do that.
And breaking a tune into phrases is solid advice. But do you transcribe or take notes as you go? Or just commit a section to memory and then plow on?
As for humming the melody, I know the trick but my brain seems wired to change melodies. Listening to a tune on repeat for a week or more helps, and playing along with the track I've learned also helps a ton, but once it is off, I ALWAYS seem to shift rhythm, add grace notes, skip notes, etc. Which is why I'm trying to see how everyone else does it. But it sounds like I just need to be more disciplined. |
|
|
|
David Matzenik
From:
Cairns, on the Coral Sea
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 12:21 pm
|
|
The first thing I do is create a tidy chord chart with room for timing notes and other details. Some tunes you have to count. Then I slow down phrases of a few bars. I cannot sing, so that doesn't help.
_________________
Don't go in the water after lunch. You'll get a cramp and drown. - Mother. |
|
|
|
Bill McCloskey
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 12:31 pm
|
|
| I don't think anyone has mentioned tools, but a good slow down and looping tool is essential. I use Transcribe which is great With Transcribe you can slow it down, loop sections you are working on, change the key. Great tool. But before even getting down to the business of transcribing a solo (or figuring out the chords) you should focus on just being able to play the melody and listen to as many versions of the song as you can. |
|
|
|
Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
|
Posted 6 Mar 2023 12:44 pm
|
|
What Bill just said! Learn the melody and chords.
Transcribe is a must-have tool.
Chordify is an online app that's not perfect but can often get you in the ballpark re chord progressions. https://chordify.net
The thing that will help you transcribe is to just do it - and the more you do it, the better you become because you start to see and hear patterns. Try playing simple songs everyone knows on your instrument. Can you play Oh Susana or Happy Birthday right now, off-the-cuff, with no errors, on your guitar? The more you do this, the more you start to recognize intervals and common rhythms.
As the tunes get more complex, look for common aspects. What is the feel? Straight 8th or swing 8ths? Is it 3/4 or 6/8? If a line isn't swinging, it might be in needs rests or the first note of a measure needs to be a rest. Etc, etc.
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
|
|
|
David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
|
Posted 7 Mar 2023 4:54 am
|
|
I'm probably late to the game, but I just recently discovered that you can easily loop and slow down YouTube videos.
I had to add a LOOPER FOR YOUTUBE extension to my Google Chrome browser and now I have the ability to loop a section of a video and slow it down without altering the pitch.
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
|
|
|
Jouni Karvonen
From:
Helsinki, Finland
|
|
|
|
Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
|
Posted 7 Mar 2023 9:55 am
|
|
I'm from a different background with a lot of experience of taking musical dictation.
I write down what I hear, then learn to play what I see.
I find it easier to find the right positions on the neck from paper than from thin air.
But of course my method only works if you're used to jotting down notation.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
|
|
|
Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
|
Posted 7 Mar 2023 10:35 am
|
|
| Mike Neer wrote: |
| Learning to play by ear is simply the best way of learning how to stylize and play specific grooves and articulations. The notes are the notes, but the articulation and rhythm of phrases is what makes them stand out. The faster you learn that, the sooner you'll be on your way. The notes are already there on the neck; the picking is up to you. Listen for picked notes, glisses, vibrato, tone, all of that, and then just find the notes. It helps if you know the tuning if you are trying to recreate someone's part, and also it helps if you learn phrase by phrase rather than note by note. |
I agree with everything Mike wrote here. I'll add a proviso for myself - if I want to learn a song with a non-trivial chord progression, I find it is much quicker if I write a chord-number chart first. It takes just a few minutes, it doesn't have to be fancy or cover every intricacy, but it sets the stage for me. It also forces me to listen carefully to the tune wholesale a time or two. In this process, I can start to get the rhythmic and melodic lay-of-the-land. I sort of think about it like speed reading. After that, I go in like Mike describes.
Sometimes looping and/or slowing down tricky parts is useful. For anything physically on your computer, simply a media player like VLC does all that with ease. It's open-source, free, easy to use, and available on practically any platform.
In some playing situations (either live or recording), I just have to wing it. I try to get people to let me listen once through and at least scribble down a chord chart, but not everybody is that patient. They'll start out a song I don't know and I need to really listen carefully, first to the chord structure, and then (hopefully concurrently) start to absorb the gist of the rhythmic and melodic structure. Obviously "When in doubt, lay out" rules the day. But chord structure first for me. |
|
|
|
Lloyd Graves
From:
New York, USA
|
Posted 7 Mar 2023 11:53 am
|
|
| Mike Neer wrote: |
| It helps if you know the tuning... |
All things being equal, if you don't know the tuning, what informs your decision to use one over another? Is it the chord progression?
For example, I have been focusing on high bass A, which Sebastian retunes to C# minor. Or perhaps an E7 variation? Why one over the other?
Thanks for everyone's answers. And your patience to questions that have probably been asked by many others. |
|
|
|
Cappone dAngelo
From:
Vancouver, BC, Canada
|
Posted 7 Mar 2023 1:46 pm
|
|
| Dave Mudgett wrote: |
if I want to learn a song with a non-trivial chord progression, I find it is much quicker if I write a chord-number chart first. It takes just a few minutes, it doesn't have to be fancy or cover every intricacy, but it sets the stage for me. It also forces me to listen carefully to the tune wholesale a time or two. In this process, I can start to get the rhythmic and melodic lay-of-the-land. I sort of think about it like speed reading. After that, I go in like Mike describes.
|
Me too - in part because it helps me understand what's going on in the melodic content - for example, I care less about learning that 'the notes of the melody are D->F#->A->C' than knowing that 'it's outlining a secondary dominant in the key of C major'. And if I'd already transcribed the basic harmony, I already know that before I even consider the melody notes.
I play in one band where the main songwriter/bandleader will start to show me the notes to play on a lead guitar line in an intro of a new song, and I always stop him and ask for the harmony/chords first. He sometimes seems confused/frustrated, since he just wants me to play the notes he's giving to me. But I'll 'get' the notes - and remember them - quicker if I know what the underlying harmony is. |
|
|
|
Sebastian Müller
From:
Berlin / Germany
|
Posted 8 Mar 2023 10:26 am
|
|
For me transcribing a song is quite a process. First, I import the song in Ableton Live. I have to warp the clip, it can be a bit cumbersome with live played recordings but it is worth the effort. Because after this is done the recording is perfectly on the grid of the DAW. Then I check if the tuning is right, very often with old recordings you have to adjust it to 440 Hz. Next step is to do a chord chart. In the old days I would learn the piece from the beginning to the end, find the notes on the fretboard and memorising the part at the same time, only moving forward when the part is memorised. What I do for the last two years is using Guitar Pro and transcribe the song first as a whole, I memorize it as a separate step, sometimes like half a year later or so. Before I learn the song I will record a backing track, I record directly into the Ableton Session, what is super handy. What is great about Ableton Live is that you can adjust the tempo without changing the pitch, so you can start playing rather slow an speed it up to a tempo that is comfortable for you. When I learned the part proper I also record my steel part into Ableton and mix the song. What is super nice is that I always have the original song as a reference in my session, if it is a Jazz tune I sometime have like 3 different version in my session that I can use to get inspirations. So, quite a process but very powerful, and you can get really deep into the smallest details if you want to, slowing it down, loop certain parts, etc. And, Ableton has one of the best timestretching algorithms implemented that I know (called Complex)
_________________
https://hawaiian-steel-guitar.com |
|
|
|
Duane Becker
From:
Elk,Wa 99009 USA
|
Posted 8 Mar 2023 12:44 pm
|
|
When I start to learn a song by ear, I continually listen to the song many times for several days without even touching the steel. Getting it totally familiar in my mind.
If its fills and lead, I will then tab out my parts. This helps me to remember my memory my parts, and then I begin to play it several times a day on the steel. If its a band situation, same deal for me. But I ask if we as a band could play it twice during the night, one time at beginning and then later on maybe the last set. This helps to reinforce playing it with a band, until we get comfortable with it. |
|
|
|
David Matzenik
From:
Cairns, on the Coral Sea
|
Posted 8 Mar 2023 2:52 pm
|
|
The time consuming reality of the above processes not withstanding, some people seem to think you are being evasive, if you tell them you don't know the number they asked for. 
_________________
Don't go in the water after lunch. You'll get a cramp and drown. - Mother. |
|
|
|
Jesse Pearson
From:
San Diego , CA
|
Posted 8 Mar 2023 4:09 pm
|
|
| I will second the suggestions about using transcription software. I recommend the "Amazing SlowDowner" by RoniMusic. It makes transcribing a breeze. You can change the pitch and speed of a selected phrase and make loops to your required size. The E.Q filters allows you to enhance certain frequencies to hear different instruments better. Here's the link...https://www.ronimusic.com/ |
|
|
|
Lloyd Graves
From:
New York, USA
|
Posted 11 Mar 2023 5:25 am
|
|
Thanks everyone. These are all great suggestions. As I've read and reread your thoughts I came to the realization that, what I really need is time. More time!
When I learned the banjo in my 20s and 30s, I was single and childless, finishing college (and later working seasonal jobs) with VERY little responsibility. That level of freedom is gone now. 😆 I think the reality is that I need to reset my expectations and just be happy with the steel being a long-haul, chip-away project.
I get to run through songs for about 20 minutes each night I put the kiddos to bed, and a bit more on weekend days, though that time is split with other instruments. So there just isn't enough connective time to make the sort of progress I did on the banjo a couple of decades ago.
And because time is short, I spend most of my Hawaiian guitar time playing what I already know, attempting to improve my intonation, technique, timing, etc. Time well spent, I know, so I'll just need to be happy with a handful of tunes for now. Maybe I'll get Sol's Aloha Oe Blues line eventually, but not soon.
Thanks! I'll put these suggestions to use in a few years, once the nest is empty. Though I'm not in a hurry to have that happen. 😀 |
|
|
|
Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 12 Mar 2023 11:02 am It’s so easy!
|
|
Learning a song by ear is about learning music by ear. Nobody ever told me that, so I found out the hard way. After I learned a few things about music, songs and transcribing got a lot easier. I have never really written or tabbed anything out (ick!), but I eventually learned how to read tab and notation, which I highly recommend.
I agree with learning the chord progression first. That gets me the key and gives me a basic idea of where the melody is coming from and the timing of the phrases. Hardest part for me has always been rhythm, so I use a metronome for slowing way down and getting the timing right.
I learned harmony by ear from listening to Poco and the Allman Brothers when I was a teenager and learning the chord progressions to their songs. Those complex vocal and twin lead arrangements made hearing and playing back melodies much simpler because melody notes basically run among the 3rds and 5ths of the underlying chords.
I had to practice “hearing” the intervals. It was part of studying scales and basic theory, which was essential for me in ear training. There is free software now for that. Listening and playing back, that’s how I learned it.
You also really have to know the instrument. Learn where the notes are, the intervals, chord partials, as well as all the various techniques for expression and accurate execution.
Piece o’ cake, right? |
|
|
|
Bryce Van Parys
From:
Washington, USA
|
Posted 16 Mar 2023 3:41 pm
|
|
If you can sing it you can play it. Of course, the better you sing in tune the better you play in tune 
I find that if I play with my eyes closed I listen and tune on a much higher level.
_________________
Bryce
Double bass, Mike Lull V4, G&L SB2 electric bass, Stratocaster, Telecaster, Les Paul, Martin D18GE, |
|
|
|
Steve Marinak
From:
Man O War Cay, Abaco, Bahamas
|
Posted 17 Mar 2023 11:12 am
|
|
I have always learned best when playing along with the "record". I did that in college, lifting the needle and re playing over and over while I played along. Nowadays I use an App on my phone called AnyTune. It's probably like the Transcribe app mentioned above. AnyTune allows me to slow down the song. Or change the pitch to a different Key signature. Those are the two features I use. If you can read notation, that can help as well. I typically find the sheet music, play through it on regular guitar quickly both the melody and the chords to make sure the sheet is correct, I can sight read well on regular guitar. Then I use a combination of learning the song by ear and double checking the "correct" notes in the validated sheet music. One thing I have noticed. If you learn the song without relying on the sheet you will remember it better. If you sight read and take away the sheet...it doesn't stay in my brain! LOL I am better off learning by ear and visualizing the tones on the fretboard for long term retention.
_________________
Steve Marinak |
|
|
|
Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 17 Mar 2023 6:17 pm
|
|
| Bryce Van Parys wrote: |
| If you can sing it you can play it. Of course, the better you sing in tune the better you play in tune |
I can’t sing most of what I can play, but I can play most of what I can sing.
Or as Joe Walsh might put it, if you can smoke what you play you can drink what you get. |
|
|
|
J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
|
Posted 18 Mar 2023 11:40 am
|
|
| David Knutson wrote: |
| I generally find that if I can hum it or whistle it, I can find it on my steel. Then it’s a matter of finding the most efficient way to play it in a given tuning. But getting the melody firm in my brain is the best start for me. |
I was just going to say the same.
It seems that from the birth of the 20th Century “everybody” wants to “play by ear”, but increasingly, NOBODY seems it worth while to LISTEN.
Learning to make music by ear starts away from the instrument. Becoming conscious of the tune, able to hum or “scat” sing it, becoming very aware of the “directions” the melody takes (up or down).
Showers, laying in bed watching the ceiling, driving and traveling are good moments to do that.
Then, finding the progression would seem a good further step.
Evidently, one would have to have the ability to “lay out” a progression in any key on the fretboard to take advantage of that knowledge.
Everything else, like jumping right at the axe and try to “fiddle” around scales or pockets is NOT playing by ear.
In parallel, one should have a good understanding of chords ON the instrument and having practiced enough to recognice at least SOME sound and patterns once they are heard, analized and concious.
… JD.
_________________
__________________________________________________________
Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
|
|
|
