| Visit Our Catalog at SteelGuitarShopper.com |

Post new topic Making A Change
Reply to topic
Author Topic:  Making A Change
Larry Ball


From:
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 9:01 am    
Reply with quote

I have decided to remove the two bottom strings off my “Williams” SD12 Extended E9. I just have simply lost interest in the Extended E9 an I am focusing on playing my SD10’s (Mullen and Sho~Bud). I want to listen to the sound to hear if there is any tone changes. If so I may put the strings back on and sell the guitar. It is a beautiful sounding guitar, but I prefer the 10 string.
_________________
Sho~Bud SD10 LDG, Show-Pro SD10 LDG, Peavey Nashville 112, Boss Katana 100 MK11, Telonic's F100 Multi-Taper Super Pro V/P, Wayne Brown “Custom Designed Amp”
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Richard Sinkler


From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 9:35 am    
Reply with quote

Probably won't be any change in tone. I took off the 2 bottom strings on a Mullen SD12 I had and noticed no difference.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Roger Rettig


From:
Naples, FL
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 10:30 am    
Reply with quote

I have a Williams 12-string on order, Larry. I currently play a D10 (which I will be keeping) but I've been tempted to try D13; I started with Johnny Cox' idea and made the odd change in accordance with my priorities.

I'm responding to your thread because, in the back of my mind - and should the D13 with it's extra 6th note on string 5 prove to be an insurmountable hurdle for me - my 'plan B' has always been to switch it to an Extended E9. I'd love to have a low E that I could drop to a C#!

(I should add that the D13th set-up will be studied hard and given every chance: Plan A is to stick with it.)

My Williams will have 7+6, so it'd make a loaded E9, for sure. I love the E9 tuning but have always felt it lacked low-end range. And here you are abandoning it. Smile

I agree with Richard: I can't imagine that you'll alter the tone significantly or, in fact, at all.
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
----------------------------------
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Larry Ball


From:
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 11:45 am    
Reply with quote

I don’t seem to play the same way or enjoy the SD12 as much as the SD10. That may come from the fact I never played a C6 etc and I don’t know how to play the bottom strings to get the best advantage of that sound. “Yes” I also found something missing on the E9 at the bottom end that’s why I purchased the SD12. However every time I go back to playing the 10 I seem to find more satisfaction in my playing. I need maybe to do more research on playing the Extended E9 with the usage of the bottom strings.
_________________
Sho~Bud SD10 LDG, Show-Pro SD10 LDG, Peavey Nashville 112, Boss Katana 100 MK11, Telonic's F100 Multi-Taper Super Pro V/P, Wayne Brown “Custom Designed Amp”
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Roger Rettig


From:
Naples, FL
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 11:58 am    
Reply with quote

Well, I don't think the character of E9 is lost just because we add a low G# and E on 11 and 12. I would add the G# to A raise to the B pedal on the 11th.

For me, the vital string is the D at the 9th. Do you have that on your Williams or is yours a universal type tuning?

I have my 10th (on my D10 E9) lowering to an A. That helps a bit but just makes me want more range down there. As it is, the low string on E9 is no lower than a guitar's 5th string at the second fret.

However, if you're comfortable as it is, nobody can argue with that. It's you that has to be happy with it.
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
----------------------------------
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 12:19 pm    
Reply with quote

I find the 11th string is where the magic is for E9x. I don’t have the 12th string lower to C# or D (yet) and it only really functions as a root for the open position. Overall feeling is, not going back to S10.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Roger Rettig


From:
Naples, FL
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 12:29 pm    
Reply with quote

Fred:

Do you have E and G# at 12 and 11?
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
----------------------------------
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Larry Ball


From:
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 1:34 pm    
Reply with quote

Thx for your input Roger..

Yes I have my 11th string with the G# A raise on my B pedal.

Plus I have my 12th with E to F raise with the LKL and lower to D on pedal 3
_________________
Sho~Bud SD10 LDG, Show-Pro SD10 LDG, Peavey Nashville 112, Boss Katana 100 MK11, Telonic's F100 Multi-Taper Super Pro V/P, Wayne Brown “Custom Designed Amp”
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 2:43 pm    
Reply with quote

Roger Rettig wrote:
Fred:

Do you have E and G# at 12 and 11?

Yes. B pedal on 11, no changes on 12. I’m enjoying the setup immensely.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post  Posted 15 Jan 2023 11:06 pm    
Reply with quote

Hi Roger,
Easier to share a pic of my copedant in public 😎

View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Roger Rettig


From:
Naples, FL
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 4:08 am    
Reply with quote

Thanks, Fred.

Do you split-tune your P1 and P2 to get the C note?
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
----------------------------------
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Richard Sinkler


From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 5:00 am    
Reply with quote

Roger Rettig wrote:
Thanks, Fred.

Do you split-tune your P1 and P2 to get the C note?


I also have my B to Bb changes on a pedal. Since I am a Day player, it's P4 next to my A pedal, although I do not split to get the C note as I am fairly good at half pedaling the A pedal. I do see an advantage of split tuning it if I had to get the C note quickly. I use it to get an partial F#9 chord using strings 3-4-5 mainly, but it has no 1 and 5 tone, although adding strings 1 and 7 will get a root, and string 6 will get another 9th tone. The sound I get on 3-4-5 is similar to using pedal 5 on C6 with strings 2-3-5 to get a D9 partial chord, again using the 3, b7, and 9 notes of the D9 chord. I use the Bb more for this use than I would ever use it for the C note.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Roger Rettig


From:
Naples, FL
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 5:24 am    
Reply with quote

Richard

As the split-tune function is available on all strings on my Emmons, I have everything adjusted just in case: C pedal/E lower, A pedal/RKL on E9, pedal 7 on C6/3rd and 4th string lower and the same with my P4 that raises the As to B.

I will have to get used used to the A pedal/RKL split being 'on the floor' (as you have it) when my D13th 12 string comes: P4 on that replicates the old C6 P5 and serves the same purpose (albeit in another key).

Now, my E9 P4 lowers 9,6,3 to C#,G and G - it gives me a m7b5 or, at zero fret, an A9.

I believe Travis Toy also lowers his 5th and 10th on the floor. He explained the logic of that to me and I could see what he meant. Back then, I didn't want to change. With my new guitar, I'll find out if it works for me.
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
----------------------------------
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 7:03 am    
Reply with quote

Yes I have the split to C on P1&2.That is the only split I have. Like Richard, I don’t use it as much as I thought I would. Nice to have it though. Bb on the floor gets a lot of use, as does rocking on 1&2 like AB. I wanted the vertical for G, so the Bb on P1 decision kind of made itself.

Right now I am only reconsidering the Franklin pedal on P5, which I rarely use. I just have not developed a very good technique for jumping over to it and then getting back into my default foot position. If I spent more time on that, I might actually use it more, so I don’t think putting a different change on it would make much difference unless I really liked the change.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Larry Ball


From:
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 1:45 pm    
Reply with quote

Thx for all the comments regarding the SD12 Extended E9, I had a couple of sleepless nights thinking about them. Taking the two bottom strings off left the guitar cosmetically hard to look at. This is a beautiful looking and sounding guitar so now I was left with a sad feeling that I had created. Therefore strings are back on and I plan on giving it another go coming from a different perspective.
_________________
Sho~Bud SD10 LDG, Show-Pro SD10 LDG, Peavey Nashville 112, Boss Katana 100 MK11, Telonic's F100 Multi-Taper Super Pro V/P, Wayne Brown “Custom Designed Amp”
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Bill McCloskey

 

Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 2:26 pm    
Reply with quote

Larry, I had the exact same issue you did. I had a Williams S12 Ext E9 as my first pedal steel. I also took the bottom two strings off, didn't like the way it looked and put them back on. Then in a weird twist of fate I was able to sell my 12 String Series 700 Williams and buy a 10 string Series 700 Williams within a 48 hour period. A week later, I'm playing a beautiful 3x5 10 string Williams.

Before:



After:

View user's profile Send private message
Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post  Posted 16 Jan 2023 6:30 pm    
Reply with quote

Bill, your “Before” is almost the spittin image of mine. The only differences are a 5th pedal and a black burst burgundy finish. Both of them are stunners! But glad you are happy with the “After” too😎
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Jump to:  
Please review our Forum Rules and Policies
Our Online Catalog
Strings, CDs, instruction, and steel guitar accessories
www.SteelGuitarShopper.com

The Steel Guitar Forum
148 S. Cloverdale Blvd.
Cloverdale, CA 95425 USA

Click Here to Send a Donation

Email SteelGuitarForum@gmail.com for technical support.


BIAB Styles
Ray Price Shuffles for Band-in-a-Box
by Jim Baron