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Topic: FIRST MSA Millenium Produced ,,PICS ADDED |
Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 25 Oct 2022 8:37 am |
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Testing the water for interest in the very first, numero uno, carbon fiber S12 universal, 8 pedals, 5 knees,,,signed as such by Reece, Kyle and Sonny. This guitar has been virtually unplayed the past 20 plus years,,,,looks the same as when it came out of the MSA workshop. With new Legends going in access of $6000 and months waiting time,,what would be the value of this guitar,,,I'm thinking something north of $6500??? Includes Texas flight case on wheels and extra pick up.
Last edited by Sonny Jenkins on 5 Nov 2022 9:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
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David Decker
From:
Canton, Ohio, USA
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Posted 26 Oct 2022 4:48 am
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| Can you post pictures? |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 26 Oct 2022 5:18 pm
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| Yes David,,I've not even set it up yet,,in the middle of selling my house and moving. Give me a few days. I honestly don't think this guitar was ever played,,if it was it was very little. Not a mark anywhere on it. Surely it will be a collectable. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 27 Oct 2022 1:02 pm
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| Would welcome comments and opinions as to the value of this guitar, considering what new ones are selling for today. |
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 28 Oct 2022 9:01 am
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| Sonny Jenkins wrote: |
| Would welcome comments and opinions as to the value of this guitar, considering what new ones are selling for today. |
The guitar you have is a 1st generation Millennium. Different changer, different belcranks, different knee levers etc. Many improvements have been made since that guitar was built. Having said all that it's still a great guitar that is no longer being built.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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memphislim
From:
Austin, Texas
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Posted 28 Oct 2022 9:13 am
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| We need a full set of pics Sonny so we can see what Johnny is referring to. |
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Douglas Schuch
From:
Valencia, Philippines
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Posted 28 Oct 2022 9:41 pm
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| Quote: |
| Different changer, different belcranks, different knee levers etc. Many improvements have been made since that guitar was built. |
Johnny Cox
Johnny, I would love to see a detailed explanation on the various Millennium generations - what changes where made, etc.
I've owned an 06 M2 and an 07 M3. There were some obvious changes - alloy vs. Carbon laminate pedal bar and knee levers. But if there were distinctions in the changer or pull system, I never noticed them. There is rather solid info on the various models of Sho-Buds and Emmons, but not the Milly's. It might be good to get it in the record while you and others still have it fresh in your minds as these guitars were built to last - probably longer than many of us will live!
_________________
Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental! |
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 29 Oct 2022 9:48 am
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| Douglas Schuch wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Different changer, different belcranks, different knee levers etc. Many improvements have been made since that guitar was built. |
Johnny Cox
Johnny, I would love to see a detailed explanation on the various Millennium generations - what changes where made, etc.
I've owned an 06 M2 and an 07 M3. There were some obvious changes - alloy vs. Carbon laminate pedal bar and knee levers. But if there were distinctions in the changer or pull system, I never noticed them. There is rather solid info on the various models of Sho-Buds and Emmons, but not the Milly's. It might be good to get it in the record while you and others still have it fresh in your minds as these guitars were built to last - probably longer than many of us will live! |
The M1 had a three raise / 3 lower changer. Four and five hole belcranks, carbon fiber knee lever handles, carbon fiber legs and pedal bar and an open end keyhead.
M2 is when we added a 4 raise hole in the changer. By default it changed the geometry of the pulls a little but for the better. Also the knee levers and pedal bar got changed to aluminum for looks. The three piece keyhead was replaced with a one piece billet aluminum keyhead.
M3 upgraded the belcranks to the 13 hole that has remained and legs were changed to aluminum.
The Legend, Studio Pro and Tour Pro have the same mechanics as the M3. There have been a couple other tweaks since I worked there all for the better. Also since I left the addition of Lfrets and Aura Lites have been a very positive addition.
I personally hated to see the Millennium go away. The reasons were because 20 years ago there were few people to make those bodies and they were very expensive. The other reason is that most players wouldn't give it a chance because it wasn't wood. Bobbe Seymour didn't help that with all his "Plastic guitar" B.S. either. I loved the Milly's I had and am looking for an S12 now.
I believe that the current line of MSA guitars are the best all pull guitars available today.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 1 Nov 2022 8:43 am
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| Johnny Cox wrote: |
| Douglas Schuch wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Different changer, different belcranks, different knee levers etc. Many improvements have been made since that guitar was built. |
Johnny Cox
Johnny, I would love to see a detailed explanation on the various Millennium generations - what changes where made, etc.
I've owned an 06 M2 and an 07 M3. There were some obvious changes - alloy vs. Carbon laminate pedal bar and knee levers. But if there were distinctions in the changer or pull system, I never noticed them. There is rather solid info on the various models of Sho-Buds and Emmons, but not the Milly's. It might be good to get it in the record while you and others still have it fresh in your minds as these guitars were built to last - probably longer than many of us will live! |
The M1 had a three raise / 3 lower changer. Four and five hole belcranks, carbon fiber knee lever handles, carbon fiber legs and pedal bar and an open end keyhead.
M2 is when we added a 4 raise hole in the changer. By default it changed the geometry of the pulls a little but for the better. Also the knee levers and pedal bar got changed to aluminum for looks. The three piece keyhead was replaced with a one piece billet aluminum keyhead.
M3 upgraded the belcranks to the 13 hole that has remained and legs were changed to aluminum.
The Legend, Studio Pro and Tour Pro have the same mechanics as the M3. There have been a couple other tweaks since I worked there all for the better. Also since I left the addition of Lfrets and Aura Lites have been a very positive addition.
I personally hated to see the Millennium go away. The reasons were because 20 years ago there were few people to make those bodies and they were very expensive. The other reason is that most players wouldn't give it a chance because it wasn't wood. Bobbe Seymour didn't help that with all his "Plastic guitar" B.S. either. I loved the Milly's I had and am looking for an S12 now.
I believe that the current line of MSA guitars are the best all pull guitars available today. |
As insightful as like Maurice was still with us, Johnny. Thanks!
Do you know if the TONE changed tru the two main M1 vs. M2&3 and current models?
MSA is definitely doing something right, because for a PSG they sound extremely nice.
Kyle and Mitch seem to suggest that the middle "comb" seems to "do it"... I frankly don't know.
Thanks!... J-D.
_________________
__________________________________________________________
Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
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Marco Schouten
From:
Amsterdam, The Netherlands
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Posted 1 Nov 2022 10:43 am
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The early models had the Williams-style changer fingers. The had to stop using this and went to a conventional design.
_________________
----------------------------------
JCH SD-10 with BL XR-16 pickup, Sho-Bud Volume Pedal, Evidence Audio Lyric HG cables, Quilter Steelaire combo |
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David Decker
From:
Canton, Ohio, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2022 12:46 pm Msa
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What is this version? with this keyhead.
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 3 Nov 2022 6:08 pm
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| J D Sauser wrote: |
| Johnny Cox wrote: |
| Douglas Schuch wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Different changer, different belcranks, different knee levers etc. Many improvements have been made since that guitar was built. |
Johnny Cox
Johnny, I would love to see a detailed explanation on the various Millennium generations - what changes where made, etc.
I've owned an 06 M2 and an 07 M3. There were some obvious changes - alloy vs. Carbon laminate pedal bar and knee levers. But if there were distinctions in the changer or pull system, I never noticed them. There is rather solid info on the various models of Sho-Buds and Emmons, but not the Milly's. It might be good to get it in the record while you and others still have it fresh in your minds as these guitars were built to last - probably longer than many of us will live! |
The M1 had a three raise / 3 lower changer. Four and five hole belcranks, carbon fiber knee lever handles, carbon fiber legs and pedal bar and an open end keyhead.
M2 is when we added a 4 raise hole in the changer. By default it changed the geometry of the pulls a little but for the better. Also the knee levers and pedal bar got changed to aluminum for looks. The three piece keyhead was replaced with a one piece billet aluminum keyhead.
M3 upgraded the belcranks to the 13 hole that has remained and legs were changed to aluminum.
The Legend, Studio Pro and Tour Pro have the same mechanics as the M3. There have been a couple other tweaks since I worked there all for the better. Also since I left the addition of Lfrets and Aura Lites have been a very positive addition.
I personally hated to see the Millennium go away. The reasons were because 20 years ago there were few people to make those bodies and they were very expensive. The other reason is that most players wouldn't give it a chance because it wasn't wood. Bobbe Seymour didn't help that with all his "Plastic guitar" B.S. either. I loved the Milly's I had and am looking for an S12 now.
I believe that the current line of MSA guitars are the best all pull guitars available today. |
As insightful as like Maurice was still with us, Johnny. Thanks!
Do you know if the TONE changed tru the two main M1 vs. M2&3 and current models?
MSA is definitely doing something right, because for a PSG they sound extremely nice.
Kyle and Mitch seem to suggest that the middle "comb" seems to "do it"... I frankly don't know.
Thanks!... J-D. |
The tone changed for the better on the M3 due to changing the scale from 24" to 24 1/4. Also the material used to make the changer finger was changed. All for the better.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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David Decker
From:
Canton, Ohio, USA
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Posted 3 Nov 2022 8:14 pm
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| No one can answer my question? |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 4 Nov 2022 5:38 pm
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David, that appears to be an M2 Millennium. 
~ |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 5 Nov 2022 8:59 am
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I now have pictures that I will try to post,,,sometimes I have trouble posting from my phone. If not you can email me and I can send email or message. This guitar is virtually brand new,,,still set up the same as it came from MSA.
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 5 Nov 2022 9:35 am
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Forgot to post this one
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 6 Nov 2022 5:43 pm
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The first S-12. Man I wish I could buy it.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 6 Nov 2022 5:51 pm
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The first S-12. Definitely an M1 with the exception of the aluminum legs it looks completely original. Those first guitars had carbon fiber legs.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 7 Nov 2022 5:09 am
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| I believe this guitar to be 100% original. The production of the Millenium brought about several innovative changes in the MSA lineup,,,,this guitar was the first. |
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Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 7 Nov 2022 7:52 am Re: Msa
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| David Decker wrote: |
What is this version? with this keyhead.
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M1 with the modified keyhead.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 7 Nov 2022 8:17 am
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| Sale is pending |
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David Decker
From:
Canton, Ohio, USA
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Posted 9 Nov 2022 9:02 am Msa
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| Johnny Cox, sent you a private message with more info on my MSA. |
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