A question of bars

Virgil Franklin · From: Indiana, USA

I've been playing pedal steel for roughly 8 months and have worked with
3 different instructors...
each instructor says I need to change from my preferred bar, a Schubb SH 1, to a standard PSG bar (which I hate)!
After being told the tone would be BETTER with the bar I did a side by side spectrum analysis and....
drum roll please..
NO DIFFERENCE IN FREQ CONTENT!
Any thoughts on this?
_________________
Virgil Franklin
Organizer: Southern Indiana Steel Guitar Show www.southernindianasteelguitar.com
2023 Justice Pro-lite 4 x 4,2020 Justice Pro-Lite 4 x 4 , Fender 400 6 x 2, Stringmaster Mk1 Clone, Gibson Console Grande 520, Boss Katana 100 Mk2 with Basslite 2012 speaker

Andrew Goulet · Posted 10 Jan 2022 12:04 pm

I say use whatever works. Ever seen Bobby Koefer play?

That being said, it's probably a good idea to give the bullet bar a solid try, even if it's just swapping out bars for a small percentage of your practice time every day. The mass (once you get used to it) may make playing in tune easier (and maybe easier on your hand, paradoxically). The shape may make smooth, even vibrato easier. And the fully rounded tip won't ever catch on a string.

I personally don't like Shubbs, even for resonator or lap playing, so I just use a smaller bullet bar for those. But if you do a lot of pull offs and hammer-ons, there's nothing better, as I understand it.
_________________
Marlen S12 and a ZT Club

Lee Gauthier · From: Victoria, BC, Canada

I'm curious what older players have to say here. I used a schubb when I first started playing lap steel but switched to a bullet bar when I started taking it a bit more seriously. I can't really explain why but the bullet feel easier to play. Everything is more fluid with one and I can get my slants in tune much easier.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

The Schubb will eventually wear, causing string noise. Round bars spread the wear over a much larger area, and therefore will last far longer. As far as playing, anything you use is okay as long as it doesn't inhibit your playing and your style. But the teachers may be noticing something you're not, so beware of that possibility. With only 8 months of experience, you not only don't know a lot about playing, you also don't know a lot about what to listen for; but that will come as you progress.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Virtually all pedal steel players use a bullet bar - have you wondered why? Three teachers in 8 months is some turnover. I can understand why you might feel reluctant to let go of a bar that's easier to hold, but tone is something you hear with your ears, not look at on a scope. Pedal steel is all about movement from one sound to the next.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs

Greg Forsyth · From: Colorado, USA

When I started playing steel guitars I couldn't get used to the round bullet bars either, and liked the Shubb Pearse bars much better. Somehow thru the course of a couple of years I obtained a couple of other round bullet bars that I can use comfortably now. Part of it is finding a bar that suits you. Diameter and length are a big part of it, and also the material its made with.

I also have a round bullet bar that has grooves in it that I really like. Similiar to an old bar named the Red Rajah. It was made by Micheal Hillman, and has a powdercoated surface. Here's a link to his posting about the bars he sells.

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=270422&highlight=michael+hillman

Bob Bestor · From: Ashland, OR

Robert Randolph uses a Shubb. He's pretty good.
_________________
Keep on truckin'

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

One thing you will see using a bullet bar is that you can get the really nice rolling vibrato characteristic of the sound most players find appealing about playing pedal steel.

Not saying it can't be done with a Shubb or other narrow base grooved bar, but you're most likely to get bar shake vibrato vs. the rolling bar vibrato.

My suggestion is to keep a bullet bar handy to try now and again. If the 7/8 in. feels uncomfortable, try a 3/4 in.

If you don't already have a bullet, the Dunlop 918 and 920 are perfectly fine for pedal steel. You can get them here at the forum store for around $30. There's no need to pay obscene $100 bar prices.

As your playing progesses and your ear improves, you'll at least have the opportunity to compare them.

Happy Pickin'.

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

There is a difference in how the bar lays on the strings between a Shubb bar and a more standard bullet type bar. This does make a difference. To play in tune with a shubb type you need to bend your wrist because you are clutching the bar. If you play with a bullet bar your hand can relax and you can more gently guide the bar. It does sound different. If you have decided to use a shubb bar no matter what go ahead and use it. Do whatever works for you. You may come up with something really cool or you may find your teachers knew something you didn't.
_________________
Bob

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

Lately, I've been using the very heavy Robert Randolph Bar Shubb RR-2 for dobro, lap steel, and pedal steel. It's a grooved bar 3.25" long x 6.8 ounces. Going to one bar for multiple instruments has simplified my life, and I don't regret it.

Richard Alderson · From: Illinois, USA

I would say go ahead and use the bar that makes you the most comfortable. You will eventually outgrow the smaller bar, it won't sound as full as the large heavy bars and eventually you will notice that, and you will want the deeper and richer sound that the heavier bars produce.
_________________
Derby SD-10 5x6; GFI S-10 5x5; GFI S-10 5x5; Zum D-10 8x7; Zum D-10 9x9; Fender 400; Fender Rumble 200; Nashville 400; Telonics TCA-500.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

I sometimes use a Shubb SP-1 for nonpedal steel. For me, this is style-dependent. When I am doing a lot of picking up and putting down of the slide, bar slams, and other stuff where the need to have a real good grip on the steel outweighs the smoothness and tonal advantages of the large bullet bars I tend to use on pedal steel, I use the Shubb. In fact, when playing a lap or console steel, that is quite a bit.

But for pedal steel, I mostly slide from position to position on the strings, as is typically traditional for pedal steel. So I use a pretty large (15/16" diameter x 3-5/8" long) BJS or Zirconium bar. Despite your finding of no distinction in spectral frequency content, I can definitely hear a difference in overall sound, smoothness, and especially sustain, as compared to the Shubb. I can use the Shubb for pedal steel, no problem - but I believe my ears over any instrumental analysis. And I agree with other points about getting the smooth, rolling vibrato and slant technique with the Shubb - I have to alter my technique (in ways that some people deem 'inappropriate') for either of these. But it works OK for my specific usage of the Shubb.

Anyway - I would always use a bullet bar on nonpedal steel too, if I could function with a small one. But I have long and slender fingers, and I have trouble holding onto a small bullet bar - they really cramp my fingers. Lord knows I've tried, but I can't seem to get comfortable with them. So the SP-1 is a good compromise for when I really want to be able to lift up and drop down the bar a lot. Western swing, blues, and that kind of stuff.

Larry Dering · From: Missouri, USA

My playing bar use is exactly like Daves. Shubb for lap steel and Dobro, 15/16 bullet bar for pedal steel. This works best for me.

Forum Index > Pedal Steel		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic

All times are GMT - 8 Hours	Jump to: