Msa Millennium Question's

Johnie King · From: Tennessee, USA

Was wondering if some of you that have owned a Millennium steel could tell me the pros an cons of a Millennium MSA.

john buffington · From: Owasso OK - USA

I once owned one, biggest mistake I ever made selling it, still regret it to this day! They IMO are the Rolls Royce of steel guitars. Never could get away from the P/P tone though.

Johnny Cox · Posted 11 Sep 2021 1:13 pm

I personally think it was / is the best idea in pedal steel in decades. I owned a couple both D10 and S12 and built about 75 of them. The original needed some improvement which it got. The M3 is one of the best playing and sounding guitars I ever played. Many guys couldn't hear how good it sounds for looking at them and not seeing wood. I truly wish with today's carbon fiber tech that MSA or someone would pursue it again. A keyless carbon fiber guitar would be awesome. Wish I still had a S12.
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Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967.

Johnie King · From: Tennessee, USA

Thanks for chiming in Johnny.

Douglas Schuch · From: Valencia, Philippines

I have owned two Millies, late model '06 M2 and an 07 M3. I sold the M3 when I was down on my luck post-hurricane Irma in the US Virgin Islands. Prior to the Millies, I played Zums, and also had a couple of 70's Sho-Buds I restored. For me, nothing comes close to the Millie of the steels I've owned.

My main reason for going to the Millie was stability, since I live in the tropics (USVI and Philippines), including time living aboard my sailboat. This is not an environment that is friendly to wood guitars, particularly laminate-covered ones. Boats and most houses in the tropics are open to the weather, as our temps do not get as high as most of the US in summer, and do not vary much - it's warm and moist almost always. Wood absorbs moisture, and swells. Laminate does not. So over time, the laminate will come loose. The amount of swelling was never bad enough to cause problems with the mechanicals, but it is possible. My last Zum I kept under a tarp with a mini-dehumidifier, or in it's case with large Silica sachets, to keep it from having issues. The Millie solved all of those issues.

Mechanically, I think it rivals or surpasses anything out there, or at least, anything I've played. Add to that a very light weight (I made a flight case for mine to keep weight down) and great tone, and what's not to like? Before selling them, I had chances to compare the Millies to both my Zum D-10, and my vintage Sho-Bud S10 and D10. I preferred the tone of the Millie. YMMV.

Negatives: There is not an easy way to add an extra cross-shaft for an extra lever of pedal. MSA recommended sending it back to them. My '84 Zum had already figured this out - not sure why MSA could not do so in this century!

M1 (I think) and M2's have a pedal bar assembly that locks into a carbon-fiber shell that forms the finished outside. It uses allen screws to achieve this - but this can be problematic, and may need adjusting. M3's (the one I had, anyway) had an all alloy pedal board like most other brands. I'm sure, if there are problems with this, an easy fix would be to drill through the front of the carbon shell and into the body of the alloy frame that fits inside it, and either tap that and put in some short round-head bolts, or through-bolts. You would lose the slick, smooth look of the carbon shell - there would be 2 or 3 bolt heads on it. But worth it to get a precisely locked-in-place pedal board.

I am not a fan of the pedal shape - it is smooth and rounded - similar to later Sho-Buds or Emmons. Zum always had a bit of a "tractor pedal grip" to it, and I just found that easier when I needed to catch the edge of the pedal with the edge of my shoe to roll on and off an adjacent pedal. I suspect there are just as many people out there who love that pedal style and hate the Zum tractor-grip.

That's my take on them. I'm happy with the one I have. I might be selling it if I can figure out how to ship it affordably from the Philippines - I've just not been playing steel at all for 9 months - very busy playing blues harmonica with a blues band and just never felt I was that good on pedal steel. And, quite frankly, I could use the money!
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Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental!

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

The good things are the light weight, and the excellent sustain. The lightweight body also doesn't hold heat - it doesn't get hot, even in direct sunlight, and the tuning is extremely stable. Of course, with the CFC body there's nothing to warp, crack, or split as with wood guitars, and it's not affected by moisture. The pedal rods are all the same length, so there's no need to mark them or put them on in any order. The length adjustment (which governs the pedal height) can be made quickly under the guitar via knurled wheels while seated at the guitar. The plug-in pickups are also handy if you want to quickly change pickups. (But I seldom do.) The snap-on pedal bar is quick and easy to use. The end plates and necks are chrome plated, so there's no polishing or tarnishing to worry about.

There are some downsides, though. The thin/light body telegraphs more mechanical noise than a (heavier) wood guitar. Since the plug-in pickups are specially modified, they're more limited in availability and also more expensive than those in other guitars. The pedal stop is not as rigid and solid as the old MSA guitars, and it will flex slightly (on the end pedals) with heavy foot pressure. Also, the knee levers aren't as rigidly mounted as those on wood body guitars, since the surface they're mounted to is fairly thin and also covered in fabric. I'm not crazy about the ball-stud fittings at the top of the pedal rods, as they're slower to use than hooks, but that's a personal thing. I also think the pedals are too small, but that's also a personal thing. (Most modern steels now have tiny pedals...for some stupid reason.)

(Note: My guitar was one of the earliest made, so it has a few more problems...problems which were probably addressed on later models. I'll explain those via PM to anyone who is interested.)

Per Berner · From: Skovde, Sweden

Back in around 2005, when shipping across the pond still was quite reasonable, I was offered a universal S12 Millennium with something like 7 pedals and 6 knee levers, nearly new, for $2800 (!) from a US builder who had got it as a trade-in from a pro western swing player. I went for a D10 Legrande II instead. Stupid me! Sad

I would really like to have an S10 M3!

Duane Dunard · From: Troy, MO. U.S.A.

Donny Hinson nailed it on his above assessment. I really, really like the MSA Millennium guitars, especially now that Iâ€™m almost 75 years old, still working jobs, and equipment weight is suddenly important In my life. Also, I can leave my guitar in my van after a band job at 2AM in below freezing Missouri temperature and not worry about lacquer finish damage. Donâ€™t do that to a wood guitar! There is a slight difference in tone between the M-2 and M-3 model, probably due to the difference in scale length and the newer M-3 changer design, but both sound great with the right pickup and right amp. My 2004 model M-2 guitar has the 24â€ scale and is my preferred go-to guitar.

Malcolm McMaster · From: Beith Ayrshire Scotland

My Milly is older one, previously owned by Fred Shannon, it had been hard worked but still in great condition, so I sent it back to factory to have it updated to latest standards, Kyle and Mitchell did a superb job on it. It is lightweight, I use Scott Dixon case, which means it is 21kgs( two kgs under the 23kgs that most international airlines use), so is ideal for flying with. I love the fact that pedals/ levers can be adjusted while sitting at steel, the pick up is so easy to change( not that I do). The carbon body is very stable as regards tuning, and the sustain/tone is as good as any other steel I have played.The engineering and build quality are absolutely superb.I would also love a S10 Legend as well but definitely not in place of my Milly.
In conversation with Kyle about reason they no longer built them he explained that the company who provided the bodies had greatly increased the cost, and increased the minimum order numbers ( into hundreds at a time) making it financially impossible to continue with them.

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MSA Millenium SD10, GK MB200, Sica 12inch cab, Joyo American Sound Pedal/ Jay Ganz Straight Ahead amp, Telonics 15inch in Peavey cab, Digitech RP150, Peterson tuner.Hilton volume pedal.Scott Dixon seat and guitar flight case.

Mike Castleberry · From: El Paso, Texas USA

I've owned three 24" scale MSA Millennium guitars prior to the one I currently own. They are great guitars with many positive features and have almost all of the features of the MSA Legend guitar. Pickups and amplification have greatly improved over the years aiding in much better tone quality for the Millennium guitars. The Millennium III I currently own is a 24 1/4" scale and I think the long scale produces better sustain above the 12th fret and gives the guitar better overall tone quality. I don't have any regrets owning my 2007 MSA Millennium III. The MSA staff are always there to help with issues and parts if needed.

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