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Topic: Steel guitar tone from same Maufacture. |
Johnie King
From: Tennessee, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2021 7:33 am
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Most All newly manufactured steels have good playability these days and have good tone.
Then there's that one that's a lemon.
Last edited by Johnie King on 31 Jul 2021 5:49 pm; edited 4 times in total |
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richard burton
From: Britain
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Posted 31 Jul 2021 9:26 am
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Tastes change.
Some guitars of yesteryear, considered lemons at the time, have mysteriously matured into diamonds |
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Larry Bressington
From: Nebraska
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Posted 31 Jul 2021 11:13 pm
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It would be interesting to know exactly what a lemon means?
I’ve heard some good steels with a bad player, but I’ve never heard a good player with a bad steel… _________________ A.K.A Chappy. |
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Roger Rettig
From: Naples, FL
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Posted 1 Aug 2021 5:37 am
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There's a coincidence. That's been my experience too, Larry. _________________ Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, Quilter TT-12 & TT-15, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Ricky Davis
From: Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 1 Aug 2021 11:04 am
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My job for last 25 years has been "restoring; refurbish; update; reconfigure; fix parts and setting up" over 100 Pedal steel guitars so far. I have taken completely apart most Sho~bud models and handful of "Marlen; MSA; ZB/BMI..and more". Yes indeed; seeing every kind of wood used; metal casting; machined metal; so many different parts and how everything is assembled and completely all that makes a diff in sound and playability. So I do have many comparisons in those factors of what makes a pedal steel sound like it does. Actually it is hard to acknowledge the exact reason for "Lemon"; But I have more of an idea, then someone who has not taken apart and put back together original pedal steel guitars for 25 years.
But if you are wondering why a certain steel is a LEMON? you have to do many things for information; otherwise this is a worthless conversation as because of the HUGE amount of factors that go into all pedal steels and even side-by-side comparisons would lead to head scratching...ha...
Ricky _________________ Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com
Last edited by Ricky Davis on 2 Aug 2021 1:46 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Johnny Cox
From: Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
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Posted 1 Aug 2021 4:22 pm
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Unlike Ricky I can't tell you why a Lemon is a Lemon. Some guitars though built exactly the same just don't sound, play or feel as good as others. I've even seen and played guitars made with boards from the same tree that were totally different. Sometimes you get a great one, most are average and sometimes you get a Lemon. It goes for every single brand too. _________________ Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967.
Last edited by Johnny Cox on 1 Aug 2021 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Larry Dering
From: Missouri, USA
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Posted 1 Aug 2021 6:42 pm
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You must turn the magic screws. Haha. Acoustic and electric guitars suffer the same fate. Same wood, same builder yet different tone. No clue why that is the outcome. Especially in the world of CNC machines. |
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Joe Krumel
From: Hermitage, Tn.
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 4:21 am same guitars,different sounds
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I retired from Gibson custom shop doing final assembly/setup. after 16+yrs playing thousands+ high end guitars, I can tell you they vary a bunch. play 20 LP's and they're good,then the next one is pure gold.dont know why,but I'll bet its the same at steel guitar Mfg. shops. JK |
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Larry Bressington
From: Nebraska
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 5:02 am
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That’s awesome Joe good work my friend.
About 20 years ago I went to a music shop to buy a telecaster, I called the owner up and told him I was going to come in blindfolded, and asked him to line them up as I did not want my eye be the deciding factor, there was custom shop down to the Chinese ones, I was also not going to be influenced by price. Whilst i was trying them all, the owner said; I don't hear any difference, they all sound the same.
I walked out with a black Mexican telecaster that was incredibly lively indeed and had the wood tone that tickled me. I’ve always believed it’s a tree that mostly is responsible for the tone which is why I’ve always said that the same brand can sound so differently no matter what. I wouldn’t say the others were lemons though, they just didn’t have that spank and sparkle, more thud like.
Acoustic guitars are hugely different sounding, same make, same model, same tree maybe.
When players refer to (that sound) I think mostly it’s the player styling more than the brand, you’re not really going to hear the difference unless you have them all side-by-side for a comparison, sales are hugely driven by marketing and what the greats are using, and when they change brands everybody else wants to change brand, but typically nothing changes, except an empty wallet. _________________ A.K.A Chappy. |
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Jerry Overstreet
From: Louisville Ky
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 6:29 am
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I have owned 3 different Mullen Pre Royal guitars from the same era, 2 of them at the same time where I could compare them side by side.
While they all have some similar characteristics, they each sound different. One of them was particulary sweet and my favorite guitar ever. Just better all around. No question. |
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Donny Hinson
From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 6:35 am
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Johnny Cox wrote: |
Unlike Ricky I can't tell you why a Lemon is a Lemon. Some guitars though built exactly the same just don't sound, play or feel as good as others. I've even seen and played guitars made with boards from the same tree that were totally different. Sometimes you get a great one, most are average and sometimes you get a Lemon. It goes for every single brand too. |
I agree totally! The two obvious reasons for the differences are the wood and the assembly technique. No two pieces of wood are exactly alike, and there's often much variation even in the same plank, as far as density, grain structure, and mineral content. As far as assembly, I don't know if any builder uses torque wrenches for assembly (I seriously doubt it), but I do know that you can't get really consistent results without using one. |
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Johnie King
From: Tennessee, USA
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 8:58 am
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It's a shame we can't go too a local music store an try a lot of different pedal steels an brands.
Last edited by Johnie King on 2 Aug 2021 10:23 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Joe Krumel
From: Hermitage, Tn.
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 9:41 am same guitars,different sounds
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Yeah,it was very common at Gibson plugging in your guitar and you and guys working around you would all lo
ok and pause when you had one of those "wow" guitars.
You felt the vibrations and sustain in your chest. I bet it's no different at steel shops.
My friend Ken Davis from Lima Oh. had an old sho-bud permanent I think it was,and It was sooo musical and vibrant.
Last edited by Joe Krumel on 2 Aug 2021 9:44 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Johnie King
From: Tennessee, USA
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 9:44 am
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Yes a good player can make a average steel sound good too the public.
But most pro players don't settle for average steels. I would imagine if they have a endorsement too play a certain brand steel the manufacturer do there best too make sure it's not a average steel. |
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Larry Bressington
From: Nebraska
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Posted 2 Aug 2021 5:26 pm
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I enjoy these type threads… it’s hard to imagine though that professional player (John Doe) could have a company build many steels and have him try out a ton of them built to his/her specs and take the pick, what would they do that would/could make it so special? I assume it’s: build me a steel this colour and this set up, plonk these pick ups in it and I’ll play it. _________________ A.K.A Chappy. |
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