Pickup Voltage?

Daniel Morris · From: Westlake, Ohio, USA

I just ordered the JHS Little Black Buffer.
The website's description includes this:

The LITTLE BLACK BUFFER is designed to work with input signals that are below 10V input gain. Anything above 10V INPUT GAIN will cause the unit to clip. Not recommended for use with bass guitars.

I was told this refers to a guitar's pickup, and that they are typically much less than 10V.
Does anyone (Jim Palenscar?)know if pedal steel guitars are also generally less than 10V?
_________________
1979 MSA U12 Pedal Steel
1982 Kline U12 Pedal steel
2019 Sierra U12 Pedal Steel
2011 Bear Creek MK Weissenborn
Milkman 40W Mini amp w/Telonics 15" speaker.
Dr. Z Surgical Steel w/TT 15" speaker.
Frenzel MB-50 head.
Spaceman, Empress, Eventide, Pigtronix.

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

Pickup voltage is in the millivolt range "Instrument level".

Active pickups (ones with electronics that amplify) can have hotter (higher) levels, but I've never heard or seen a 10V signal.

Daniel Morris · From: Westlake, Ohio, USA

Thanks, Jack.
I'd been told it wasn't likely pedal steel exceeded 10V, but I figured the best place to check is the Forum.
_________________
1979 MSA U12 Pedal Steel
1982 Kline U12 Pedal steel
2019 Sierra U12 Pedal Steel
2011 Bear Creek MK Weissenborn
Milkman 40W Mini amp w/Telonics 15" speaker.
Dr. Z Surgical Steel w/TT 15" speaker.
Frenzel MB-50 head.
Spaceman, Empress, Eventide, Pigtronix.

Greg Cutshaw · From: Corry, PA, USA

35 to 250 mV depending on a lot of factors for passive pickups. Great article with numbers and scope photos here:

https://sound-au.com/articles/guitar-voltage.htm

Daniel Morris · From: Westlake, Ohio, USA

Some of that is a bit beyond my comprehension, Greg, but thank you for the details.
Once I can try the buffer, I imagine I'll know if my pickups are too high in voltage, but it seems unlikely.
_________________
1979 MSA U12 Pedal Steel
1982 Kline U12 Pedal steel
2019 Sierra U12 Pedal Steel
2011 Bear Creek MK Weissenborn
Milkman 40W Mini amp w/Telonics 15" speaker.
Dr. Z Surgical Steel w/TT 15" speaker.
Frenzel MB-50 head.
Spaceman, Empress, Eventide, Pigtronix.

Georg Sørtun · From: Mandal, Agder, Norway

FWIW: back when I did such measurements, I routinely marked off attack-peaks above 3V (3000mV) on scope for a George L Pentad wired as regular humbucker on my main PSG, into a 1Mohm load. RMS was rarely above .250V (250mV) with that load.

As impedance (load) is one of the factors that affect peak levels from passive PUs the most, what may be the norm for 4-6-string PUs don't tell all that much about the output from a 10-12 string PUs in a higher impedance.

All peak measurements I noted up was well below 10V though, and peak-clipping isn't all that noticeable, so I don't see any problems w/passive PUs into the mentioned buffer. Few other buffers on the marked can handle that high signal-peaks anyway – most clip at levels above around 2V and nevertheless sound just fine.

Daniel Morris · From: Westlake, Ohio, USA

Thanks for the additional info, Georg.
I found it interesting that you figure most buffers can't go above 10V; JHS mentioned it, but otherwise I'd have had no idea.
_________________
1979 MSA U12 Pedal Steel
1982 Kline U12 Pedal steel
2019 Sierra U12 Pedal Steel
2011 Bear Creek MK Weissenborn
Milkman 40W Mini amp w/Telonics 15" speaker.
Dr. Z Surgical Steel w/TT 15" speaker.
Frenzel MB-50 head.
Spaceman, Empress, Eventide, Pigtronix.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

My findings several years ago were the same as Georg's. Some highly wound steel pickups are able to produce several volts of signal, and I think 5 volts or thereabouts was the highest I saw. This was while either strumming potently, or playing full Chalker-type chords with authority on C6th. I don't think you'd ever exceed 5 volts, and it would be unlikely in normal playing you'd even get close to that number. Typically, I'd expect most players would seldom exceed 250 millivolts.

Of course, if you have a powered pedal that's cranked up too high... Oh Well

George Biner · From: Los Angeles, CA

The phrase "10V input gain" is incorrect -- voltage gain is the ratio of output to input voltage and so it doesn't have any units ("gain of 1, gain of 4, etc"). And as other people are saying, you are never going to get anything near 10V output any normal pickup. Must be a typo on the website.
_________________
Guacamole Mafia - acoustic harmony duo
Electrical engineer / amp tech in West Los Angeles -- I fix Peaveys
"Now there is a snappy sounding instrument. That f****r really sings." - Jerry Garcia

Daniel Morris · From: Westlake, Ohio, USA

Thanks, George and Donny.
JHS being a notable pedal builder, I'd be surprised to find out that the 10V was a typo. But then, I've been known to be wrong....
I do use a powered volume pedals - Telonics and Goodrich Omni - but I don't try to test any limits.

I really appreciate the sharing of knowledge by Forum members.
_________________
1979 MSA U12 Pedal Steel
1982 Kline U12 Pedal steel
2019 Sierra U12 Pedal Steel
2011 Bear Creek MK Weissenborn
Milkman 40W Mini amp w/Telonics 15" speaker.
Dr. Z Surgical Steel w/TT 15" speaker.
Frenzel MB-50 head.
Spaceman, Empress, Eventide, Pigtronix.

Forum Index > Electronics		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic

All times are GMT - 8 Hours	Jump to: