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Topic: Standard copedent |
Ake Banksell
From:
Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 5:56 am |
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Could you please tell me if this is the real established standard E9th copedent? If there is one standard? https://www.williamsguitarcompany.com/standard_e9_c6_setup.htm
It isn't the Jeff Newman copedent I expected once I bought my 700series 5 yrs. ago. My psg has been resting in the case since I've been ill all these years and I wasn't a big expert then and will probably never be. |
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Al Evans
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 6:22 am Re: Standard copedent
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It sure looks like what I've got on my pedal steels.
(Although the one with the Franklin pedal has three additional changes.)
--Al Evans
_________________
2018 MSA Legend, 2018 ZumSteel Encore, 2015 Mullen G2, G&L S-500, G&L ASAT, G&L LB-100, Godin A4 Fretless, Kinscherff High Noon |
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Ake Banksell
From:
Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 6:44 am
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Thanks Al. That RKL I've never seen before and I can't see it in my old litterature with Jeff Newman either.
What's the meaning with lowering the 6th string to F# as that's just where the 7th string already is? |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 7:29 am
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The Newman copedents are outdated. There are others that became "standard" after Jeff passed.
The GFI E9th/C6th charts are more common.
https://www.gfimusicalproducts.com/documentation.html#E9Copedent
The old Carter stock copedent was the same as GFI.
My Franklin's copedent, except for one additional change is the same.
The only thing the charts do not show is the "split tuning" (on all pull guitars). The E9th 5th string and 6th string lowers "split" with the pedal raises. For example with the AB pedals down and lower the 5th string with the LKV turns a major chord into a minor. The 6th string lower with the B pedal raise also turns a major into a minor. I also use the 6th string lower in conjunction with the 4th or 8th string lower to go from a "5" chord to "1" chord classic pedal steel ending. There are others these are just a couple of examples. |
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Bill C. Buntin
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 7:49 am
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Ake
I would say that what you have is standard. Sometimes this becomes subjective once you move past 3 pedals and 3 levers on e9 and 5 pedals and 1 lever on c6.
As far as I’m concerned on e9, lowering b notes on 5 and 10 is also a standard. I might add the gfi c6 example that jack has provided is probably more standard in the traditional sense. I might also add, in the modern c6 sense, that one could argue if you have a d note on string 1 c6, it makes good sense to sharp the c notes on a knee lever. In other words. The d note on string 1, in combination with the raised c notes is fairly standard on modern c6, in my opinion. At least considering when learning from buddy and Paul for c6.
One could ask where does the standard become custom or when do custom changes become standard?
For the most part, most of us employ those standard changes you have on your guitar.
Bill |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 16 Dec 2019 9:39 am
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| Ake Banksell wrote: |
Thanks Al. That RKL I've never seen before and I can't see it in my old litterature with Jeff Newman either.
What's the meaning with lowering the 6th string to F# as that's just where the 7th string already is? |
In the bolded part above, that is the wrong way to look at the lever. After all, we lower the 4th string from E to D# (same as string 2). It's not just the note, but what you can do with the note, like movement, mixing with other pedals/levers. There are several times when a pedal/lever gives us the same note that is on another string.
I really like the ability to move the sixth string from F#-G(split tuned with B pedal)-G#-A for melody work. That F# on 6 with the lever that lowers the E's to D#, gives you a B chord (5 chord in the key of E). Of course you can get the same chord using string 7, but it is nice being able to move the 5th tone (F#) up to the dominant 7th (A) [releasing the lever and pressing the B pedal]. Can't do that using string 7 unless you raise 7 to an A note (which I have never seen done), or use bar slants. I can't pick 4,5 and 7, slanting 7 up 3 frets while keeping the other 2 strings in tune.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Ake Banksell
From:
Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted 17 Dec 2019 1:38 am
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| Thank you all very much for great information, I am very new to these levers. I have never learned to play the traditional country music that comes automatically with the instrument as I guess. Although I understand very well Richards point with the levers, that's a big fundamental part with the pedal-steel. |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 17 Dec 2019 4:16 am
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You have all the common changes.. Your copedent is standard.
bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Ake Banksell
From:
Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted 17 Dec 2019 5:34 am
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| I also bought myself a Strobo plus after this Williams purchase 5 years ago. Petersons still refer a lot to the Newman E9th tunings, that's why I believe Jeffs copedents might still be the standard. |
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Al Evans
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 17 Dec 2019 6:12 am
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| Ake Banksell wrote: |
What's the meaning with lowering the 6th string to F# as that's just where the 7th string already is? |
I use it a lot to go from 3->2 (or 2->3, but I have that change, too, for string 7 on RKR) in melody playing. I must like doing that a lot. 
--Al Evans
_________________
2018 MSA Legend, 2018 ZumSteel Encore, 2015 Mullen G2, G&L S-500, G&L ASAT, G&L LB-100, Godin A4 Fretless, Kinscherff High Noon |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 17 Dec 2019 7:43 am
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| Al Evans wrote: |
| Ake Banksell wrote: |
What's the meaning with lowering the 6th string to F# as that's just where the 7th string already is? |
I use it a lot to go from 3->2 (or 2->3, but I have that change, too, for string 7 on RKR) in melody playing. I must like doing that a lot.
--Al Evans |
Yup. Gives the same sound that you get by letting off the A pedal in the pedals down position. I use it for that too.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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