String 4 debacle

Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

This may have been covered, but a review of ideas would sure help.

Having become intimate with my Carter and set it up to the best of my ability, the fourth string raises well with the C pedal, returns like it's supposed to.

Lowering with the E lever (LKR) causes it to return sharp by several Hz; the F lower (LKL) will bring it back to within 1 or 2 Hz; pressing the C pedal will bring it back to true.

I can't reason this one out. Does it need a stronger (shorter) return spring? Adjustment/lubrication of the compound raise lever?
Thanks for any help offered.

Dave Baldwin · From: Saskatchewan, Canada

hi chuck sounds like a q for bud dave

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

Hysterisis.

Do a search for this and you will find tons of info.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

This is why I play a gearless guitar.

Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

THE STRING LENGTH IN THE KEYHEAD! I should have known it.
Thanks Jack, you had a lot of good posts on this and I'll go through them more carefully later.

As always, you're a big Help, Bobby.
Where do I get these compensators, at the hardware store, or the psychologists's office?
And can we let Marty back in from the cornfield yet?

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

I don't think you can add compensators to a Carter Starter, Charlie. I'd just remove the lowering rod. That change isn't really necessary.

ducking...

Hey, that's what I did on my Sho-Bud Maverick, and on a Speedy West D-10 that I played for a couple of years. Lloyd Green doesn't lower his 4th string. Some guitars tune up better without that change. You have the same note on your 2nd string anyway.

------------------

Bobby Lee (a.k.a. b0b) - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Williams D-12 E9, C6add9, Sierra Olympic S-12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop S-8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster D-8 (E13, C6 or A6)

Jim Phelps · From: Mexico City, Mexico

My old Sho-Bud permanent D-11 was like that, didn't lower the 4th string. I got used to it. I'd almost kill to have that guitar back, was the sweetest-sounding steel I've ever owned.

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

The knee lever that lowers the 4th and 8th a half tone is my most used KL.

richard burton · From: Britain

Charlie,
Just to double-check that it's hysteresis and not something else, back off the nylon tuners at the changer, and operate the fourth string changer finger by hand, raising and lowering, and observe the return spring while you do it.
R B

Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

Richard, I'll do that; you see to have pretty good tips so far.

I got my little psg oiler; oiled that roller at the nut. Oh well. I was getting to where I liked that change. I may have to convert RKL to do that.

Speaking of; why doesn't the 5th string come up sharp after a lower? It also has a long un-singing string length at the machine head. I'm thinking there's more to this than meets the eye....
Thanks, all.

Good ducking, b0b.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Charlie, either your pulling train is messed up (spring problem, lubrication, not enough slack), or you need to "free up" the nut roller. Make sure it spins freely (both with and without a load) and make sure the string is coming off the roller absolutely straight! The "hystereisis" inherent in a keyed guitar might make it come up a cent or two a sharp...but not a hertz or two! If you can't fix it, just take it to someone who knows guitars. It can be fixed.

Oh yeah, and don't listen to any malarkey about gearless/keyless guitars being a panacea. They aren't!

Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

Thanks, Donny. I'll always listen to anyone who is willing to debunk propaganda.

The string comes off straight; I've oiled the nut roller and the compound lever. I have yet to take the nut and rod off and check the finger.
I'm still investigating, as I agree with you: if it is mechanical, it can be fixed.

Curt Langston · Posted 1 Sep 2005 3:52 am

Ditto what b0b said! That is just one reason a keyless tuner is superior. Period.

------------------
I'd rather be opinionated, than apathetic!

Dick Wood · From: Springtown Texas, USA

I've owned three Carters and I've never experienced that problem Charlie.I owned a Dekley years ago that did have that problem and it frustrated me for a long time trying to fix it which I never did.

As a side note,I own another Dekley D-10 that doesn't have that problem so go figure.

------------------
Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night.

[This message was edited by Dick Wood on 01 September 2005 at 06:20 AM.]

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Donny wrote:

Curt Langston · Posted 1 Sep 2005 7:27 am

Forum Index > Pedal Steel		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic

All times are GMT - 8 Hours	Jump to: