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Topic: I am not the enemy! |
Ganey Arsement
From:
Louisiana, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 6:34 pm |
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I have had G.A.S. for a pedal steel for about a year, now.  My bud, Danny Cormier, sent word that he had one that I might be interested in, and I should come get it for the weekend to try it out. I did!  
With tuning charts and copedents in hand, I set up in the back room. Boy was that a disaster! Three days was enough for me to realize that the pedal steel is not for me. I usually take to new instruments pretty quickly. This has only happened to me one other time...when I attempted the fiddle. I have decided that I will stick to my Martin. I hope I haven't offended anyone.  |
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Frank Parish
From:
Nashville,Tn. USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 6:50 pm
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| Three days huh? You need to give it at least five or ten years to really get a feel for it and buy at least $1500 worth of gadgets, intructional material, tuners, picks and don't forget at least ten or fifteen different kinds of bars not to mention a guitar, amp, seat and at least one or two processors to play with. Three days ain't long enough to work up a good f**t. [This message was edited by Frank Parish on 26 June 2005 at 07:51 PM.] |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 6:52 pm
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Ganey.. you are not giving it enough time.. Its not easy, but if I can do it anyone can. I have the attention span of a gnat,and I learned to play.
It took a LOT longer than 3 days though!
My advice to you is this.. DO NOT sell yourself short so quickly... Give yourself the time needed to learn a few basic tunes/licks.. I would not quit after just a few very short days.... I wish you luck... bob |
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Wayne Cox
From:
Chatham, Louisiana, USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 7:27 pm
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| GANEY I am from Louisiana and ,yes,I do live in a swamp,but it is a nice swamp. Although times have changed here a lot since I was young, I still remember the advice given to me long ago,when I started learning steel guitar down here. Like you I was a bit frustrated with my feeble attempts,and I asked a professional teacher/player a simple question:"If I practice a lot,how long will it take me to become an average player?" His reply: "If you practice 4-8 hours a day for 4 years,you will be an average player!" Nowadays,there are many teaching aids available which have shortened that learning curve to one or two years,but it still takes determination. Just hang in there,keep trying,and go kick a gator in the head if you get too frustrated! ~~W.C.~~ |
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Charles Dempsey
From:
Shongaloo, LA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 7:55 pm
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Ganey,
I got my first steel middle of April this year. I played it two hours and more each day, sweating over tabs, screeching slides, missing frets, resonating the back strings, missing the pedals, and picking the wrong strings. I worked hard at it. Failure was not an option because I'd already bought the damned thing.
Three weeks later I finally realized that the long practices weren't helping. Next morning I ran through the songs once, and put the bar down. An hour or two later I went back and ran through them again. I took a couple hour break and did it again. By the fourth session I was markedly better. A couple of hours later I turned the radio to an old country station and tried to play along with whatever was on.
Those two tactics saved me a lot of frustration. Short frequent practice and freestyle with the radio.
It's not you, it's the instrument. Steel guitar is an easy instrument to play.......... badly. I've been playing 2 1/2 months, and I still suck, but I can play "All my exes", "Waltz of the Angels", and most of "I never go around mirrors". I'm a lot better than I thought I'd be at this point.
Life is good,
Charlie (only had to kick two alligators off the doorstep this evening  [This message was edited by Charles Dempsey on 26 June 2005 at 08:59 PM.] |
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Pat Carlson
From:
Sutton, Nebraska, R.I.P.
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 8:37 pm
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Ganey, I have been at it for just about 3 years. Just starting to get comfortable with the pedal steel.You have to earn the ability to play.Afer telling a pro player once I wish I could play like you! He said you can! All you have to do is practise 8 hours a day for 20 years. 
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The Lone Prairie Steeler Pat
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Al Terhune
From:
Newcastle, WA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 9:50 pm
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| The pedal steel and fiddle? Two of the more harder instruments to really get down. They might not be for you, though -- but...I'll bet they are!!! |
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James Davis
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2005 11:39 pm
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| I bought my P.S.G.on just the notion that one day I might recreate some of the sounds I had heard my whole life.And when I was able to play one of those sounds and it sounded close.I was forever changed to the musician who would be forever studying this art form till the days are all gone for me.If anyone said they sounded good after 3 days,I find that hard to believe.I never even thought about quiting.I can play a very good lead guitar.not great!I did know the number system.and read and completed a music theory book.so I set out to understand how I could transfer the things I had learned on six string to ten strings.I made several charts to let me see my chords inversions.How each push and pull of a pedal or a lever made common scales.for a while I was blowing my mind that I was still at the first stage.then when the chords all came into view in my mind there on that e 9th neck I was able to make a small leap into the big idea.And started to put together song I had played the guitar onto the steel guitar.Making all these chord was getting easier every day.I am trying to educate myself by all means possable.I must have spent countless hours on research to find tab's.And this is the place to start.here in side this groupe of musicians I know I will find countless ways to play my sho~bud.In hope of one day letting it rip on the steel like the men and women who read and write in this forum.And I know I read somewhere The best of the best still had to try over and over again until the were satisfied.It didn't matter how many times I do a lick on the guitar or any Inst'If you want it bad enough you will get it done.Seems I had more desire than wisdom.After I spent that kind of money on my rig! It was do or die.I have a fiddle collecting dust too.My pedal steel is as clean as it ever was.Old but not a speck of dust on it.Get serious about it brother!But don't beat yourself up over it.Said with due concern.James Davis |
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Billy Carr
From:
Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 12:44 am
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| You went through what most players, myself included all did. THE BEGINNING. It took me two years just to learn how to tune my guitar. Of course that was a long time ago before we had all the tuners like everybody has now. One thing I tell new players is it's sort of like building a house. First, you've got to have a good foundation to build on. This is very hard for some players to do. Start with the basics and build that foundation. The more you work at it the better the foundation will be. Then once you have that foundation to work off of things will be easier. Just like a house with a strong foundation, you can build anything you want on it. Same goes for steel guitar playing. You can play anything you want to if you have the foundation there. I've been playing since 71' and I'm still learning little things that have been right there in front of me all these years. The steel guitar is an instrument that is unlimited! Stay with it. You've already crossed the first hump. You bought one! |
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Robert Porri
From:
Windsor, Connecticut, USA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 1:18 am
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Ganey,
I really think that what you needed was somebody who is a good teacher show you some basics. I'm pretty certain you could pick up some basics fairly quickly and find some sounds that would tease your interest. Seems like you locked yourself up in a room with a bunch of confusing materials and had no idea where to start and got frustrated. Did you think playing PSG would be easy? It's not. Now you're convinced it's not for you. I don't think that is necessarily the case. It really just sounds like you set yourself up doing it the way you did. Buy or borrow a PSG if possible, find a good teacher and take some lessons, practice a few months and then decide. You didn't give yourself a chance with the instrument.
Bob P. |
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 2:32 am
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I got my Bud knowiung it would be a ,ong roe to hoe.
I had played dobro and lapsteel going on 30 years.
Pedal Steel WAS harder, markedly, 3 days is just not enough to tell plain and simple.
If even now you still love the sound and want to make it, get a cheap used steel or and or Carter Starter, with a bvasic vlume pedal, and give it 3 months, not days....
At that point you can tell something about the instrument. I refuse to be frustrated I don't play like the cats playing 30 years+... why should I.
But it is clear 3 months minimum is needed to make a keep on or chuck it decision.
Mu
Just my 44.356427 cent |
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Ganey Arsement
From:
Louisiana, USA
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Charlie McDonald
From:
out of the blue
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 4:05 am
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Ganey,
My experience was similar to yours. I had an easy time learning instruments, so I assumed I'd just slide right into steel.
I bought the worst one there ever was, and sold it in no time, discouraged as heck.
Since then, I've had the chance to sit down to a really good instrument, and the owner showed me a few things. Eventually I'll get a better one, and just take my time with it. It's complicated.
Meanwhile, I keep reading the forum, learning little bits here and there.
Charlie |
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Webb Kline
From:
Orangeville, PA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 4:16 am
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It was easily the most challenging instrument I ever attempted to play, but now, 26 years later, it has been the most rewarding, enjoyable instrument of all 14 that I have endeavored to explore.
It has also helped my skills on the other intsruments as well. You'll never regret toughing it out if you're hooked on the sound. |
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Ray Minich
From:
Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 4:45 am
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| I would suffice it to say it's probably easier to learn neurosurgery than to pick like the "masters". Three days? Let the paint dry first. |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 5:13 am
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Ganey - I've done the grad school gig (twice - yikes!), and you're right, it's tough to find time. But if you love the sound like the rest of us on here obviously do, it's probably possible to fit in enough time to work on your steel playing (and it takes a lot of long-term consistent work). I think a carefully disciplined 1/2 - 1 hour per day is worth more than several daily hours of aimless noodling, and even when taking batches of engineering, math, and computer science courses, I found I could do that.
Either way, 3 days is definitely not enough time to evaluate this. Perhaps this isn't the right time for you, but don't just give it up completely. I'll also say that my first grad school trip, for the first 3 years I put all my guitars away - what a mistake! When I pulled them back out, I found that that 1/2-1 hour a day helped clear my head for more analytical thinking. I resolved I wasn't going to put off everything I wanted to do, I needed to continue with my life. But, of course, YMMV. Best of luck. |
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Dave Van Allen
From:
Doylestown, PA , US , Earth
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 5:31 am
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Heck, you already spent the $5 to join us here on the Forum... that's not a committment to take lightly
Give it some time, and try to get past the ego part that tells you "I consider myself pretty musical, and in general, can play a couple of songs in public on a new instrument within a couple of days."
This is a differrent beast entirely, initially harder than almost any other instrument exactly because the notes aren't always in the same place.
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| I don't know if I would be strong enough to invest time and money in an instrument that I might not feel comfortable playing in public for a year. |
Okay, if that's the way you feel, but the "Return on investment" is incalculable!
Like they say on "Jay-Jay the Jet Plane"show... "Think about it!"
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 5:54 am
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| I don't know if I would be strong enough to invest time and money in an instrument that I might not feel comfortable playing in public for a year. |
Good grief, I daresay MOST of us would not be playing today if we'd applied that standard to ourselves at the beginning. Get on board and enjoy the ride. You'll get there sooner or later... |
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Terry Edwards
From:
Florida... livin' on spongecake...
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 7:43 am
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| I have decided that I will stick to my Martin. |
Anybody can play a Martin!
Playing a steel...well, that's an achievement!
Terry
Martin D-21, Fessy D-10, Flatiron mandolin
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Joseph De Feo
From:
Narberth, Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 7:47 am
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Ganey-
I've had my Bud a month and a half now. It took a lot of faith to spend that much on
a guitar I had never even tried. I already play guitar and lap, but this is a new ball
game. I'm ready for a long haul, but enjoying the journey is part of the fun! I play every night and already see changes.
Stick with it, good luck. [This message was edited by Joseph De Feo on 27 June 2005 at 08:50 AM.] |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 8:17 am
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Ganey..take a deep breath..
maybe you are right..
I think I can safely state that Steel Players have the total deep emotional desire to play that "SOUND"..and will stop at nothing..and I mean nothing....
If you have the desire ..but do not have the "total deep down inside stop at nothing" thing going on then maybe it is not your time..yet....
We have all been there done that with many things in our lives..put things away then came back to them at a later date...with nice success...
Maybe step back, take a breath..come back to it down the road...
at least your thinkin'...
t |
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Charles Dempsey
From:
Shongaloo, LA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 8:51 am
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quote:
Tony Prior
I think I can safely state that Steel Players have the total deep emotional desire to play that "SOUND"..and will stop at nothing..and I mean nothing....
That's it exactly. I don't care if I ever play well enough to get in the majors. I've got to make that sound!
That and the fact that there's several thousand 6-string players here in Hayrideville, and I can name the active steelers on the fingers of one hand.
Charlie
"There's nothing like a steel guitar crying in the night" - CB |
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Bobby Lee
From:
Cloverdale, California, USA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 9:12 am
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| Quote: |
| I consider myself pretty musical, and in general, can play a couple of songs in public on a new instrument within a couple of days. That is, when the notes you are looking for are always in the same place. |
I recently started learning marimba, and was struck by how much easier it is when you only have one place to find each note. I grew up playing guitar and bass, where you can find a note at one place on each string. Pedal steel adds a new dimension to that.
For example, to play a C note on the 4th string E, we typically go to the 8th fret. But if we use the 3rd pedal (confusingly called the "C" pedal), the C note is at the 6th fret. If we raise the string half a step with "F" lever, C is at the 7th fret (sort of - actually you have to aim a bit high of the fret because of intonation issues). Finally, if we use the lever that lowers the E strings, our C note migrates to the 9th fret.
This complexity is what makes it so hard for pedal steel players to read music. Remember, what I described above is just for one string. That C note is also available at several frets on each of the other strings.
Pedal steel instructional material tends to avoid this issue. We learn to play by learning scale and chord positions by rote.
But all is not lost. We have a sneeky advantage in that we can easily modulate by by moving the positions we've learned up and down the neck. A piano (or marimba ) player has to learn the D scale separately from the C scale. But once a pedal steel player knows how to play in C, he can simply move the bar two frets higher and play exactly the same thing.
I've seen piano players fall off their chairs when the singer says "can we do this in B instead?". For the average steeler, this is no problem at all. No alternate fingering (or sticking ) or tricky accidentals are required.
90% of pedal steel playing is major key stuff. Most steelers rarely play anything beyond that traditional mode. The scales and chord positions are movable, so we really only need to learn them once.
Many steel players don't even know the names of the chords they're playing. I can figure out the name if asked, but it's not in my consciousness when I'm playing. If you could read my mind you'd get "one, four, five, flat the 7th, two minor, five, one sixth, four ninth, three minor, five augmented" etc. In other words, we tend to see everything as relative to the current key or chord, not as discreet, named notes.
Yes, the notes move around a lot, but the overall system is stable. Things stay exactly the same from one key to the next. That's the big secret to playing pedal steel. The notes change, but you only really have to learn them in one key.
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 Bobby Lee (a.k.a. b0b) - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Williams D-12 E9, C6add9, Sierra Olympic S-12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop S-8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster D-8 (E13, C6 or A6)[This message was edited by b0b on 27 June 2005 at 04:32 PM.] |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 9:32 am
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Very well put b0b.. I always thought about the pedal steel in very similar terms to those you stated, but was never really able to verbalize the concept.
You did a good job at describing my "mental image" of basic pedal steel playing bob |
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Bill Moore
From:
Manchester, Michigan
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Posted 27 Jun 2005 9:51 am
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The physical part of learning to play the pedal steel takes a lot of practice. Learning to pick the correct strings, block the strings cleanly, and, at the same time, use the correct pedals and levers takes a lot of repition. You really need to find a teacher who will show you the proper technique, then practice it relentlessly. Don't worry about how it sounds at first, the object is to master the basic technique. The sound will come around if your technique is good. And don't be afraid to buy some of the excellent courses available from players like Jeff Newman or Joe Wright. But nothing beats putting in the time behind the guitar, Good luck.
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Bill Moore...
my steel guitar web page
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