Fender 400 Tuning Ideas?

Andy DePaule · From: Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon

I'm getting a Fender 400 with 6 pedals that should arrive on Thursday.
Never have owned a steel with pedals and no knee levers before so looking for tuning ideas from others with experience.
I like the idea of going to a D6/9 like Bob uses to lower the tension and possible string breakage of a guitar without roller nuts.
The guitar is one raise and lower per string, but I've come up with a simple design idea to rig a second note tuning (Half stop) under the steel.

So far I've come up with this that gives many of the most used 9th changes but I'm looking for ideas;

Of particular interest would be to get some 6th tuning changes as I've also little experience with that. I like the 5th, 6th and 7th pedal changes on C6th.
Thanks in advance,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Is the second string the highest pitch? Is that a high A string? If so you won't be able to raise it to B. If not, you may want something else high.

Andy DePaule · From: Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon

Thanks Ernest,
Right, that A is the high that I'd want.
I'm on pain meds (Oxycodone) from surgery last Tuesday to remove a tumor, so still not thinking as clear as I'd like.
In my normal state of mind I'd have spotted that right away.
Okay so now I've disconnected that cable in my minds eye and, now what!...

That got me thinking I could maybe change the first string to a pull to F with pedal 2 and get a D7 on the top four strings? That would be a very useful change.
Still ready for ideas of good observations like that.
Best wishes,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.

Jim Palenscar · From: Oceanside, Calif, USA

I generally setup the 400's w the typical AB pedals in the middle w the 1st pedal the typical F lever (E-F) and the 4th pedal the E lower (E-D#) and then you could add 6th changes to the right of that. Depending on the scale you can do either E or D tuning. Good luck and have fun Andy Smile

.

Andy DePaule · From: Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon

Thanks Jim,
That's what I did with the first 3 pedals.
Then the 4th is kind of like the E9th 3rd pedal and also similar to the C6th 7th pedal.
Getting a nice Dmaj9th and an A6th chord to boot. All three good in a D9th tuning.
Best wishes,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

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-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video

Andy DePaule · From: Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon

Thanks Bob,
That's one of the things I thought of, but would need to use two feet on the pedals way better than I do now.
On the other hand if I got good with two feet, those changer would be much smoother than say jumping from pedals 2&3 to 1&2 with just the left foot.
Whatever I decide there will be a learning curve.
Still leaves 2 pedals for D6th changes undecided?
Best wishes,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.

Michael Maddex · From: Northern New Mexico, USA

Andy, a couple of general suggestions here from the Proud Owner of a Six Pedal 400, which is currently off the flight deck awaiting repairs. Once you get your new guitar, clean if up, put on some new strings and set up some pulls. I think that you are on the right track if the Nashville E9 sound is what you want. After you have done a couple of setups and see how easy it is, I think that you will quit thinking/worrying about what to do and just Try A Few Things Out. If you are looking for something a little different from the Nashville Sound, you might want to take a look at some of the setups that of the Sacred Steelers are using. You can click on the Links link at the top of any Forum Page and then choose Copedants for a great long listing.

HTH. Enjoy! Cool

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"For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert." -- Arthur C. Clarke

Andy DePaule · From: Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon

Thanks Michael,
Don't want to loose those main E9th sounds.
Is your steel tuned to E9th? I'm interested because I'd prefer an E or A tuning just to be in territory I'm used to.
The picture in your avatar looks just like the 400 I'm getting.
Mine does not have roller nuts and that's why I'm thinking of tuning down to D to avoid breakage, but maybe they don't break in E?
The guitar is in good condition for a 51 year old that has not been in the closet for 50 years.
All the chrome looks real good, the changer looks quite clean.
Has the usual dings and checked lacquer we expect, but I'm good at refinishing so thats no big issue.
I'm wanting to get some C6th changes on the extra two pedals as I've been learning that tuning over the past 3 months. Still not adjusted to the E being at the 4th fret.
Best wishes,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.

Jason Duguay · From: Massachusetts, USA

Bob, Jim & Michael are smart people and their thinking is solid. I would recommend in addition to their suggestions, as It's easy enough, to take an evening and actually play ( not just look at ) ol' Pete's B6. It's not perfect, but it's worth the trip.

https://b0b.com/tunings/stars.html#b6pk
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Ralph. Mooney.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Andy, I'll email you the "mini" version of Sneaky Pete's B6 copedent that I worked out for 6-pedal 400's. The tuning is exactly the same as Pete's (as are the first 3 pedals) if you want to look on the sites copedent listing.

For me it was not only extremely easy as far as learning simple pedal steel "stuff" to cheat my way through, but the fact it's a 4th lower than usual E9 and E7 copedents eliminates string breakage and sounds *really* strong because of the larger string gages. It's also right in 6-string sound territory and position-wise many chords are easy to find as they relate to 6-strign positions.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

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