Lookin' for help w/ mechanical issues, replacement parts

Charlie Dawson · From: North Dakota, USA

Hey there, I'm new to the Steel Guitar Forum. I'm also pretty new to pedal steel guitar. A couple months back I bought a pedal steel off craigslist from a fella that didn't play. Somehow wound up with this thing in his lap. He didn't know much about it, but the price was right so I took her home. It wasn't functioning as intended when I bought it. Some parts had gotten disconnected, some had to be adjusted, nothing too major. I've managed to get her up and running pretty well, but there are some issues still that I sure would like some insight on.
1. The B pedal still has a little bit of "wiggle room". As in, there is some distance that it can move before it engages the "puller" thing. (I'm guessing that there's a name for it besides "puller". If somebody could tell me what that name is, I sure would like to know.)
2. The rods still will fall out of the "puller" every once and again. This used to happen all the time, to the point that it was almost unplayable. Then I realised that I had the rods in upside down and backwards. (I feel real dumb about that one, so we'd don't need to let any chicks know about that, ok?) But, they're still not perfect.
3. The bar that goes across the back, that the pedals are connected to, moves. I think it's just a shitty design. It's held on the legs by an aluminum clamp with a wingnut off set to the side of it. Even when it gets all the way tightened down, there's just not enough pressure to hold it in place when I start pushing on the pedals.
4. I can't seem to get the thing in tune when the pedals are pressed down. I don't know why that is. I can adjust it over and over again until I'm blue in the face. But, then when I go back and press the pedal down again, it's never quite in tune. It gets close, but not perfect.
5. There are places that it looks like I should be able to attach 2 knee levers, but the guy that I bought it from didn't have them anywhere. So, I'd like to order some knee levers. Ideally, I would like to order knee levers that will fit on this guitar and work, and not ones that are meant for a different system, and will sit in my garage until the next time I move and I throw them out. If somebody could tell me which knee levers will work with this guitar, oh boy, I sure would like that. (If you can tell where to buy them, I'd like that even more.)
6. There is no branding on this thing, so I'm guessing that it's a custom build. (I believe that the guy that I bought it from said something about that being the case.) But, I doubt if the guy that built this thing was machining rods and pulleys and winding pickups. So, there's probably some commonalities with other pedal steels in terms of the guts of this thing. If anybody might be able to give me a little insight on the origins of this 'ol girl, and what's she made of, I sure would like to get to know her a little better.

Fellas, thanks in advance.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Pull-release guitars (that's the style of changer you have: it pulls to raise pitches, and releases to lower them. The other two types are push-pull and all-pull, but that's not important now) have great tone, but can be fiddly to set up. Once set, they're rock steady.
The things that you call "pullers" are, I think, the fingers.
The slack you report is a function of the lack of adjustable stops at each end of the rotation of the cross-shafts.
To best adjust these, I'd tune it down to C9th so it's not so stiff. Then, using the threaded nuts on the pullrods, adjust the 5th and 10th strings to hit the cabinet at the same time that the pedal reaches its stop.
Likewise the 3rd and 6th strings on the B pedal. And so on
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

That is really, really neat. The builder certainly didn't scrimp on solidity, for sure! 60 lbs? You probably figured out/know that a tiny amount of light machine oil on all moving parts helps - as little as possible. (AKA sewing machine oil, there's all sort of places to find it). Silicone & other miracle-slime sprays add up to trouble down the line. Just for a burst of can-do ethos, look at the Carter info. Carter Steel Guitars unfortunately left us when the owner died, but they've VERY kindly left the set-up pages on:
https://www.steelguitar.com/carterInfo.html

You have a different changer, but some of the approach and advice is still solid. You know - if something somewhere is binding, it means that, ummm, maybe something somewhere - is binding? And WRITE DOWN changes as you go, printing out some blank tables either from your word processing program, or here:

http://b0b.com/wp/?p=794

You don't sound baffled by it, but you might eventually want to at least talk through it with an ex-spurt. There are dozens of real experts on this site, and maybe somebody close to you. Keep poking, maybe search through the older posts.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

David, I took his "not quite in tune" to mean "when I raise it, it doesn't go reliably back to the note it left."
Pull-release and push-pull guitars share a sensible but counterintuitive tuning process. If a string raises, you tune the raise at the keyhead.
To tune the B strings, press the A pedal, tune the C# at the keyhead, and when you release the pedal, tune the B notes with these screws here

_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

If you mean "it doesn't go reliably to the same note every time," the three stops aren't coordinated.
Here's why I recommended dropping to C9th, so the string tension is not as stiff. See these bits in red? When the pedal rod pulls it, the underside of the yellow scrawl stops when it hits the cabinet

At the same time as the underside of the yellow scrawl hits the cabinet, the fingers need to stop at the edge of the hole in the cabinet. You adjust that with the nuts circled in blue here (once you get it dialed in and locked down, you'll NEVER have to touch these again). The fingers need to be tight against the cabinet at the same time as the yellow scrawl hits the cabinet.

_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

richard burton · From: Britain

Unless there is something causing heavy binding, you definitely don't want those springs (arrowed in red) connected to the changer fingers.

String tension alone should be enough to hold the fingers against the tuning screws (green arrow)

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Richard, can you think of a reason for those springs?
I can't.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

J R Rose · From: Keota, Oklahoma, USA

Charlie. Lane & Richard both gave you some good pointers. Maybe to help you understand what Lane was saying about a pull/release changer is to start tuning process with pedals down and tune with your key head keys to given note. Let off of pedals and tune open string tuning at changer end of guitar. I cannot really tell where that might be on your guitar, it may be under neath some where. I think you will be able to figure it out, you seem to have some common horse sense and that is what it takes to work on one like this but it can be done. It would help if you had access to another guitar to see what happens even if was not a pull/release changer. Marlin, (not Mullen) is a pull/release changer, no longer made but there are some folks on here that have them and maybe some one will send you some pictures of the system. Make a new post, WANTED, Pictures of Marlin under the hood. Hope this helps, J.R.
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NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

J. R., the lowest notes are tuned at the top of the endplate with the screws that I circled in green and Richard pointed to with green arrows.

For pull-release guitars, I like to explain it as:
Highest notes on a string tune at the keyhead
Lowest notes on a string tune at the top of the endplate
If a string both raises and lowers, intermediate notes are either tuned in the window in the endplate or underneath. Fortunately for ease of comprehension, this guitar has no strings that both raise and lower. If Charlie keeps it, that may well change.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

J R Rose · From: Keota, Oklahoma, USA

Lane, I was writing when you and Richard made your post. And everyone has their own terminology of things.
As long as others understands it and applies it the way it should be it will all come out the same in the end. J.R.
_________________
NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose

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