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Topic: Of the 5 pedals on the C6th, which 1 do you use the least ? |
Larry Lenhart
From:
Ponca City, Oklahoma
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Posted 19 Jul 2016 6:55 pm |
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Just curious from those who play a lot of C6th, if you had to do without one pedal, which of the five "normal" pedals would you omit ? Thanks in advance.
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Zum Encore, Remington D8 non pedal, Hallmark Mosrite clone, Gretsch 6120 DSW, Gretsch G5210T-P90 Electromatic Jet Two 90,1976 Ibanez L5, Eastman archtop, Taylor Dreadnaught, Telonics pedal, Squire Tele, Squire Strat, Fender Tonemaster, Gold Tone 5 string banjo, Little Wonder tenor banjo, 3 Roland cubes 30s and 80, Carvin combo bass amp |
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Paul Sutherland
From:
Placerville, California
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Posted 19 Jul 2016 7:14 pm
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Easy answer: Pedal 4; the one that raises 4 & 8 a whole tone. In fact, I don't have it on my guitar. Of course I don't play much C6th.
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It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing. |
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Joseph Napolitano
From:
New Jersey, USA
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Posted 19 Jul 2016 7:46 pm
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| Four. I think the fours are gonna win. |
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Skeeter Stultz
From:
LOMITA, California, USA
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Posted 19 Jul 2016 8:13 pm
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I can't do without any of the 5 pedals on C6th. Fact is I use #4 pedal on C6th more than I use #3 on E9th.
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GFI ULTRA D-10, EVANS, FENDER 2000 (WORN OUT) TWIN REVERB W/JBL'S, OLD 4-10 BASSMAN |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 19 Jul 2016 11:09 pm
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Pedal 4. On my D10 I have the 3rd string raise to C# on there instead. On the uni I simply don't have it. None of the teaching material I have mentions it after page 1 (YMMV).
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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George McLellan
From:
Duluth, MN USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 2:48 am 4
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So far I've never found a use for the 4th pedal.
Geo |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 4:47 am
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For me, pedal 8, or the A-Ab lever. Of course I use them a lot, just less than the other 7.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 5:50 am
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The month after I decommissioned P4, I heard one of Tom Morrell's last PSG recordings before he went back to strictly lap/console (I think it was the first Time Warp Tophands album), and I heard him deliciously squeezing 8 from a 6 to the Maj7 in some of the western swing ballads. I instantly missed the change I had never learned to use. I may not use it much (it's still my least-used pedal), but I'm glad I put it back.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 5:52 am
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Interesting: the old-time swingsters are stepping up to defend P4. I may not know all its uses, but I appreciate what I do know.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Jeff Heard
From:
Lopez Island, Washington, USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 6:17 am
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| I changed pedal 4 to an "inverse pedal 6". I rarely used the A's to B change. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 6:23 am
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Years ago I posted here about pedal 4, the ways I use it which are not redundant with any other change, and is necessary for certain melodic usages.
For example, nowhere can you get a 1/2 interval between s3 and s4, also a unison between s3 and s4, a whole tone raise on s4 w/o a raise on s.3. The sound of s4 being raised to a B is NOT the same as having s3 being lowered to B.
I posted examples on the post, but if you could find it, I doubt that the sound files would still be there. But someone could look, I guess. 
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 6:41 am
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Here's one thread from the past I contributed to, regarding p4.
http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum5/HTML/005109.html
Apparently I've opined a lot about p4 in days gone by.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Jeff Harbour
From:
Western Ohio, USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 7:13 am
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Pedal 4 was the first to go for me as well. After a few years, I missed the 4th string raise, so I brought it back on a lever. But, I just never liked the sound of the 8th string moving... just doesn't fit me musically. I've even tried a half-step raise and a half-step lower on string eight, and they didn't suit me either.
Of the ones considered "standard", I have only kept Pedal 5, Pedal 8, and the 3rd string lower (which I moved to RKR). Everything else has either been altered or eliminated. |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 7:42 am
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It's a toss-up between #4 and #8 for me.
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Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
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Dick Wood
From:
Springtown Texas, USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 7:59 am
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Considering I don't play C6th,my casual thoughts would be if you get rid of 4 it makes playing Girl with Emphysema kinda hard and Nightlife just wouldn't be the same without 8.
What do I know anyway?
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Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night.
Last edited by Dick Wood on 20 Jul 2016 9:54 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Rick Barnhart
From:
Arizona, USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 8:03 am
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| Dick Wood wrote: |
| Girl with Emphysema |
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 8:18 am
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| Dick Wood wrote: |
Considering I don't play C6th,my causal thoughts would be if you get rid of 4 it makes playing Girl with Emphysema kinda hard and Nightlife just wouldn't be the same without 8.
What do I know anyway? |
For the benefit of those amongst us who might be neophytes on C6 or just thinking about approaching the tuning, I'd like to mention that Girl From Ipanema can be played many ways on the C6, both with and without pedal 4. Likewise, Buddy's Nightlife solo can be played without pedal 8 note for note, except for 2 beats of one measure.
Don't limit yourself.
Don't be locked into a box of playing a song one particular way, on either neck. If you need to learn a classic solo, as many of us have done and will do in the future, by all means do so; but learn alternative ways of playing the same song as well. Example: if you're given two solos in a song, why say the same thing twice?
I'm not trying to "defend" pedal 4, merely stating my uses of it and perhaps opening some eyes and ears to sounds that others may not have heard previously, and that they might want to explore for themselves.
Everyone who puts an alternate change on p4 I'm sure has a good musical reason for doing so. This is what makes people grow, think, and develop their own musical style.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 8:35 am
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I spent an hour watching Denny Mathis playing his C neck and, for a short while, I wondered how anyone did without pedal 4. It was illuminating.
Perhaps I should revisit that pedal - I was inspired that day. Of course, Denny is a great player whereas I could draw an analogy between my C6 knowledge and a postage stamp.....
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Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles, Martins, and a Gibson Super 400!
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 8:49 am
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This is all very interesting and reinforces what I've learned so far - that the answer to most questions about the PSG is "It depends what kind of music you play". 
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Jeff Harbour
From:
Western Ohio, USA
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 10:29 am
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| Herb Steiner wrote: |
I'm not trying to "defend" pedal 4, merely stating my uses of it and perhaps opening some eyes and ears to sounds that others may not have heard previously, and that they might want to explore for themselves.
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Herb, your point is well taken by me and I'm sure many others. You certainly make a compelling case to reintroduce Pedal 4. |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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rick andrews
From:
Westminster Co 80031
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 11:51 am
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First off I play a 12 string B6. So the 4th pedal for me is the same pedal as the B pedal on E9. It has all sorts of applications on a 6th tuning.
Obviously a 7th chord open. Go two frets back and combine it with the pedal that raises strings 9 and 10 and it gives you a chord with altered 5ths. This is a pretty common chord in jazz. Use it 5 frets up with combined with a B to C# raise and you have a minor chord or great blues single runs. 7 frets up: for an 11th...And you can use it just like you use the B pedal on E9th for fast single note phrases up and down the neck.
Obviously I would never give this pedal up. I do have the pedal that raises string 2 and lowers string 6 on a knee but all of those standard C6th changes I use all of the time.
I gave up the E9th "C" pedal but lower my G#s on a knee. You still get the voicing (very handy on both necks) but not the rocking on and off of the C pedal option. |
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Larry Lenhart
From:
Ponca City, Oklahoma
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 12:03 pm
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Thanks for all this input guys ! I knew with all the experience out there on the forum, I would get different slants and that is good !
The reason I asked this question is because I am having an S10 C6th built and the limitations of the model is 4 pedals....so I was trying to determine from experience which pedal I should drop. From my own experience, which is no where near most of you, I never used the 4th pedal that much, but I wanted to have some input...the steel is 6 months away from being built, so I have time for a decision. Right now I am leaning towards not having the 8th pedal, but that might change. Thanks again.
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Zum Encore, Remington D8 non pedal, Hallmark Mosrite clone, Gretsch 6120 DSW, Gretsch G5210T-P90 Electromatic Jet Two 90,1976 Ibanez L5, Eastman archtop, Taylor Dreadnaught, Telonics pedal, Squire Tele, Squire Strat, Fender Tonemaster, Gold Tone 5 string banjo, Little Wonder tenor banjo, 3 Roland cubes 30s and 80, Carvin combo bass amp |
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Paul Sutherland
From:
Placerville, California
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Posted 20 Jul 2016 12:03 pm
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All of you that are defending the 4th pedal are not addressing the issue of the original posting.
If you had to eliminate one of the standard 5 floor pedals of the standard C6th tuning, which would it be?
Answer that question!!
_________________
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing. |
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