| Author |
Topic: Pedal steel vs Dobro |
Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 1:56 pm |
|
This question is for steel players that play Dobro.
How hard is it to learn Dobro after playing pedal steel?
My body doesn't take kindly to transporting my steel.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
|
|
 |
Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 2:00 pm
|
|
Not too hard, I'd think.
But thinking like a Dobro player might be harder.
Different vocabulary, different approach.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
|
|
|
Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 2:07 pm
|
|
there is two major styles of dobro playing I would think, hot picking the way Jerry Douglas does it, or old time dobro you could hear by listening Josh Graves, brother Oswald, Tut Taylor etc... I would think old style dobro playing shouldn't be a problem for a steel player, but Jerry's hot smoking picking may be much harder...IMHO
_________________
www.steelguitarsonline.com |
|
|
|
Howard Parker
From:
Maryland
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 2:23 pm
|
|
Here's an old video with Graves, Auldridge & Douglas.
It'll give you some idea of the physicality of the guitar.
For a different take, here is the incredible Three Bells with Auldridge, Douglas & Ickes, completed just weeks before Mike's passing!
Dobros are making a lot of music these days in many genres. Lot's of "youngsters" carving out a career on dobro.
I'd say go for it!
h |
|
|
|
Dennis Wood
From:
Savannah, TN USA
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 2:33 pm
|
|
I play both pedal steel and dobro in a country cover band, not bluegrass. I enjoy playing both, depending on the song. The spacing of the strings and absence of all those neat sounds you get with pedals will be different and you have to think like a dobro player. I mostly tune to some variation of G or E. you shouldn't have any problem once you get used to the string spacing.
_________________
auribus teneo lupum |
|
|
|
Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 2:58 pm
|
|
dobro is a kick ass instrument, these two were owned by Buddy Emmons himself, you can still see his fingerprints on it 
_________________
www.steelguitarsonline.com |
|
|
|
Mark Eaton
From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 3:17 pm
|
|
I'm going to say that going from dobro to pedal steel is more difficult than the other way around. But that might be due to the fact that I have played dobro pretty steadily for many years, and my on again/off again pedal steel playing has been more like the Bataan Death March. So that could just be me.
Howard has a great point about the physicality of the instrument. You've gotta work the thing more than a pedal steel. One thing I hear in some long time steel players is that when they're on dobro, they don't really "get" the sense of dynamics. They might be playing pretty cleanly, but it's all sort of the same from one passage to the next. "Monotone" isn't the correct word, but it's the first thing that comes to mind. I think this might be what Lane is getting at with his comments.
| Quote: |
| I would think old style dobro playing shouldn't be a problem for a steel player, but Jerry's hot smoking picking may be much harder |
Well sure, of course. Damir's comment above brings to mind an evening watching The Jerry Douglas Band out here north of San Francisco in 2003. A fellow dobro playing friend was sitting at our table and at the end of the show he said, "now I want to go home and cut off my hands at the wrist."His point was that he could never play anything like Jerry does. I told him, "now wait a second - if you played for a local amateur ball team and you went to a Giants game and saw Barry Bonds hitting the crap out of the baseball, does this mean you'll feel like going home and get rid of your bats and glove and quit playing ball?"
It's kind of the same thing. After watching Jerry play for a couple hours it occurs to you that you are a mere mortal.
I admire the mind boggling skills of some of the great bluegrass dobro players but that's not really my favorite style for the instrument. Howard shared The Three Bells by Mike Auldridge, Rob Ickes, and Jerry - three dobros, no other intstruments. The first time I heard It the tears started welling up. This was after Mike passed away. What a beautiful rendition of the song.
Jerry put together the arrangement on that one. I just figured he was inspired by the hit version by The Browns from the late 1950s, but no - and this is an example of his out-of-the-box thinking. When I asked him about it he said that he took it from the version in French from earlier in the '50s (Les Trois Cloches) from legendary French singer Edith Piaf.
_________________
Mark
Last edited by Mark Eaton on 23 Mar 2016 3:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
|
|
Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
|
|
|
|
Colin Trask
From:
British Columbia, Canada
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 3:31 pm
|
|
I play both dobro and pedal steel. Started on the dobro picking bluegrass style. In the last couple years I've added pedal steel into the mix. The one hang up that took a bit to get over was the different pick blocking techniques from dobro to pedal steel. I found adding pedals into the mix was amazing because I could hit a lot of minor chords that I couldn't on the dobro. (unless I had a horseshoe shaped bar!)
If you spend some time at it, either dobro to pedal steel, or pedal steel to dobro, you'll work it out! Good luck!
_________________
74' Sho-Bud LDG
76' Dobro Square Neck
Peavey Nashville 112 |
|
|
|
Mark van Allen
From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 6:23 pm
|
|
There are a number of differences in everything about both instruments, Tone, Sustain, Attack and string response are some of the biggies. Having the acoustic body beaming up into your face is one of the pleasures, (and a difficulty of playing reso amplified onstage). There are (to me) vast differences in the tone and execution of the guys who "came up" on reso as opposed to the steelers who "second" on it. You can really hear this by listening to any Jerry Douglas or Rob Ickes recordings, and then the Dobro parts played by Lloyd Green or on records like "Nashville Bar Association". Different in a good way…
Some people have said they feel working on one detracts from their involvement in the other (Jerry Douglas for instance, Mike Auldridge embraced both), but I find the switch to be inspiring and lots of fun.
_________________
Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
www.musicfarmstudio.com |
|
|
|
Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 6:50 pm
|
|
Colin must have had a different Dobro teacher. I was palm blocking before I ever even thought about pedal steel, but Mike (Auldridge) was very much into steel before I picked up Dobro.
Even in 1978, you can hear him palm blocking https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YKr1WyLKWZI
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
|
|
|
Bob Watson
From:
Champaign, Illinois, U.S.
|
Posted 23 Mar 2016 11:57 pm
|
|
| I had been playing Pedal Steel for 20 years when I picked up the Dobro. Playing on old style C&W tunes came pretty easy at first but it took awhile to learn how to play Bluegrass. You pick a lot harder on a Dobro and when you're playing Bluegrass you use a lot more hammer-ons and pull-offs in open positions than you would on a Pedal Steel. Both instruments are related so there are similarities, but it is a different instrument and you won't pick it up overnight. Jump in and hang on, its a really fun instrument to play. |
|
|
|
Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 12:37 am
|
|
well, my take, the only thing that is the same is they are played with a bar !
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
|
|
|
Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 2:52 am
|
|
Thanks for all the info. My back arthritis has gotten a lot worse, and I still like to play out some. My thoughts have been to sell the pedal steel and buy a moderate priced dobro, and keep it along with the C6 lap steel. I may even try to build a double neck lap with C6 and something else.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
|
|
|
Michael Douchette
From:
Gallatin, TN (deceased)
|
|
|
|
Jim Pitman
From:
Waterbury Ctr. VT 05677 USA
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 10:27 am
|
|
I started on Dobro in 73, got a lap steel in 77, then a U12 pedal steel in 82. I play the majority of my gigs with PSG. I do play a half a dozen Dobro only gigs primarily in the bluegrass genre. I play a few gigs with Dobro, Pedal steel, and lap steel.
I find it really challenging to go from one to the other. I need at least three tunes in a row to get in the zone on any of the three. This usually doesn't happen so I prefer not to bring the dobro (unless requested) when I play a primarily PSG gig.
If I were in a cover band and there was some specific part for Dobro I'd bring it.
I agree with Howard, the Dobro is a very physical instrument.
Once in a while something will rekindle my love for the Dobro and I'll play it at home for a month to the detrement of my skill with the other two. |
|
|
|
Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 10:41 am
|
|
| I've been a dobro hack since '88 and a pedal steeler since the mid 70's. About the only thing I find in common is that you use a bar and picks to play them both. |
|
|
|
Mark Eaton
From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 10:59 am
|
|
| Michael Douchette wrote: |
I believe banjo to dobro is a much more natural pairing. Dobro uses the banjo rolls. I think it's harder to go from pedal steel to dobro. I would think a banjo player would grasp dobro fairly quickly.
Then, you could try to find a Ped-a-bro... |
Fellow forumite and friend Greg Booth comes to mind after reading Mike's post. Greg progressed more quickly from a beginning player to an accomplished dobro picker than just about anyone I have ever met. It was pretty remarkable.
Not to speak for Greg, and i am sure when he sees this thread he will provide his own input and correct me if I am providing any wrong information, but as I recall he took up banjo around age 16 then took up pedal steel in his early 20s.
But the decades of banjo playing in Open G, utilizing the tuning and the dynamics of picking on one of those things, combined with the fretboard plus pedals/knee levers, and theory knowledge of playing pedal steel and honing one's technique in coordinating the hands, and the intellectual exercise of the math of music theory on the steel that helps so much - this struck me as the perfect storm in taking up the dobro.
As I recall it was around 2004-2005 that Greg first got serious about the dobro and within a couple years he could play the heck out of thing.
_________________
Mark |
|
|
|
Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 12:45 pm
|
|
I also play both - but I play dobro not as a "bluegrass instrument", but simply as a unique tonality to contrast with the pedal steel in the band. Sure, you want to learn hammer-ons, pull-offs, at least a couple of slants (does what pedals do on pedal steel), and how to pick like a dobro player... But you don't have to play blazingly fast rolls...Like a number of modern players, it is a texture you can add to any genre of music.
And you already have the fretless thing going, which is a huge deal...plus, with a GDBGDB tuning, you only have to learn 3 strings, the other 3 are the same...
...and as mentioned, it is then easy to add banjo, since the tuning is essentially the same...once again, like many modern players, you don't have to play lightning-fast bluegrass rolls to add this instrument, in a creative way, to the mix.
In my gypsy jazz band, I play only dobro and banjo....and in a lot of the stuff Jerry Douglas does (e.g., with Allison Krauss), he isn't playing bluegrass-style either...
So yeah, go for it!
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
|
|
|
Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 12:59 pm
|
|
I omitted one characteristic in my earlier post that pedals and dobro share and that is the color of the resonator guitar makes it very expressive in the proper hands. The ability to stir emotion playing the reso is quite good. Just as a f.i., Jerry Douglas w/AKUS New Favorite. Of course there are many other such examples. It can be happy or dark or just about anything in between as Steve points out.
It's one instrument in which almost everybody finds something to like...both listener and player. |
|
|
|
Brad Howerton
From:
Kentucky, USA
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 1:24 pm
|
|
| I didn't take up the dobro until I had been playing steel for about 15 years. As far as I'm concerned, they are completely different instruments. I rarely lifted the bar when I played steel, playing bluegrass dobro is heavy on hammer-ons and pull-offs. I find that I don't palm block nearly as much as I do when playing steel. It's a different attack/approach as already mentioned. Jerry Douglas has said that playing the dobro is just like playing the guitar, only with one finger on the left hand.. |
|
|
|
Willie Sims
From:
PADUCAH, KY, USA
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 2:28 pm
|
|
GET A LIGHTER STEEL AND USE YOUR LAP STEEL,FOR C6.
I HAVE A SINGLE NECK ZUM ,THAT I CAN PICK UP WITH TWO FINGERS,AND MOVE IT ANY WHERE.YOU CAN'T MOVE A DOBRO THAT EASEY.PLUS YOU DON'T HAVE TO LEARN TO PLAY DOBRO. |
|
|
|
Howard Parker
From:
Maryland
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 3:09 pm
|
|
After playing dobro for 30+ years I have just learned it is punishment. 
| Quote: |
| PLUS YOU DON'T HAVE TO LEARN TO PLAY DOBRO. |
Maybe it is "want to" not "have to". Looking back, it doesn't seem like it was torture.
I'll think on it for a while.
h
_________________
Howard Parker
03\' Carter D-10
70\'s Dekley D-10
52\' Fender Custom
Many guitars by Paul Beard
Listowner Resoguit-L |
|
|
|
Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 5:21 pm
|
|
I think one should spend time on banjo rolls - the skill is useful on many other instruments. Same for hammers ons and pull offs, whether with a bar or fingers - I think of the bar as one finger or a capo, that can also be slanted
The nice thing about dobro is that it's certainly easier to tune, lighter to carry, and a simpler tuning!
_________________
--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
|
|
|
Mark Eaton
From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
|
Posted 24 Mar 2016 5:37 pm
|
|
There are so many more teaching materials plus good teachers these days as compared to when I started in 1976 when there was next to nothing available.
One fellow who I highly recommend, great written teaching materials (rolls!) and videos along with in person lessons if you are here in Northern California, and if not he also offers Skype lessons: Mike Witcher
Not to mention over the years I believe he has become one of the finest players of the instrument on the planet - and a heck of a nice guy.
www.MikeWitcher.com
I don't want to leave the other folks out that teach, but I also don't want to add a few more then miss someone. So start by checking out Mike's teaching materials.
_________________
Mark |
|
|
|
