Share a quick dominant chord lick??

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

I'm playing pedal steel for a university theatre production of "Honky Tonk Angels" - basically a revue of many female-sung country hits... I'm finding that I'm catching the chord changes just fine but was wondering if any of you could share a 1- or 2-bar run/lick that I could employ over some 7th and 9th chords... Leads and single note runs are kinda my weak point up to now!

My strategies for hitting dominant-sounding stuff so far are limited to: string 9, A pedal mashing for pitch 6/slide up 1 fret to pitch 7, and F lever with/without A pedal 3 frets up from "home"...

Thanks, fellas.

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

This is a combination of an idea I got from Paul Franklin with one from Buddy Emmons -- pretty good pedigree.

The DOM7 section is out of the Eb lever position. C is at the 1st and 13th fret.
This is the basic lick



5-----------------------------


6-----------13~13B------------


7--------13-------------------


8-12-13-----------------------

Buddy often uses this lick repeated 2 or 3x
All notes are eighths except the last which is a quarter

I'll just post a snippet that starts out on a minor triad and pulls the b3 up with the bar like this (in C or C7 -- straight eighths) -- This is an idea I lifted from PF



5------------------------------------------


6--11--------------------------------------


7--------11-------------repeat-------------


8-----11-----11~12-11----------------------

so you're in the A+F position without the F you can bring it up to the A+B+Eb lever position like this
THIS IS THE DOM7 SECTION

5------------------------------------------


6--11--------------------13~13B------------


7--------11-----------13-------------------


8-----11-----11~12-13----------------------





and then you can go on up to the A+B position








5-----------------------------------------13--------


6--11--------------------13~13B----13~13B----13B~15B


7--------11-----------13--------13------------------


8-----11-----11~12-13-------------------------------

There are a million ways to use those ideas

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 26 June 2003 at 06:33 AM.]

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Wow, Larry - thanks for those ideas. Yes, I'd say those licks have plenty of integrity given the sources : ) Serious cats - you included of course!

[For good comedy value, I should post audio of me mangling them for the next few days!]

Tony LaCroix · From: Austin, Texas, USA

I ran into this when I had the same question recently. Pentatonics.
http://www.dougbsteel.com/PentPage.htm

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Hey there, Tony - thanks from one Austinite to another! We should have a jam sometime - when I get my act together, that is!

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

I got a bunch more if you're interested.

Most of the speedpicking stuff I do uses the b7 and I've got horizontal stuff, vertical stuff, and everything in between. Problem is it turns into a lesson (or even a short course) when I try to extract more than a short, simple lick because everything ties into everything else. An objective should be to be able to start at (e.g, in G) the third fret (or even the first fret) and work your way up to the 22nd fret and back down, varying your path as many ways as possible.

------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Thanks, Larry - I know this spells a while in the woodshed! The only ray of light is that this is the very stuff I was getting into on guitar when I jumped over to steel... So the mindset of "known patterns + new possibilities" that you get into with jazz improv is already sort of bubbling in my head. It's the picking and trying to think up and down the strings that's eating my lunch!

John Troutman · From: Washington, DC

is this happening at UT or somewhere else in austin?

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

"Honky Tonk Angels" is at St. Edwards Univ.... The Statesman was a little rough on the singing/acting in their review of the show, but the band got *a [precious] little* praise. : ) Come on out if you're not averse to college girls doing theatre-major versions of Loretta, Tammy, Dolly, etc...

Jeff Lampert · From: queens, new york city

Besides Larry's good ideas, another thing you could do is to realize that basically any major scale lick you already play can be converted to a dominant 7th/9th lick by replacing the major 7 notes with b7 notes. So in the key of G, take any G scale lick you have in your arsenal and replace the F#'s with F's. Below are two examples of licks. On each tabbed line the first lick is a G major scale lick that ends on a G chord. And the second lick on each line of tab is that same lick replacing the F#'s with F's, which gives it the dominant 7th sound, and then the lick resolves to a C chord. These are two simnple examples, but the main point is to realize how all your licks can do double duty with some relatively easy changes.

1_________________________________________________________________________


2_________________________________________________________________________


3_________________________________________________________________________


4_________________________3____________________________3__________________


5___10a____10___8___5a____3_______10a____8a___8___6____3a_________________


6______10b___10___8___5b__3__________10b___8b__8___6___3b_________________


7_________________________________________________________________________


8_________________________________________________________________________


9_________________________________________________________________________


10________________________________________________________________________

1_________________________________________________________________________


2______3_________________________________3L_______________________________


3_________________________________________________________________________


4____3_________________________________3__________________________________


5________3a_~_3__________3__________________3a_~_3___________3____________


6________________3_~_3b____3b_~_3___________________3_~_3b______3_~_3b____


7_________________________________________________________________________


8_________________________________________________________________________


9_________________________________________________________________________


10________________________________________________________________________

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

That's good advice, Jeff. Basically I've hit the point where I'm getting into ruts and kinda empty "motor memory" stuff. Time to fire up the brain again... Thanks very much for the tips, guys - this info should really freshen things up.

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

Just for reference here's mp3's for the lick on the bottom line of my post above
SLOW
At Tempo
and
A somewhat extended version

Kinda sloppy and quick & dirty, but you'll get the idea, I think.

JEFF, OLD BUDDY
Long time no see.

Good to see you posting again.

------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 26 June 2003 at 10:05 AM.]

Tony LaCroix · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Hey Nathan, I'm curious about your last name. Is it French, or perhaps Spanish? It looks like it may share some history with my own, which translates to "The Cross" and supposedly originated during the crusades, when people in certain towns would put crosses in front of their homes. The towns came to be known as La Croix or Delacroix, and the people eventually took the name of the town.

Anyways, judging by forum members, it seems that half the "new" steelers in the world must be in Austin

As soon as I "get MY act together" I'd like to show up (and maybe help organize) at a jam or two. We should take advantage of our proximity. Some of the European steelers seem to be like blue whales- rare and far apart

(of course, Blue whales, while not technically fish, are the biggest in the sea. What does that make me, a minnow?)

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

Guys, where else can you go and get an on line lesson from a great player? Thank you Larry, and bravo!

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

You said it, Kevin. It's amazing...

I can honestly say there hasn't been ONE TIME that I've jumped on the forum that I wasn't FLOODED with great advice and ideas. You guys are TOO MUCH! Sincere thanks to all of ya - especially Larry for the tab/great audio clips (and Jeff for the tab/headspace adjustment!)

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Thanks again for the great tips, guys - especially loving the "3 frets up" access to pitches b3, 4, 5, and b7 on strings 8/7/6/5, Larry.

Scott Henderson · From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA

I did that show a few years back in Wichita Kansas..."Calling all angels" which songs in particular are you having problems with.
I had to chuckle at there arrangement of "Night Life". Was a good arrangement but not what this ole steel geetar player was used to. The music director asked me,"oh Did some one in the country field do this song???"

Nathan Delacretaz · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Scott - the ones I was having trouble with the tunes that called for all these steel fills over 7th chords... "Harper Valley PTA" and "Cornell Crawford" come to mind...problem was that both of those were calling for each 4 bar phrase to end in 2 bars of steel fills and I was just tapped for ideas... All my little mini-rides were sounding alike!

The production run ended yesterday, so it's back to the occasional smoky club, I guess!

And I had the same experience as you did - the musical director had never heard Ray Price's version of "Night Life"...My chart for that tune had NO STEEL whatsoever! HUH?! But all in all, I guess I should be thankful I wasn't being asked to "play it like Emmons!"

[This message was edited by Nathan Delacretaz on 30 June 2003 at 10:44 AM.]

Franklin · Posted 30 Jun 2003 5:22 pm

F to F7th slow ballad lick using a few substitutions

1---------8-------------------------------
2--------------------------------
3---------------------------
4---8--------7F----7-----7E----6E--------
5---8A-------7A----7A----7A----6------------
6---8B-------7B----7B----7B----6B----------

Pick--Pick-pick (Don't pick the rest)

E===knee that lowers E's to Eb
F=== " " raises E's to F

Enjoy,

Paul

[This message was edited by Franklin on 30 June 2003 at 06:23 PM.]

[This message was edited by Franklin on 30 June 2003 at 06:25 PM.]

[This message was edited by Franklin on 30 June 2003 at 06:26 PM.]

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

What are you thinking timing-wise on that, Paul?
quarter quarter eighth eighth quarter whole?

It's really cool you're hangin' out with us.
Thanks!

Also, if you put [_TAB] (without the underscore) before and [_/TAB] after (also no underscore) it'll come out looking like this and things line up better. You'll get the hang of it.



1---------8-------------------------------


2--------------------------------


3---------------------------


4---8--------7F----7-----7E----6E--------


5---8A-------7A----7A----7A----6------------


6---8B-------7B----7B----7B----6B----------





 Pick--Pick-pick (Don't pick the rest)

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 30 June 2003 at 07:11 PM.]

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

Here's a swift one
This is a variation of an idea I lifted from Mike Smith -- another good pedigree. Only steal from the best.

You can hear something kinda similar in his 'Rollin' in My Sweet Baby's Arms' solo
BUY HIS CD!!!!



KEY:G  Play over G7 chord


'b'=second string flatted to D


'B'=B pedal


'C'=C pedal


1-----------------------------3---------3------


2--------3b--------3b--------------------------


3--------------------------------3B~~3---------


4-----------3C~~3------3~~3C-------------------


5--3~~3C-----------------------------------3---

all fast eighths or sixteenth notes except last one is a half(8ths) or quarter (16ths)

Here's what it sounds like slow
Here's what it sounds like faster
(the first 'faster' version is fast eighths or sixteenths / the second is quarter note triplets)

You can also do it in double stops like this

1-----------------------------3---------3------


2--------3b--------3b---------3b--------3b-----


3--------3B--------3B------------3B~~3---------


4-----------3C~~3------3~~3C-------------------


5--3~~3C-----------------------------------3---

Here's what that sounds like slow
Here's what it sounds like faster
same deal on the sixteenths then triplets

Thanks, Miguel -- I owe you a lot.

------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 30 June 2003 at 08:41 PM.]

Jerry Hedge · From: Norwood Ohio U.S.A.

I did "Honky Tonk Angels" last summer with an Equity cast,veteran theatrical musicians and a music director from Broadway. Man, was I scared!!! Fortunately I was familiar with most of the songs in the score,and the M.D. gave me a cassette of a production that he had studied to get a feel for the show. Everyone else was reading and I was winging it by ear. I made it thru the production and was able to get more work from the connections I made with the other musicians. Oh and by the way, one of the actresses works a lot of the Ted Swindley plays (Honky Tonk Angels,Always Patsy Cline etc.)and raved about what a great player and nice person Roger Rettig is.

Eric West · From: Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.

You know, Larry, this is getting creepy....

I've been working on that one about half the "non-paving" day today. From variations three frets up. two frets down, and some places it just "doesn't work". ( Those, I might pull on my hot young Tele Monster/band leader, Monty Moss..

) (I've 'splained a couple of them that he really likes, and I just told him that I use it because nobody could ever understand it, and they make no musical sense whatsoever, and you play them so fast that nobody will ever know. (That's the way "minor chords" used to be thought of..))

I'm finding that you can move it up One Fret with strings 2,3,5 ( kl on, C ped. off)find diminished triad you move up three frets and finish at the fifth fret up with the kl off the C pedal "pattern" to resolve , (or like the MS thing, the I triad two frets up with pC and rl lower.) One of those you can play at 120+.

I know this is a "computer question", but what's the "easy way" to record mp3s? (I know how to edit and post them) A line into your puter from pre-out 1/4" to 1/8", From tape recorder to 1/8" line in, or mike straight to Cakewalk?

Inquiring minds....

EJL

[This message was edited by Eric West on 30 June 2003 at 08:57 PM.]

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

Franklin · Posted 30 Jun 2003 8:02 pm

Larry,
Thanks for your help and input.
In 6/8 Think half note and the rest quarter notes. In 4/4 the progression is actually F split C+ as a substitution to F7th for a bar. Try 2 quarter notes and then triplets to finish the bar.

Nathan this is a twist I use on a standard lick that may get overlooked. Its a nice move.

1________________7G_slide_6_________________
2________________7_______6_________________
3___________________________________________
4___________________________________________
5___8A_____7A__Let all strings ring_________
6___8B_____7B_______________________________

(Release A pedal at the end to
resolve to F7th) This lick is F to F7th

(G====raises the F# to G)

Paul

[This message was edited by Franklin on 30 June 2003 at 09:18 PM.]

[This message was edited by Franklin on 30 June 2003 at 09:22 PM.]

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