Your Steel Guitar Is Not A Piece Of Furniture

Zane King · From: Nashville, TN

Today, I went into a music store and saw a brand new steel guitar. Okay, that alone is odd enough. Just saying. It was a popular brand of which I have great respect for. However, it had a very large pad on it that just made it entirely impossible for me to play. I'm just going to tell you like it is folks. These don't work. I don't care how much you think they doâ€¦.they are not right for the steel guitar. Here is a video that hopefully will help you understand my argument hereâ€¦

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HTi4tpvFVM
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Tommy Everette · From: Whitakers, NC

First...you are a great steel player.

All the D10's I've seen don't offer any more step down than a sd10 pad does.
Correct?

Damir Besic · From: Nashville,TN.

pad never seemed to bother Lloyd, I find some home made pads too big, but all of the factory made steels with a pad, that I owned were very comfortable, and enjoyable to play...
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Henry Matthews · From: Texarkana, Ark USA

I think Zane is on to something about the pads on guitars. We all think we need one, especially on the SD-10's. I know I wouldn't want one without a pad. But on the other hand, how about us that play C6th? We don't need a pad there. It seems to me that I can play faster and truer bar movements on C6th than I can E9th because on E9th, the C strings are sorta in the way which makes your hand position change. Again, most don't want the pad for their bar hand, we want it for our right hand to rest on when we pick the strings. I've also noticed that my right hand is more accurate on C6th than E9th and it could be because of wrist resting on C strings. Most of us have gotten used to the pads or the back neck strings and think we have to have them.
As Damir stated, it never bother Lloyd and it doesn't bother most of us but what would we play like if we never ever were given the option? Playing without one sure doesn't bother Zane either, lol.
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D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
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Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes.

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

Mark van Allen · From: Watkinsville, Ga. USA

This is one of those things that seems to register as personal choice. I've owned many, many steels, some S10, some SD-10, many D-10s, (and just now an Emmons Original S-10 and two U12's on single wide bodies). With very few exceptions I've been comfortable with guitars with tiny pads, wide pads, no pads behind the playing deck. I realize that's just me, as some people I've met aren't comfortable on anything but an SD-10 with a big pad, or a D-10 with no padâ€¦ You'd think all the various builders would have honed in on what people want from their customer base. It's pretty nice that there are so many options available to us these days.
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Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

The video does make a good point about the arm/shoulder posture.
I'm the kind of piano player who'd rest his palms on the keyslip occasionally, just as I do on a pad,
but I can't imagine anyone playing in that position. Maybe it's just a comfort.
I understand Lloyd Green had one.
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Zane King · From: Nashville, TN

Oh please understand and do NOT get me wrongâ€¦I mean no disrespect to those who use them. If it is for you and you have adjusted to it then by all means continue. I just wholeheartedly believe going forward it is not helping the promotion of our instrument. Additionally, I sincerely believe it is wrong for the instrument. That's my opinion, of course. I don't expect everyone to agree with me.

As for Lloyd Green, let me say, there is no steel player EVER that I respect more. As a matter of fact, he likely has influenced my playing like no other. Believe me, I would never tell him to remove the pad from his guitar. Very Happy

I would ask you how many instruments can you name (and ones that you see often in
All of that said, please just consider my argument in terms of moving the Steel Guitar forward.

Zane
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Bill Moore · From: Manchester, Michigan

I don't like a thick pad, but a thin one is fine with me. I mostly play SD-10 and S-10 guitars. It seems to me, that pads on an S-10 should be no higher then the level of the strings of the c6th neck of a D-10. Some pads are much higher, some even level with the strings on the E9th. I don't think leaning on a pad while playing is a good idea.

Peter den Hartogh · From: Cape Town, South Africa

I always removed the pads from any guitar that had pads. They are just in the way. Thanks for the video, Zane. Smile

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Mark van Allen · From: Watkinsville, Ga. USA

I've always assumed the proliferation of pads came about because of Lloyd's influence on so many playersâ€¦ the desire to "play one like the master's" is a strong marketing tool throughout the music world.

In fact, if Lloyd hadn't removed his infrequently used rear neck and had a pad put on, do you think we'd see any steels of any kind with pads today? Hmm.
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Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

In the video you say if you were going to have a back neck or pad, you'd want it lower down "than normal". It might be worth noting that Lloyd's Sho-Bud, and all other double-width Sho-Buds except Super Pros, have the back neck offset 3/4" down from the front neck, unlike virtually all other double-neck or single-neck with pad steels today, which have a 1/4" offset.

richard burton · From: Britain

Topic: Your Steel Guitar Is Not A Piece Of Furniture

In some households, it probably is

Carl Williams · From: Oklahoma

Zane,
First, thanks for bringing this subject back up...if anyone has witnessed/heard your playing, one would almost have to agree with you. "However", having owed an S-10 ('74 to '79 and a young, green kid), to a D-10 for 20 years and now, 10 years with an SD-10, my preference is the SD-10 frame (old, green/gray geezer). I also posted a topic a few years back on the subject of having a D-10 and treating it basically as a Loafer due to not really playing the C6th tuning, etc, etc. It seems that a lot of D-10 owners are using the back neck as a pad, armrest, etc. It seems that "most of us" are 50+ now and the pad or 10 strings on the back neck, really help with the ergonomics of being bent over this contraption! Winking

You've addressed one of my heroes, Mr. Lloyd Green, and he sure was on fire the night of the Live at Panther Hall recording on the, I believe, The Lightning Bolt--D-10. The Masters (I include you on this list) have obviously "mastered" playing either a single or double framed steel. I know after carrying an MSA D-10 for years, my now Williams SD-10 is giving my old back a rest! Smile

Thanks again Zane...If anyone comes away playing better with your thought provoking advice, that's positive. Carl

Richard Wilhelm · From: Ventura County, California

My purty birdseye maple Maverick without the dustcatcher is my mouse pad and sometimes my ironing board. Maybe if we played as many sessions as Loyd did during a day, an arm rest would be most benificial. Sorry to interrupt a good discussion on the ideal positions of the hand and arm (I believe that's what it's about), it just seemed to fit the title.
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Mark Eaton · Posted 4 Apr 2015 10:23 am

Zane, I have an S-10, so thank you for the ergonmics and technique lesson, very well thought out - makes perfect sense to me.
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Doug Beaumier · From: Northampton, MA

I agree with Zane. The pad on a double body began as an aftermarket modification (by Lloyd Green). It's Not something that was designed by manufacturers for ergonomic reasons. Sho-Bud started producing the Lloyd Green model, and then Emmons came out with the Loafer, and other steel manufacturers jumped on the bandwagon. To each his own, but I never liked an SD-10, especially ones with a HIGH pad that gets in the way and is actually higher than the strings.

A couple of years ago I asked a top manufacturer why most companies no longer make a single body 10-string and he told me that when he orders bodies it's cheaper to order a large quantity of double bodies and put a pad on when a buyer wants a single neck guitar. He said most buyers don't want single body PSGs anymore and they prefer SD-10s. I'm not so sure about that. I think buyers, especially newbies, are being sold something they don't need... extra weight and an unnecessary pad which was originally put there to cover up the hole left when the back neck of a D-10 was removed. Just my opinion, flame away.
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Larry Bressington · From: Nebraska

Here's what i did to mine...I had a leather piece made and installed...I don't like the feel of a pad, as it is too high. Its a bit hard to see but it's the only photo i have.
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Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

The only thing I could add is I'm more comfortable sitting closer to the body, as with SD-10, or similar to Ian's steel.
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Carl Williams · From: Oklahoma

It would be interesting to hear from others who are now or have been teaching "How to Play Pedal Steel Guitar" about this issue. Is it something you advise your students about? Would/Could it also apply to non-pedal steel players with more than one "neck"? Looking back when "we" used whatever was available to sit on (Before Pac-A-Seats), the angle (Up/Down) our arms/hands wasn't always something we could do anything about. I guess we just adapted...not much of a choice in those days... Smile

Brett Day · From: Pickens, SC

I use a pad on my Jackson Steel- a thin pad. I wasn't sure at first how a pad would work with my left hand not working too well, but it works pretty well for me. I use it mainly to rest my right arm on while getting ready to play.

David Griffin · From: Jimmy Creek,Arkansas via Cowtown, USA

IMHO: A thin pad is fine,no worse than a D-10. I've played an LDG for 40 yrs w/out a problem and my Rusler Uni-12 str has a half pad. Like anything,a pad can be used as a crutch. As long as you don't anchor your forearm on the pad it shouldn't hurt your RH technique at all. MY main reason for playing a SD-10 is having the KL's closer to me.
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Doug Beaumier · From: Northampton, MA

A few of my students in past years had SD-10s and they really liked the pad and they were convinced that it made picking more comfortable. I wouldn't argue the point, I would just explain to them that I learned on a single body PSG and the pad never worked for me. I wouldn't go so far as to say a pad inhibits a players ability to pick certain things, I'm just saying it's not for me, and I'm not sure that new players need the pad either. After all, it was originally just a decorative cover for an empty cavity in a D-10. That's the reason it was put there back in the day.
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Dennis Saydak · From: Manitoba, Canada

This is an interesting post but I think that bar hand stance has more to do with how large the hand is and how long the fingers are. I have small hands and would find it difficult to have such a large break angle between the fingers and the palm when playing. Besides feeling unnatural to me, I'd run out of forward motion when picking the high strings. Obviously it works for Zane.

I just watched Jeff Newman play Steel Guitar Jubilee from one of my DVDs and this is the way I hold my bar.

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