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Topic: Thinking about switching from D10 to S12 |
Patrick Drummond
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 15 Apr 2014 12:43 pm |
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Well just asking for some input here. Thinking of moving to a universal 12, weighing my options now. You guys have any pros or cons on a universal 12. Been playing steel for 15 years, session work, and gig. I play a wide variety from classic (the good stuff) country, jazz, blues, southern rock. I now play an 84 emmons D10 also Fessenden Sd10.
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84 Emmons SKH D10 8x5 Fessenden Sd10 3x5, Musicman HD 150, Nashville 400x2, Fender Steel King, Hilton, Gibson Dobro, to much to list! |
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 16 Apr 2014 3:28 pm
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I have a S12 MSA (15 years) and a D10 Shobud Pro II (2 months).
- If you take a standard 7x5 U12, Jim Palenscar words of wisdom apply: "Mostly E9 and just enough of C6" (his general gist).
- With more investment, you can put a center cluster in your S12, and a lever lock for B6 mode, and you have everything a C6 has, and more, because you can still access left knee changes from the E9 side, and of course, you don't need to switch necks.
- If you're fussy about a particular pickup for a certain genre of sound, you only have one pickup generally, but some guitars are being fit with two on the same neck nowadays...Potential downside the additional magnetic fields dampening the strings. Maybe split coil techniques to get some variety of tone is in order.
- Looking at it another way...A D10 really doesn't get to where a standard U12 is at until its about at a 6x8 lever arrangement.
- The mechanics of the undercarriage of an S12 are a lot less congested than all the linkages and other stuff under a D10, but if you go the single body route, fitting extra knee levers in (like a second left, etc.) gets tricky.
- If you go to a double body universal, you're weight saving benefits just got reduced.
- The C6 neck is strung a little tighter than E9/B6, wouldn't matter much on a 24 1/4" scale but noticable on a 24" scale, I'll probably bump my 12th string to a 0.70 for my 24" scale length.
Anyways...just some stuff to ponder...neither an S12 or D10 is the right answer. A D12 is probably the answer...haha |
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Douglas Schuch
From:
Valencia, Philippines
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Posted 16 Apr 2014 4:14 pm
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It is easy to get the equivalent of an 8x5 D-10 on a universal. It is not so easy to get the equivalent of an 8x8. Many guitars use right knee levers that work both necks. With a Universal, of course, you have to chose WHICH of those changes you really want as both probably will not work. I'd say it depends on your approach to steel. If you are a player who does not need every pull and is happy adapting his playing to what he does have, a Universal might be a good fit. If you are a player who likes having lots of different changes, then a D-10 offers more options.
For me, the biggest loss on most Universal tunings is the 9th string D on E9 - I like having this. I use a tuning that provides this, but you then have to lock it in, so you have to choose which tuning you will use, like a D-10. That works for me as I find trying to access 7 or 8 pedals is more than my clumsy feet can handle - I have the highest admiration for players like Lane who can work 9 or 10 pedals on one neck and switch between them all! As for the 9th string D, if you put that change on a lever, that means some other change will not be there.
Steel guitar setups, it seems to me, are always about compromises. Universal offers some great versatility in a smaller, lighter package, but with a more complex set of compromises. If you can make those compromises work for you, then you will love universal.
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Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental! |
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Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
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Posted 16 Apr 2014 5:21 pm
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| Go for the U-12 and don't look back. Seriously, There is a lifetime on one neck but the U-12 gives you all of the E9 and most of the 6th. Like Joe Write said: You give up something but you get something. Good enough for Joe, good enough for me! |
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Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
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Posted 16 Apr 2014 6:56 pm
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looking back now, I wish I started with U12 instead of D-10...
Db |
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Patrick Drummond
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 4:45 am
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Thanks for the input I think I'm sold. Just have to decide on the guitar and setup. Looking at beck really like the keyless but not sure for I have never owned a keyless steel. Also thinking of double frame with pad. I play a standard 8x5 emmons setup now would love to add some new pulls. Whats your input on brand, this will be a new guitar built for me. Really leaning towards beck as posted above but open to Fessenden show pro or Mullen thanks again
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84 Emmons SKH D10 8x5 Fessenden Sd10 3x5, Musicman HD 150, Nashville 400x2, Fender Steel King, Hilton, Gibson Dobro, to much to list! |
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Ken Campbell
From:
Ferndale, Montana
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 5:23 am
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| If i had the financial wherewithal, I would look into a Williams Keyless. |
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Roual Ranes
From:
Atlanta, Texas, USA
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 5:44 am
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| I don't think you are going to lose enough weight to justify the change. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 10:08 am
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| S-12 uni,,,,and never look back,,,,also "KEYLESS FOREVER"!!!!! (I, as well as Joe Kline, Noel Anstead, et al see no need for additional parts, extra string length, extra wood, overtones etc on the end of my guitar) |
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Olli Haavisto
From:
Jarvenpaa,Finland
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 11:28 am
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The weight difference is about 20%, it seems.
D-10 Williams 36 lbs, S-12 uni 30 lbs, also 600$ less for the uni.
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Olli Haavisto
Finland
Last edited by Olli Haavisto on 18 Apr 2014 5:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 17 Apr 2014 1:25 pm
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| Find a Kline! Mine had 7 and 6. Love the low E string foe E9th. Pulled the B to D. Never missed it. |
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