How to hook up a chorus

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

What is a good way to hook up a CE 5 Boss chorus for use with two amps.

I always use a RV 3 reverb, and I want to keep it in the chain. I use the volume pedal inputs on my Vegas, and use the effects inputs on the back for the RV 3 and use the "A" output from the RV 3 into the input jack on my second amp, also a Vegas 400.

So, where would I use the chorus for a stereo effect?
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Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

After the RV3, and I'd use the chorus to split into stereo. And put the dry amp behind you and the we're home a safe distance. If you listen to the wet only, you'll be chasing your intonation all night.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

Thanks Lane for the advice, and you are right about the intonation part.

I have it hooked up on my second amp through the effect inputs and it works ok, but the chorus is only on one amp though.

I have a song or two that I think stereo chorus sounds good with the two amps. The only way so far I've found to do that is to take out the RV3, and put in the chorus and use the spring reverb in the amps. Which while not exactly what I want, will work. In doing that I lose the delay part of the RV3 that I use to fatten the sound.

I was just wondering if someone smarter than me knew unique a way to hook up both units with a stereo feed RV3 and chorus to each amp.
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You can observe a lot just by looking

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Enlighten me (I may be bright, but some things I just don't know about yet): What's the effect and advantage of stereo reverb? As it's a non-discrete echo, I'm not sure see an advantage to two different reverbs in the separate channels.
So from my own frame of reference, the chorus makes a better candidate for the stereo source. It makes a cool effect in stereo, whether one dry and one wet mixing in gge room or each channel wet, but one "up" while the other's "down." And just let the reverb run mono (the LFO of the chorus is gonna do interesting things to the reverb anyway).
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

The use of the rear loop with pedal can result in overdrving the pedal's input. This loop is a high level output designed to drive rack mount devices that use line level signals (such as effects processors for PA use) or used to drive another power amp input.

Like you, I use two amps. My pedal board has a tuner, compressor, digital echo, digital reverb and a stereo chrous pedal last in the chain. I come out of the 2 stereo outputs of the chorus to the 2 amps. I also use a Hum-X on one of the amp's AC line cord to prevent ground loop hum. As I do not use transistor amps, I have no pedal loop or line level loops. My volume pedal comes right after the steel.

Some old info I posted a while back:

Often amps are designed with effects loops that actually do not work well with standard pedals. The problem can seen in this example of the N-400 loops (not so unlike many amps out there). Using a pre amp out to drive an effects unit is a bad idea, as it is a line level signal!

This was an earlier reply I made on the N-400 amp itself:

After 30 years of experience and training with the design of audio systems I do know a bit about overloading devices.

Let's take a Boss RV-5 pedal for example:

nominal input level rated for -20dbu (0.21 volts)

Nominal level is the normal operating signal that allows 10db of headroom in live music or 20db of headroom in recording application to allow for volume dynamics associated with playing or recording music. That from my old Yamaha manuals of years ago!!!

The preamp output of the N-400 is 1 volt nominal and can go much higher when psuhed! That is 5 times the nominal voltage the Boss RV-5 want to see for it normal operating range and best signal to noise ratio.

The RV-5's nominal output is also -20dbu, 5 times to weak to properly drive the power amp of the N-400 amp.

The pre EQ patch output of the N-400 is amazingly a nominal of 0.2 volts, same as the effects pedal requires!

The patch EQ input of the Nashville 400 is 0.2 volts, the same as the nominal output of the effects pedal.

There is no supporting argument for using the preamp to drive a common effects pedal. Those pedal are designed for unity gain and a guitar level signal at their input.

So in layman's terms. using the pre-amp out to feed a common effect pedal is like trying to shove 5 lbs of stuff in a 1 lb bag.

Your choice, do it either way. I just believe in the things I learned while I studied and trained in the Pro Audio field to preserve proper signal to noise ratio and prevent gain overlap (that leads to distortion)

I could go on further into gain overlap, impedance matching and a ream of other subject matter but I do not think it necessary for this application!!

A bit more from the net about operating levels:

Nominal level is the operating level at which an electronic signal processing device is designed to operate. The electronic circuits that make up such equipment are limited in the maximum signal they can output and the low-level internally-generated electronic noise they add to the signal. The difference between the internal noise and the maximum output level is the device's dynamic range. When a signal is chained improperly through many devices, the dynamic range of the signal is reduced. The nominal level is the level that these devices were designed to operate at, for best dynamic range.

In audio, a related measurement, signal-to-noise ratio, is usually defined as the difference between the nominal level and the noise floor, leaving the headroom as the difference between nominal and maximum output.[1][2] It is important to realize that the measured level is a time average, meaning that the peaks of audio signals regularly exceed the measured average level. The headroom measurement defines how far the peak levels can stray from the nominal measured level before clipping. The difference between the peaks and the average for a given signal is the crest factor.

There is some confusion over the use of the term "nominal", which is often used incorrectly to mean "average or typical". The relevant definition in this case is "as per design"; gain is applied to make the average signal level correspond to the designed, or nominal, level.

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

Thanks Ken,
I did not know that. I've used the "effects in" thinking that was the way to go. Sort of; Peavey put 'em there for you, so use 'em, kind of thinking.

To be honest, I do like the tone I get using the volume pedal and effects loops. The signal chain is not as sensitive to cable and cable lengths that way. Also, my volume pedal doesn't change the tone.

To be sure using straight cable runs, as you say you do, makes it easier using the effects pedals in line, and I can get stereo chorus, as well as get the reverb/delay from my RV3.
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You can observe a lot just by looking

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

The effects out and effects in loops are OK on an amp that has them. The preamp out and power amp inputs are the high level jacks. he Vegas 400 does not have an effects loop in the back, just a pre amp/power amp loop. Your pre eq patch points (the volume pedal loop) are at the level for effects units.

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

My mistake. Thanks Ken.
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You can observe a lot just by looking

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

I put my RV3 back in line with my volume pedal and gave it a good try, and I was never satisfied with the sound.

I know it may be wrong and maybe should not do it, but the RV3 and chorus sound MUCH better going through the pre out and in jacks.

I worked out the two amp hook up and I am happy with my rig now.

Thank you, to Ken for his advice I really do appreciate the time you took to respond.
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You can observe a lot just by looking

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