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Topic: Had to Show off this Showman I got ! |
Ken Metcalf
From:
San Antonio Texas USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 12:47 pm |
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Tolex and grillcloth on my Walker cabs to match. 
1966 Fender Showman with two JBL D-130s
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MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes |
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James Hartman
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 12:57 pm
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| Sweet. Looks in fine shape. I have a bunch of mid- '60s Fender amps but never owned one of these big boys. Congrats! |
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Cartwright Thompson
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Posted 20 May 2013 1:18 pm
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Just out of curiosity, what are the speakers?
Two 4ohm in series? Or do you just run 'em at 4ohms?
The Showman wants to see 8ohms. |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Ken Metcalf
From:
San Antonio Texas USA
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Ken Metcalf
From:
San Antonio Texas USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 1:38 pm
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| Cartwright Thompson wrote: |
Just out of curiosity, what are the speakers?
Two 4ohm in series? Or do you just run 'em at 4ohms?
The Showman wants to see 8ohms. |
The speakers are 4 ohm and need to end up 8 ohm together.
It must have come with 2-16 ohm speakers..?
If I run just one speaker it is okay but if I plug the 2nd one into the Ext speaker out it goes to 2 ohms.
Steve Cowell's Series box for the speakers.
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=246506
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MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes |
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Stephen Cowell
From:
Round Rock, Texas, USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 1:51 pm
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The original Showman came with a single 8ohm speaker in a cabinet with a 'tone ring'... this was an interesting assembly that inset the speaker into the cabinet, creating a port around the speaker. Google 'fender "tone ring"' for pictures and discussion.
There was a short period where the Showman came with either 8 or 4ohms, with no identifying marks otherwise... probably the last single Showmen were converted to dual, Fender used everything *plus* the oink.
Here's a web quote:
"4 ohm OT is either 022889 or 125A29A, and the
8 ohm OT would be 022897 or 125A30A. "
So if in doubt look at that transformer!
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Too much junk to list... always getting more. |
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Daniel Policarpo
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Posted 20 May 2013 5:00 pm
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If I had that Showman and cab set up, I'd be posting pictures too. Suhweeet!
I just looked up the 'tone ring' Stephen. I had never heard of Fender using that before. Concept seems pretty cool for a speaker cab: more flex and bass, less adverse cab-vibration? |
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Stephen Cowell
From:
Round Rock, Texas, USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 9:09 pm
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| Daniel Policarpo wrote: |
I just looked up the 'tone ring' Stephen. I had never heard of Fender using that before. Concept seems pretty cool for a speaker cab: more flex and bass, less adverse cab-vibration? |
Dan, I just did some more research... it's an open question, which part is the 'tone ring'? The hard-to-get part is the metal ring that spaces the speaker forward from the floating baffle... the space between the baffles gives the horn-loading (i.e. friction) to the back wave, helping it change phase so that it reinforces the front wave. In effect, you get a port that circles around the speaker, giving a 'point source' for both front and back waves; if you didn't have the metal spacing ring then the back wave would shoot across the speaker cone instead of turning 90 degrees and pumping forward with the speaker.
So is the 'tone ring' the spacer, or the port, or the concept itself? Folks are still arguing about it today. It's another of those cool inventions that were left by the wayside when CBS took over. I've never heard one in person... I'd love to play one and see how it sounds.
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Too much junk to list... always getting more. |
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Alvin Blaine
From:
Picture Rocks, Arizona, USA
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Posted 20 May 2013 10:49 pm
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| Stephen Cowell wrote: |
| Daniel Policarpo wrote: |
I just looked up the 'tone ring' Stephen. I had never heard of Fender using that before. Concept seems pretty cool for a speaker cab: more flex and bass, less adverse cab-vibration? |
Dan, I just did some more research... it's an open question, which part is the 'tone ring'? The hard-to-get part is the metal ring that spaces the speaker forward from the floating baffle... the space between the baffles gives the horn-loading (i.e. friction) to the back wave, helping it change phase so that it reinforces the front wave. In effect, you get a port that circles around the speaker, giving a 'point source' for both front and back waves; if you didn't have the metal spacing ring then the back wave would shoot across the speaker cone instead of turning 90 degrees and pumping forward with the speaker.
So is the 'tone ring' the spacer, or the port, or the concept itself? Folks are still arguing about it today. It's another of those cool inventions that were left by the wayside when CBS took over. I've never heard one in person... I'd love to play one and see how it sounds. |
I have one, along with my '66 Showman.
The only problem I run into with it is if someone tries to close mic it. Most sound guys like to close mic a speaker about an inch or two inside of the frame edge of a speaker pointed right at the speaker cone. With the tone-ring cab, you get too much low end rolling across that point, so I always have to tell them to put the mic near the center of the speaker and slightly aim it across towards the rim of the speaker frame. That way the low end, that comes out from around the speaker frame, doesn't get so over bearing to the microphone.
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http://www.oldbluesound.com/about.htm
http://www.facebook.com/cowboytwang |
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Stephen Cowell
From:
Round Rock, Texas, USA
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Posted 21 May 2013 6:34 am
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Alvin, the remedy you describe is how I thought it was supposed to be done... slightly off-center and off-axis. The sweet spot is near the coil, not the surround! Mic'ing near the port is a definite no-no.
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Too much junk to list... always getting more. |
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Alvin Blaine
From:
Picture Rocks, Arizona, USA
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Posted 21 May 2013 9:57 am
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| Stephen Cowell wrote: |
| Alvin, the remedy you describe is how I thought it was supposed to be done... slightly off-center and off-axis. The sweet spot is near the coil, not the surround! Mic'ing near the port is a definite no-no. |
Most sound guys don't like to mic the cone, on my amps at least, because they think it'll get to bright and edgy. Also my speakers have the aluminum dust covers and that even freaks them out more. I tell them that I do sound gigs and record all the time and like the mic just off center of the dust cover.
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http://www.oldbluesound.com/about.htm
http://www.facebook.com/cowboytwang |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 21 May 2013 11:37 am
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I did the bulk of my recording work in NYC with that very amp. I used a 2x12 cab from THD with celestion 16 ohm speakers. Sounded glorious. Ken's set up probably sounds even better !
I'm looking for 2 12" 8ohm speakers now to replace the 16 ohm ones. I like how old english speakers sound. I have an old Fane 12" in my deluxe that is perfect for me.
Here is a shot of Ken's amp recording and album in NYC with the band Hem.
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Bob
Last edited by Bob Hoffnar on 21 May 2013 12:26 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Chris Boyd
From:
Leonia,N.J./Charlestown,R.I.
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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