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Topic: Eleven Rack update |
Christopher Woitach
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 31 Oct 2011 7:26 pm |
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Bryan Daste came over to my house today, and we dinked around for a couple hours with the Eleven Rack. My basic setup is MSA Studio Pro S-12 Bb6, Hilton volume pedal, Eleven Rack, Lexicon MPX-1, Mackie 400 watt powered speaker. Bryan's is Emmons p/p S-12 Ext E9, Goodrich volume pedal, a tube pre (Bryan, whats it called again?), Pod XT, Nashville 400. I play jazz, use 4 picks, and like a tone that is fairly close to a jazz guitar (much less treble than seems to be norm for steel guitar). Bryan plays a variety of folk, country, etc (beautifully, I might add), probably other stuff, as well. He plays with a much brighter tone.
We put Bryan into the Eleven, and tried various rigs, effects, combinations of cabinet/no cabinet, effects loop on/off - all into the Mackie. Then we tried the Eleven in the effects loop of the Peavey, using it only as an effects unit with no amp or cabinet modeling.
Oh, and we had some fresh roasted coffee.
Bottom line? We'll have see what Bryan's final take was, but one thing he pointed out was that both of us were able to find some tones we liked, and our styles, instruments and desired tones are as different as can be. That really speaks to the flexibility of the Eleven. There was a lot we didn't try, including recording, and my grasp of the unit is quite rudimentary, as of yet. However, there are a LOT of very nice, very different tones in this box
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Christopher Woitach
cw@affmusic.com
www.affmusic.com |
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Bryan Daste
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2011 11:53 am
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Final take? That coffee was delicious!
I think the Eleven Rack is a sweet piece of gear, and you're getting some great tones out of it. I like the recording/re-amping functionality, even though we didn't try that out. I was impressed with the overall sound, and especially the distortions, which were very useable.
I'm used to the effects in my PodXT, which I actually really like, but I don't like its converters or the modeled amps & distortions. That's why I use the tube pedal (Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic) for overdrive, and the Nashville 400 for "amp." The Eleven took care of the distortion and amp problems beautifully, and had all the effects you'd need plus an effects loop. Christopher, running the Eleven into a PA speaker like you're doing is the perfect setup - and as I mentioned at the house, you're pretty set knowing that it's going to sound very similar going through any PA. You also mentioned you play guitar through the same rig with great results, which is nice - double duty.
Overall, I think the Eleven Rack is a great piece of gear, but for the setup I'm using it's probably overkill just to use it as a multi-effects unit. The PodXT is doing OK at that job. If I had an extra $800 to throw around, I would probably get a Roland Space Echo  but if I had another $800 I would definitely get the Eleven, if just to use as a front end, interface and reamp box for Pro Tools. It looks like it can't be beat as an all-purpose recording solution for steel and guitar. |
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Gary Cosden
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2011 12:10 pm
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| Did either of you notice any problem with over driving the input? Just curious. |
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Bryan Daste
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2011 1:11 pm
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| Nope. |
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John McClung
From:
Olympia WA, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2011 7:47 pm
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Bryan, when I get around to setting up a proper home recording rig, I've been leaning towards the Apogee Duet (now the Duet II) and Logic or Logic Express. I keep reading that the Apogee ADA converters are about as good as it gets.
Any idea how the "sound" recording through the Eleven Rack would compare to the Duet?
What are pros/cons between Logic and ProTools?
Thanks!
_________________
E9 INSTRUCTION
▪️ If you want to have an ongoing discussion, please email me, don't use the Forum messaging which I detest! steelguitarlessons@earthlink.net
Last edited by John McClung on 1 Nov 2011 9:22 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Christopher Woitach
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2011 8:27 pm
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It is possible to overdrive the unit, depending on what you have first in the chain, but it's easy to set it up so you don't. We had no problems.
When I have more time, I'll work more on the Pro Tools end of things.
I'm hoping to get Pete Burak to come over and try his axe through the unit and get another opinion.
I think this will work.
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Christopher Woitach
cw@affmusic.com
www.affmusic.com |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2013 9:49 pm
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After spending all day with Eleven Rack I have requested a Return Authorization number.
I want to like it & keep it, and a unit of this depth deserves more than a few hours before I give up.
But on the other hand if I can't get a good sound after several hours, I think I will stick with the gear that sounds good right away.
Chris W, you got a great sound on that clip you posted in November. What amp model did you use, and what EQ and gain etc etc etc? |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2013 9:52 pm
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| Christopher Woitach wrote: |
| It is possible to overdrive the unit, depending on what you have first in the chain, but it's easy to set it up so you don't. We had no problems. |
One of its Utility features is a Meter function which you can place anywhere in the chain. At the input it showed that my steel guitar pickups were not too hot for the input. This was a surprise to me considering that every factory sound is dirty, which is not a surprise considering who buys these things. Typical meter reading was 3/10 or 4/10. The hardest strum across all 12 stings gave 8/10. This is with no volume pedal, just pickup to Eleven Rack.
Still I found it quite a chore to get a clean sound. Only 3 or 4 of the many amp models could sound clean for me, by turning down the first gain stages, and turning up the later ones (often called "Master" altho the terms used vary between the amp models.) Most of the amp models still have lots of "hair" even with the first gain at the lowest possible setting.
It is possible to disable all the amp models but I didn't like that sound either.
Last edited by Earnest Bovine on 29 Mar 2013 10:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2013 10:04 pm
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A couple of other "features" that I didn't like:
1. I noticed latency immediately. I hear the sound from my picks before I hear it in the headphones. After an hour I didn't notice latency anymore but I think I just got used to it. I am using it stand-alone (not with a computer or Pro Tools) so there is no setting it from the computer as there is with many A/D converters. I did change the sample rate up to 96k from 44.1 and maybe that helped.
My cheap 15-year-old Boss GX-700 has no detectable latency for me so it was a surprise to find this on a modern unit.
2. With some effects, I heard very unpleasant aliasing as I mashed my A pedal in a chord. As the B string went up, the ugly aliasing tone went down, sounding like a grotesque ring modulator. Ick!!! It seemed worse with some of the cabinet models, but that is one of the things I want to use. This is a deal breaker.
3. After some half-hour sessions with headphones coming from the Eleven Rack, my ears felt fatigued. I never knew what that meant until today. I even had a ringing in my ear, and that never happens. |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 30 Mar 2013 8:46 am
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| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
2. With some effects, I heard very unpleasant aliasing as I mashed my A pedal in a chord. As the B string went up, the ugly aliasing tone went down, sounding like a grotesque ring modulator. Ick!!! It seemed worse with some of the cabinet models, but that is one of the things I want to use. This is a deal breaker.
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Today I think "aliasing" is not what I'm hearing. It happens with cabinet models bypassed, and is part of the amp model. Sounds like this come from guitar amps when you turn them up loud enough to distort. And I think the Eleven Rack is accurately modeling these "sum and difference" frequencies.
I like the Eleven Rack better today. It's so versatile. I would keep it if I could find one "Rig" that is anywhere close to the Revelation pre-amp. |
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Karlis Abolins
From:
(near) Seattle, WA, USA
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Posted 30 Mar 2013 3:40 pm
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My go-to for clean sound is really simple. I disable everything except for a little reverb and the volume pedal.. No amp, no cab, no fx. I set my input to 1meg ohm with no cap. I have tried several of the amp models. My favorites are MS30 and DC Modern Clean (in the expansion pack).
I really like the touch sensitivity of the unit. You can get beautiful clean tones by picking lightly, and then cross over into crunch by being more aggressive with your attack.
Karlis |
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