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Topic: First Pedal Steel Guitar |
Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 11:54 am |
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I am a guitar player and am interested in learning the pedal steel. I am trying to find out where to start and am looking for any recommendations on a good beginner's setup.
I have enough experience playing guitar to have a sense for where the quality breakpoints are and when I play a guitar I can appreciate what I like and don't like about it. I don't have any experience with a pedal steel so I don't really know what I am looking for.
A basic Squire Stratocaster is really inexpensive, like maybe $100-$130 for a brand new one retail. A Mexican Fender Stratocaster is a bit more, maybe $300-$350 or something like that. The American Stratocasters can be much more expensive. I think a lot of people see the Squire as a good starting point, for kids in particular, because it is a low investment cost and maybe it doesn't seem much different than the more expensive ones. It doesn't take very long before even a beginner starts to appreciate the limitations of the Squire. They can be such a hassle that they are actually an obstacle to someone developing a passion and excitement for playing. The Mexican Strat jumps up to the next price point but is generally a much better piece of equipment and I would say is a better starter instrument because it isn't going to be frustrating to deal with.
I think what I am looking for is the pedal steel counterpart to the Mexican Strat. I don't need the top end stuff to get started with but I want an instrument that will be a pleasure to play and will not hinder the learning process. What some folks are telling me is that a lot of the entry level pedal steels are just that. GFI has their Student Model. StageOne has something similar (as far as I can tell) at that same price point, around $1,000.
If any of you would care to share your thoughts on this I would appreciate any input. What is a good instrument to get started with? Are the 2 that I mentioned above good or are they going to quickly become an obstacle?
Thanks for your time and thanks for any input.
jsb
Last edited by Jeff Scott Brown on 1 Sep 2012 7:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 12:25 pm Re: First Pedal Steel Guitar
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Welcome, Jeff.
To help answer your question, about how many of the previous threads on this subject have you read?
| Jeff Scott Brown wrote: |
| .. the limitations of the Squire. They can be such a hassle that they are actually an obstacle |
What are the limitations of the Squire? |
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Fred Justice
From:
Mesa, Arizona
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 12:25 pm
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Jeff welcome to the Steel Guitar Forum, and at the same time let me try to help you get started in steel guitar.
First off let me direct you to our website where you'll find lots of info on both the Justice "S10~3x4" and the Justice "Pro Lite", either one of these guitars would serve you well in what your wanting to get in to.
http://www.fredjusticemusic.com/
Secondly let me steer you to a recent thread that tells all about the S10~3x4, here is that link
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=232318
Jeff, again welcome and if I can help you in any way please don't hesitate to contact me, thanks for looking.
_________________
Email: azpedalman@gmail.com
Phone: 480-235-8797 |
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 12:45 pm Re: First Pedal Steel Guitar
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| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
Welcome, Jeff.
To help answer your question, about how many of the previous threads on this subject have you read?
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| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
| What are the limitations of the Squire? |
The Squire has low end pickups. The Mexican Strat generally has a better ceramic pickup. The Squire does not have a full size tremelo block. The tuners on the Squires are not very good quality. I am not sure if most of the blame lies on the tremelo or the tuners but those conspire to make them a hassle to keep in tune. You can't set a Squire up with really low action without getting fret buzz at various points on the neck. That is the sort of thing that would vary from guitar to guitar but to get one that was really straight would be fluke. I haven't played any Squires for extended periods of time so I can't speak to this directly but the pots feel really cheap and I would expect that they don't hold up very well particularly if you actively work them while playing a lot.
There are a lot of subjective things that some players would dislike more than others. The Squires just don't feel good. |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 1:11 pm
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| If you're in O'Fallon, you can drive over to the St Louis Millennium Hotel today or tomorrow and try out lots of them. Many builders are at the annual trade show. |
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 1:28 pm
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| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
| If you're in O'Fallon, you can drive over to the St Louis Millennium Hotel today or tomorrow and try out lots of them. Many builders are at the annual trade show. |
I did that. |
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Daniel McKee
From:
Corinth Mississippi
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 1:29 pm
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| I dont think you can go wrong with any student models or pro models but I would suggest trying a few steels to find one that fits you. |
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 1:38 pm
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| Fred Justice wrote: |
Jeff welcome to the Steel Guitar Forum, and at the same time let me try to help you get started in steel guitar.
First off let me direct you to our website where you'll find lots of info on both the Justice "S10~3x4" and the Justice "Pro Lite", either one of these guitars would serve you well in what your wanting to get in to.
http://www.fredjusticemusic.com/
Secondly let me steer you to a recent thread that tells all about the S10~3x4, here is that link
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=232318
Jeff, again welcome and if I can help you in any way please don't hesitate to contact me, thanks for looking. |
Fred,
Thanks for the info. I will investigate.
Are you at The Millennium?
jsb |
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 2:11 pm
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| Jeff Scott Brown wrote: |
| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
| If you're in O'Fallon, you can drive over to the St Louis Millennium Hotel today or tomorrow and try out lots of them. Many builders are at the annual trade show. |
I did that. |
While there I spent some time with the GFI guys, someone from Scotty's and Dawn Jackson. All of them had helpful input for me. The Jackson stuff seems like it is probably good stuff as well as the 2 I mentioned in my initial note. I think the entry price point for the Jackson is a little higher and I don't know enough about what I am looking for to know if that is the route to go or not.
I suspect that this is like a lot of things and a lot of it boils down to personal preference and until you are into it a bit you won't have developed those preferences.
One thing that my research has shown is that the pedal steel scene is different than a lot of others in the way that it is opinionated. I am a competitive archer. Archers are by and large opinionated. If you ask 10 archers a question you are likely to get 11 opinions. Many archers feel strongly that brand X rocks and all other brands are crap. What I am finding so far in the pedal steel community is that many folks feel like brand X rocks not to the exclusion of but in harmony with a bunch of others that rock just as well. 
Thanks again for your input. |
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Robert Murphy
From:
West Virginia
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 2:21 pm
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| I have bought and sold enough instruments in my musicial journey to feel I can contribute something to this conversation. My 2 cents. Be patient and a lightly used pro guitar will come along at the top of the student price range. Get your money back on a good used steel if you can't find your groove. By low and break even. 3 x 4 is the minimum I would settle for. I just purchased a 2 year old GFI Ultra within driving distance for 1/2 list price. Getting it tomorrow. A pro guitar will never hold you back or be difficult to tune or play, it will give you the most satisfaction in tone and inspire you to match the marvels of it's mechanics. Good luck brother. |
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Fred Justice
From:
Mesa, Arizona
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 2:36 pm Are You There?
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Jeff I'm sorry, I didn't go to St Louis this year.
_________________
Email: azpedalman@gmail.com
Phone: 480-235-8797 |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 9:45 pm
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Human nature being what it is, everybody will tell you that the brand they play is the best. (They're all wrong of course. The brand I play is the best.) 
Seriously, EVERYBODY makes great steels these days, and it doesn't make much difference which one you buy, as long as it has a minimum of 10 strings (12 are better if you want to play rock,) 3 pedals and 4 knee levers. (5 are better, but not necessary.)
With that in mind, you can get a Stage One, Legend (formerly called the Carpsteel) or Simmons for about $1,000. There are also some excellent deals in the classified ads here. There's a nice looking BMI on page 3.
I would avoid the Carter Starter though. They are fine for beginners, but unlike the Carter pro models, are not very sturdy or in my opinion, well made. I think most of them will fall apart in a few years.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Peter den Hartogh
From:
Cape Town, South Africa
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Posted 31 Aug 2012 11:14 pm
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I would get a professional model for 3 reasons:
1- It forces you to commit yourself all the way.
2- If you struggle with the tone, you cannot blame the guitar.
3- You do not need to upgrade soon.
_________________
1977 Sho~Bud D10 ProIII Custom; Sho~Bud SD10 The Professional ; ETS S10 5x5;
Fender 1000; 1993 Remington U12; 1978 Emmons S10 P/P; GeorgeB Weissenborn;
Fluger Cat-Can; Asher Electro Hawaiian; Gibson BR4; Fender FS52; Guyatone 8str;
Fender Resonator ; Epiphone Coronet 1937; Rickenbacher Ace; Rickenbacher NS;
Dynalap 8string; Harbor Lights 8string; Aiersi Tri-Cone; Fender Stringmaster |
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Mike Waddell
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 3:19 am
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As a longtime guitarist, take it from me...
About two months ago, I bought a 70's Rus-ler student model (3&1). Within the first 30 min of playing/sitting down with a Mickey Adams video, I realized the challenge wasn't in making music on the instrument, just in replicating the right feel...
I also realized the student model would probably be outgrown in a couple of weeks.
Get yourself a nice big professional model D-10, if only for the fact you're going to wish you had more... Have fun committing to it too!! It's an awesome instrument to play; even the mistakes sound awesome. |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 3:49 am
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| Mike Waddell wrote: |
I also realized the student model would probably be outgrown in a couple of weeks.
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That's just about right. Maybe even sooner with today's instruction material.
Having only one knee lever is like having a 6 string guitar with only 3 frets.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Jim Curtain
From:
Phoenix,Arizona, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 6:20 am
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| I bought a Carter-Starter Jan 2012, just bought a Dekley SD-10. The Carter isn't bad, however a upgrade was necessary. Spend the extra coin and get a pro model. |
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Chris Dorch
From:
Wisconsin, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 6:35 am
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Examine these options and you'll be learned in your wants and desires...
Stage One, new or used..
BSG, new or used..
MSA, used...
GFI pro model, used...
Carter pro model (not starter), used...
ETS, new...
Carpsteel, used... |
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Bob Vantine
From:
Freeville, New York, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 7:15 am
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Several , including myself , look at the StageOne as more than a student model while keeping expenses down .
I believe that Doug has his new model at St.Louis this week on display . At around $1500 and optional pick-ups and pedal set-ups I wouldn't hesitate at all to puchase one .
Good luck and enjoy the process !
_________________
EQUIPMENT:
"TEAK" ZUM STAGE-ONE Steel / C6th Lapsteel
Peavey NV112 , CLASSIC and EFX112 amps
Peavey Guitars |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Jeff Scott Brown
From:
O'Fallon Missouri, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 7:44 am
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| Bob Vantine wrote: |
| I believe that Doug has his new model at St.Louis this week on display . |
I didn't think he was going to be there. Do you know if he has his stuff setup at someone else's booth?
jsb |
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Bob Vantine
From:
Freeville, New York, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2012 7:55 am
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Jeff.....
Doug said his new StageOne , I believe it's called the "Encore" , should be at the ZUM booth with Bruce .
Not sure on the location .
_________________
EQUIPMENT:
"TEAK" ZUM STAGE-ONE Steel / C6th Lapsteel
Peavey NV112 , CLASSIC and EFX112 amps
Peavey Guitars |
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steve takacs
From:
beijing, china via pittsburgh (deceased)
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Posted 4 Sep 2012 5:33 am
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| I have one of Doug Earnest's Stage Ones (3 pedals & 4 levers) with me in Beijing and thought billed as a "student guitar", it is way beyond that in terms of playability, sound, ability to stay in tune, etc. etc, etc. . I feel, it would keep a new student going for several years. His newer model, the Encore, is even better with the changeable copedant. One can buy a used Stage One for $800 and up. I'm happy that it is extremely light but stable (does not move around when levers are engaged). My body is happy that in the case it weighs only 42 lbs. stevet |
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Mike Mantey
From:
Eastern Colorado, USA
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Posted 4 Sep 2012 7:47 am
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If your looking for something inexpensive, the Jackson, Justice 3~4, or the Stage One are the way to go. Like with anything you get what you pay for. We all Build excellent pro models and our company (Mullen) builds a great flight model, but it is not considered a student model and it is more expensive.
I think the Justice seems like a good deal, and Fred is a Great guy. So are the Jackson's. Well now I don't know what to tell you. They are all good, I would look at the quality and customer service....
_________________
Mike Mantey
President and C.E.O.
Mullen Guitar Co., Inc.
(970) 664-2518
sales@mullenguitars.com
www.mullenguitars.com |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 4 Sep 2012 1:58 pm
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| Whatever you get, I would suggest an all-pull model. There are still some new models being made, especially in the "starter" category, that are a pull/release, or one-piece finger designs. While these can be fine for some players, they simply do not offer the adjustability and versatility of the all-pull designs. |
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