| Author |
Topic: Playing Backup? |
Patsy Askins
From:
Kentucky, USA
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 1:37 pm |
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| I can play the leadwork of most songs by ear. What do I need to do to learn to play backup for a singer? |
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Ray McCarthy
From:
New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 1:46 pm
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| I think just listening to the pros on recordings and humming the parts they do might be a start. It's a matter of responding to the singer--as long as what you do is within the proper chord, and you keep it simple--and you don't step on the singer, it's not complicated. |
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Ransom Beers
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 1:57 pm
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I used to play by ear but found using picks is much easier on the old ears,just funnin' ya!
.As was mentioned listen to the singer do your fills & lead rides to the best of your ability when it's your turn & don't over play,less is more!! |
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Jim Priebe
From:
Queensland, Australia - R.I.P.
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 4:10 pm
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I would start with the Jazz saying
" if someone has to show you how to play jazz you're in trouble from the start"
Naturally, it helps if you can read music or at least understand Keys and Bars,
however there are a few simple rules with playing backup
1 know the chord structure without even thinking
2 avoid playing the same timing/phrasing the singer is singing
3 start off playing only in the 'gaps'
4 play to improve the overall sound and the singer's performance (not yours)
5 generally, less is better
6 listen, listen, listen
If the singer comes over and thanks you then that is a major bonus - just don't
bank on it.
and
So --- that's why Ransome doesn't have his head shot as his Avatar !!   
_________________
Priebs GFI ('09)Short-Uni10. GFI ('96)Short-Uni SD11. ('86)JEM U12
www.steelguitardownunder.com |
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Herby Wallace
From:
Sevierville, TN, R.I.P.
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 4:26 pm Backup
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Learning to backup a singer with taste and not over play does take time to develop the technique so to speak. I have a series of 6 backup courses that do help to get you in the right direction. In the courses I have all the words of the song on the tab and I show where each run or fill fits between the phrases of the song. Of course, you can also hear it on the CD that comes with the course. If you are interested, please let me know.
Thanks,
Herby Wallace |
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Cal Sharp
From:
the farm in Kornfield Kounty, TN
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 4:40 pm
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Play in the holes between the vocal lines. Different singers will hold the last note longer or shorter, so listen for that. More half-assed advice at Insanity.
_________________
C#
Me: Steel Guitar Madness
Latest ebook: Steel Guitar Insanity
Custom Made Covers for Steel Guitars & Amps at Sharp Covers Nashville
Last edited by Cal Sharp on 15 Mar 2012 4:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 4:41 pm
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| Quote: |
| I used to play by ear but found using picks is much easier on the old ears,just funnin' ya! |
I wish you would have posted this 40 years ago. My ears really hurt. And, what are these pick things you mention?
Everyone pretty much hit on what it takes. You don't necessarily have to play an "answer" (similar melody) to the vocals, but keep it within the feel of the song. Don't spit out a 400 mph run of notes in Together Again. You do that and you will not be "Together Again" with that band again.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 15 Mar 2012 8:20 pm
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| Point and counterpoint. Let the singer make the point; you in turn, with the rest of the band, provide the counterpoint. |
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Ransom Beers
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 1:48 am
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| Richard Sinkler wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I used to play by ear but found using picks is much easier on the old ears,just funnin' ya! |
I wish you would have posted this 40 years ago. My ears really hurt. And, what are these pick things you mention?
Everyone pretty much hit on what it takes. You don't necessarily have to play an "answer" (similar melody) to the vocals, but keep it within the feel of the song. Don't spit out a 400 mph run of notes in Together Again. You do that and you will not be "Together Again" with that band again. |
Forty yrs. ago? Hell I was a babe in arms,or did I have a babe in my arms?
Anyway good advice,feel the music,get comfortable with your playing & it will come naturally.I would also suggest Herby's CD's ,he's a super teacher. |
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Ransom Beers
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 1:48 am
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Last edited by Ransom Beers on 16 Mar 2012 2:28 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ray McCarthy
From:
New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 2:25 am
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A good way to practise, I've found, is to play against recordings that do not have steel in them. Just make stuff up. When you think you've got something, record it if you can. I have a whole slew of recordings of me playing along with the big guys. Some of it aint bad  |
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Patsy Askins
From:
Kentucky, USA
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 9:45 am
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| Thank you all for your advice.I appreciate your time. |
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Patsy Askins
From:
Kentucky, USA
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 9:47 am
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| By the way, my name is Wayne Askins. Patsy is my wife. She set this up and put in the wrong username. |
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Frank Freniere
From:
The First Coast
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 11:51 am
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| Cal Sharp wrote: |
| Play in the holes between the vocal lines. Different singers will hold the last note longer or shorter, so listen for that. More half-assed advice at Insanity. |
Cal, if I sort of indirectly question you, would you also give half-asked advice? |
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Ransom Beers
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 12:28 pm
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| Patsy Askins wrote: |
| By the way, my name is Wayne Askins. Patsy is my wife. She set this up and put in the wrong username. |
So does this mean she's playing for a "Patsy"????   |
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Al Szwarc
From:
Metuchen, New Jersey, USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 12:53 pm Play along
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| You might try Jeff Newmans "Up from the top". What you are seeking is the main thrust of that lesson set. He tabs short runs and tells you how to put them into the songs. He even uses a singer for you to work around. If you get stuck finding it let me know. Good luck with it whatever you do. al |
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Tim Tyner
From:
Ayden, North Carolina U.S.A
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 7:30 pm
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| Though he's not a steel player listen to a few songs that has Jimmy Capps on guitar.There's not a musician anywhere that can place fills in a song any more tastefully than Jimmy.He always plays the right phrase in the right place at the right time.He has been on countless sessions.Plays Dobro as well. |
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Cal Sharp
From:
the farm in Kornfield Kounty, TN
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Posted 16 Mar 2012 8:11 pm
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| Frank Freniere wrote: |
Cal, if I sort of indirectly question you, would you also give half-asked advice? |
Half-asked, whole-asked, I'm mighty free with advice in my dotage.
_________________
C#
Me: Steel Guitar Madness
Latest ebook: Steel Guitar Insanity
Custom Made Covers for Steel Guitars & Amps at Sharp Covers Nashville |
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Bud Angelotti
From:
Larryville, NJ, USA
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Posted 17 Mar 2012 7:09 am
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Dave said "Point and counterpoint. Let the singer make the point; you in turn, with the rest of the band, provide the counterpoint."
Thats really all there is to it.
It's also refered to as "Call and Response". Try to create a musical conversation, and like any good conversation, it involves listening. Don't feel you HAVE to react. Sometimes less is more. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 17 Mar 2012 7:48 am
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All these suggestions are correct. If I may, I'd like to post an excerpt from a column that I write for the TSGA monthly newsletter:
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| Most confusing to new players is what to play behind a singer, and how to approach fills. Fills are short phrases that add appropriate comments to what the singer is singing, placed in the holes and pauses when the vocalist is taking a breath, or at the end of a line or phrase. These are usually no more than a few notes in duration, and quieter than solo volume. Think of what goes on in a verbal conversation: someone has the floor and is making a statement, and his listeners acknowledge what he’s saying by short statements like “I see,” “okay,” “I understand,” “uh, huh,” or some sort of short reply. This is what we do when approaching the idea of filling the holes. When you’re talking and someone who should be listening to you is talking over you, you realize that he’s not paying any attention to what you’re saying, and there’s no communication going on. This is what a singer or soloist feels when he hears another player wailing away behind him, competing for the attention of the audience when he should be helping the singer/soloist communicate. Think of filling as being in a polite conversation and you’ll be much more appreciated as a sideman. |
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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