Fender Steel Guitars

Fred Shannon · From: Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas, R.I.P.

Continued from : http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=1903034#1903034

quote: Donny Hinson
From:
Balto., Md. U.S.A. Posted Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:40 am
Fred Shannon wrote:
just about the guitars and i'm gone. There was a conversation one time with Reece involved and I've forgotten who else was there but if memory serves me correctly the two guitars in this clip were perhaps the first two Fender 1000's built. Wills had a strong working agreement with Leo Fender for equipment. Reece I belive in the conversation perhaps stated these were two of first Double 8's shipped to the Playboys. Wish he would join in on this one. Gonna' call him. thanks Carl

phred "
Hi Fred! Sorry, but in the interest of accuracy, the first 1000's made did not have the black finish (which both guitars in this clip have). A good number of the earliest ones were produced with a polished aluminum frame, but because of casting inperfections, they switched over to the "pebble finish" paint to hide these casting imperfections (which were mainly pinholes and embedded slag particles).
UNQUOTE;

From:
Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas Posted Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:12 am

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Donny, sure glad to see you back on the forum and have really missed your threads about the history of this instrument. You are probably right about the Fender 1000's but i've just received an email from Reece (awaiting permission to publish it) that is totally relative to Carl's thread but at the risk of getting into an area Carl may not have intended I'm starting another thread under Pedal Steel entitled "Fender Steel Guitars".
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=221379

Carl you've been super nice in allowing us to jump the track and I hope you are aware we appreciate your patience.

Phred
Gene Jones I remember the Bulldog too but didn't it have more of a blunt front and back than the Crush had. I seem to remember the Crush with more of a point to it.

phred

i'M waiting for a reply for permission to print an email from Reece Anderson.
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There are only two defining forces that have offered to die for you; Jesus Christ and the American GI!!

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Fred Shannon · From: Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas, R.I.P.

Here's his approval.

Absolutely Fred....you may do what you wish with my email. Or, if you prefer I can write it a little better because my email to you was not thought out as well as it would be were I to be writing it for publication....but the decision is yours. Just let me know.

Have a great day my friend.

Reece
----------------------------------------------------

On Feb 22, 2012, at 10:22 PM, Fred Shannon wrote:
Didn’t you tell me at one time the two fender guitars you and Crownover are playing on that one clip of Wills with the wills brother singing were the two first fender 1000’s either built or were the first two that were shipped to the playboys???? phred
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Charge my error up to an old man's memory. It wasn't the first Fender 1000 for Reece but it was the first 10 string (2000 OR PROTOTYPE 10 string Fender)

Here's Reece's answer to my email above:
From: Reece Anderson [mailto:msareece@verizon.net]
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:02 AM
To: Fred Shannon
Subject: Re: first fender 1000's

Morning Fred,

I don't know the history of Gene's Fender 1000, but I can tell you that I believe my "10" string Fender was the first single 10 ever made, and here's why.

After I had been on Bob's band a week or so he asked me to play a Fender guitar, and I told him I was not comfortable playing an 8 string guitar and I needed 10 strings. A few days later when were were playing at Dancetown USA in Houston and staying at a local hotel, Bob called me to his hotel room, and when I arrived he was talking on the phone and had left his door slightly opened...so when I knocked he told me to come in. He was talking on the phone, then a minute later he handed me the phone and said Leo wants to talk to you. (which of course floored me) Leo asked why I wasn't playing a Fender, (of course the main reason was, I greatly preferred my Bigsby single 10) but I said, because I have to have a 10 string. Leo asked if there was very many players using a 10 string and I told him I thought the steel guitar world was going to a 10 string in my opinion. After a few more questions and a quick pleasantry he asked to again talk with Bob, I handed the phone back to Bob, waved and left his room while he was still talking to Leo.

About a couple months later I arrived at Bob's bus at the Longhorn Ranch in Dallas where the band always met to go on tour, and when I walked up to the front door Bob was turned sideways sitting in the drivers seat with his boots on a steel guitar case. He then said, "I've got a surprise for you", and you guessed it, it was a 10 string Fender.

So thats why I truly believe the guitar I played was the very first Fender 10 string guitar ever made. The last night I played that guitar was at Panther Hall when I left it on the bus.

Always great to hear from you my friend....and I really appreciate your putting a picture on the forum of Bob's bus. I was on it playing poker on the way to Houston the last time it blew up and we left it in Conroe Texas.

Take care my friend and please give Dovey a hug for me.

Your friend always,

Reece
_________________
There are only two defining forces that have offered to die for you; Jesus Christ and the American GI!!

Think about it!!

Fred Shannon · From: Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas, R.I.P.

You're welcome to post anything about Fender Steel Guitars here, especially those items that relate to the history of the instruments, but only Fender Guitars please. phred
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There are only two defining forces that have offered to die for you; Jesus Christ and the American GI!!

Think about it!!

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

Here's the business side of mine Fred.. She plays great, and there aren't many 6+4 S10 Fender steels out there... I love this guitar.
Never breaks a string, always in tune, and has as sweet a sound as any steel ever made, IMHO. I sold my last 800 to someone in Texas, and wanted to shoot myself for doing so, and then this one dropped into my lap, a year or two later, and it stays here.

I adore old Fender pedal steels, and since its my 3rd one, I have learned a ton about how to set them up, and get them to play soft and sweet....bob

_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!

no gear list for me.. you don't have the time......

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

btw, I have always felt Fender developed a really good pull system that just needed some refinement.. Ball bearings on the main roller, some good precision roller guides for the cables, and a changer that would drop notes a little lower with less travel... Knee levers as well of course.
Lighter frame and body perhaps..
They had a good system, but I guess they wanted bigger sale numbers, and realized the market was limited.. A shame really.

LOTS of great music was made on these guitars however, except of course, when I play mine... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!

no gear list for me.. you don't have the time......

Fred Shannon · From: Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas, R.I.P.

Bob I remember buying an 800 from someone in NY but i don't think it was you. Al Marcus and i used it long distance to come up with some of the 6th tunings we worked out a long time ago. Sure did like it and setup changes were a snap with it. Are these knees pictured on your axe the ones you've been posting about on other threads?

phred
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There are only two defining forces that have offered to die for you; Jesus Christ and the American GI!!

Think about it!!

Russ Tkac · Posted 23 Feb 2012 12:19 pm

Very nice bob. Still have my 400s - one that I got from from phred. Smile

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Hi again Fred!

The "Tulsa" clip is interesting, for sure. Gene's Fender is definitely a 1000, and a pre '63 (because of the blond top). My monitor isn't real big, so I can't say for sure what Reece is playing, but I do see a sunburst top, so that puts his guitar as a '63 or later (the 800 and 2000 came out in '64). I honestly can't tell for sure if it's a single or double, but the splayed legs seem to indicate it's a single neck (400 or 800 model) guitar. One thing for sure, the lead player's got a Jaguar, which seems to have some wear. As the Jag came out in '62, I'd guess that the clip is likely from 1964 or '65.

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

Reece Anderson · From: Keller Texas USA, R.I.P.

I've always had the very highest respect for Leo Fender and all Fender guitars. The design was exceptional, it worked well, consistent, and was very durable.

When the pedal guitars first came on the market, they broke strings excessively, because the bend at the changer was too severe. I saw that as a design flaw which I knew would be VERY difficult to overcome, especially when knowing Fender had already designed and built thousands of parts and shipped steel guitars all over the world.

The way Leo and Fender solved the problem was astonishingly simple, AND, would fit any Fender pedal guitar already made, cost less than a penny, and worked perfectly.

They simply started providing a "C" clip which went through the hole at the changer end, and the string ball attached to the other end of the clip. Their string breaking issue was solved, redesign issues were solved, having to build new parts was solved, existing inventory cost was saved, reliability was re-established, and distribution of the part to retrofit any Fender anywhere within minutes, solved the problem of guitars already sold.

Absolute genius...........Leo was a very gracious and exceptional man whom I'm fortunate and privileged to have considered a friend in later years.

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

Reece... Wonderful of you to say those nice things about the Fender design, and about Leo himself.
After all, I imagine for a a few years in the late 60's early 70's the Fender pedal steel guitars were a sales competitor to your own MSA guitars.

Your MSA guitars were so very different from Fender of course..
The reason I wrote this is for that very fact.
I played MSA guitars for decades, and played one in particular for close to 25 years. I have had at least 5 MSA steels over the years.
IMHO, when the Classic series came out, there was nothing on the market that could touch it from an engineering, reliability, and adjustability standpoint.. Tone as you know is always subjective..
MSA guitars can outlast those playing them.

We see the same thing in the Fender design..
Some of them are well over 50 years old, and are still being played today, and function perfectly.

Good design is good design.. I am so happy you posted this reply, and that there is actually an emotional "link" between two truly great pedal steel guitar pioneers/designers/builders. bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!

no gear list for me.. you don't have the time......

Fred Shannon · From: Rocking "S" Ranch, Comancheria, Texas, R.I.P.

I think Reece's emaill implies a single neck but of course he's monitoring this thread so he can correct that if necessary. We speak continuously today of 'bottom line figure'. Don't be fooled the Fender folks were always cognizant of 'bottom line' in every endeavor they undertook, not just in steel guitars.Also amazing is the relationship that more than Wills as a bandleader had a 'mouth to mouth' rapport with Leo Fender. Hoyle Nix, through a music store owner here in this little town, was able to procure a 400 psg for me with very little red tape. It was a thing of beauty to a young man I can tell you.

Reece, tell you what would be interesting. Do you still remember the setup of that first 10 stringer? Were you already working on the Bb6 Uni type tuning at this time? Don't remember, no sweat.

Let's see some pics of the mods. I can tell you Michael Johnstone sent me some pics of a guitar he modified that, up to now, surpassed all the modifications I've ever seen on these wonderful axes.

phred
_________________
There are only two defining forces that have offered to die for you; Jesus Christ and the American GI!!

Think about it!!

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

The Fender folks made over 50 design changes to their cable guitars, but they kept most of these changes quite simple, so as to not affect producibility of the instrument. Compared to their dirt-simple straight guitars, their pedal steels were quite a bargain for the time.

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