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Topic: The decline and fall of western civilization: |
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 27 Nov 2011 5:50 pm |
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Rolling Stone's "greatest guitarist of all time."
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/100-greatest-guitarists-20111123
While Jimi Hendrix and Eric Clapton are numbers 1 and 2, among those who are missing from the list are Andre Segovia, Sabicas, Barney Kessell, Charlie Christian, Grady Martin, Wes Montgomery, Jimmy Bryant, Carlos Montoya, George Van Eps, Hank Garland, Tal Farlow, Kenny Burrell, Merle Travis, Jim Hall, George Barnes, Joe Pass, Herb Ellis and Phil Baugh.
Idiots! 
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin
Last edited by Mike Perlowin on 28 Nov 2011 3:27 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Andy Sandoval
From:
Bakersfield, California, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2011 8:19 pm
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| I guess they should have said "greatest rock guitarist" of all time |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 27 Nov 2011 8:44 pm
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Yes, the greatest "rock guitarists" of all time.
Did you notice who the Voters were? 
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| THE VOTERS: Trey Anastasio, Dan Auerbach (The Black Keys), Brian Bell (Weezer), Ritchie Blackmore (Deep Purple), Carl Broemel (My Morning Jacket), James Burton, Jerry Cantrell (Alice in Chains), Gary Clark Jr., Billy Corgan, Steve Cropper, Dave Davies (The Kinks), Anthony DeCurtis (Contributing editor, Rolling Stone), Tom DeLonge (Blink-182), Rick Derringer, Luther Dickinson (North Mississippi Allstars), Elliot Easton (The Cars), Melissa Etheridge, Don Felder (The Eagles), David Fricke (Senior writer, Rolling Stone), Peter Guralnick (Author), Kirk Hammett (Metallica), Albert Hammond Jr. (The Strokes), Warren Haynes (The Allman Brothers Band), Brian Hiatt (Senior writer, Rolling Stone), David Hidalgo (Los Lobos), Jim James (My Morning Jacket), Lenny Kravitz, Robby Krieger (The Doors), Jon Landau (Manager), Alex Lifeson (Rush), Nils Lofgren (The E Street Band), Mick Mars (Mötley Crüe), Doug Martsch (Built to Spill), J Mascis (Dinosaur Jr.), Brian May, Mike McCready (Pearl Jam), Roger McGuinn (The Byrds), Scotty Moore, Thurston Moore (Sonic Youth), Tom Morello, Dave Mustaine (Megadeth), Brendan O’Brien (Producer), Joe Perry, Vernon Reid (Living Colour), Robbie Robertson, Rich Robinson (The Black Crowes), Carlos Santana, Kenny Wayne Shepherd, Marnie Stern, Stephen Stills, Andy Summers, Mick Taylor, Susan Tedeschi, Vieux Farka Touré, Derek Trucks, Eddie Van Halen, Joe Walsh, Nancy Wilson (Heart) |
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My Site / My YouTube Channel
25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 27 Nov 2011 9:22 pm
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Your mistake is thinking that Rolling Stone is about music. It's not - it's about style. My opinion.
No point in breaking a sweat about this. There are many great guitar players on the list. And also some incredibly mediocre ones. Everyone has to decide for themselves which are which. Yes, there are scores, if not hundreds, of well-known guitarists who play rings around many of these choices, use any yardstick you like. And you know what? Nobody gives a damn. That's the music-style biz. My take.
Personally, I think even the unwashed masses could have come up with a better list than this. |
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Charles Davidson
From:
Phenix City Alabama, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2011 10:27 pm
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I could'nt care less what some poll says, I KNOW who the greatest sixstringer is [or was] HANK GARLAND, Don't believe me,listen to [JAZZ WINDS]. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.
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Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC ! |
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Jason Hull
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 1:12 am
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Last edited by Jason Hull on 22 Apr 2012 3:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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David Mason
From:
Cambridge, MD, USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 7:08 am
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| I liked their previous list better, when Duane Allman was #2. There was a period in the 80's where I was listening to a whole lot of commercial radio stations and it seemed like ALL the country songs featured a slide guitarist imitating Duane and ALL the rock songs were in some way or another imitating Led Zeppelin. And this was living in Austin! They ranked Keith Richards high, clearly because of his influence, not his actual chops; Jeff Beck has probably sold fewer records than the worst of the top ten there, but I listen to him way more often than any of the others. Clapton's rank is inexplicable to me. |
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Barry Blackwood
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 7:57 am
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| Pity they cut down trees to print this rag... |
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Joachim Kettner
From:
Germany
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 8:28 am
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My own list would be quite different from theirs.
But to leave out Jesse "Ed" Davis is ridiculous.
_________________
Fender Kingman, Sierra Crown D-10, Evans Amplifier, Soup Cube. |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 8:32 am
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In my opinion this is a troll list to attract viewers to their website.
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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Ken Pippus
From:
Langford, BC, Canada
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 8:59 am
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And obviously the "troll list" worked!
KP |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 9:01 am
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Yes, Ken, this list has been hashed out on every music forum imaginable.
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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James Mayer
From:
back in Portland Oregon, USA (via Arkansas and London, UK)
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 9:10 am
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| David Mason wrote: |
| Clapton's rank is inexplicable to me. |
Same here. I've never understood how Clapton was able to stand out. Maybe he sounded "different" when he first hit the scene, before I was born.
And I agree with Dave, as well. RS is about style, and this list reflects that. I only got as far as #97, Steve Jones of the Sex Pistols. Come on, really?
There was a period where I was trying to emulate the acoustic guitar styles of Cat Stevens, Paul Simon and Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull). They have far more skill and creativity than some of the people on this list, but they'll probably never be included. It's really about "electric rock guitar style/showmanship"", not just "guitar".
EDIT: Paul Simon is #93. Spoke too soon. |
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Joachim Kettner
From:
Germany
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 11:13 am
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| David Mason wrote: |
| Clapton's rank is inexplicable to me. |
Sure he can't compete with J. Beck or J. McLaughlin on a technical level, but as James Mayer said he was unique at that particular time. Starting with John Mayall, the Yardbirds and later Cream.
I also tend to think that Jazz Players at that time were in awe(?) of him because of his attack and string bending. I like him a lot, and I think he deserves his fame. The only thing I find unjust is that the public is willing to pay any sum of money to hear him play, but so many others of his contemporaries fell by the wayside due to lack of interest. But that's not his fault.
_________________
Fender Kingman, Sierra Crown D-10, Evans Amplifier, Soup Cube. |
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David Mason
From:
Cambridge, MD, USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 11:15 am
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Well, regarding Clapton and many others, it's obvious that there is no way to separate musicality from overall influence. There will be a certain number of people who were 15 years old when the "Hot for Teacher" video played on MTV, and they will swear up and down that Eddie Van Halen is the best ever. Yet Eddie Van Halen personally credits Clapton and Jimmy Page for his playing; and now Paul Gilbert credit Van Halen for his, and on and on.
If you were 15 years old a few years later, you are predictably likely to see Stevie Ray Vaughan as the best ever... a lot of the things that devolved from Led Zeppelin, like hairband power ballads and heavy heavy metal, are not too much to my liking but you can't blame poor Jimmie for making the first five or so Zeppelin records the way they were. I still hear a lot more Zeppelin influences than Hendrix, in what's available as rock.
And by the end of his life, Hendrix hated the silly songs that made him famous, and was well on his way to a different approach - some of the songs on "The Cry of Love" like "Angel" and "Night Bird Flying" are little masterpieces of multiple overdubbing/arranging, a little choir of guitars, all going every which way, but under exact control. He's not even being loved for the right reasons... 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvd54w0vGJg
(Warning: the preceding might be dangerous over good headphones)
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 12:26 pm
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You think you're hot under the collar? You should read the posts on the jazz guitar forum!  Polls are idiotic but humans love lists, comparisons, and competition - it's in the DNA or most every culture wouldn't have sporting contests. RS's list is silly but not worth getting riled about.
That said,from a biased, just-a-blip-in-the-universe, western musical perspective, ignoring other cultures and hundreds of years of wonderful musicians whom we'll never be able to hear play, the all-time best guitarist?
Django Reinhardt.
Your mileage may differ. |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 28 Nov 2011 11:45 pm
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Guys, the problem as I see it is at Rolling Stone is a reflection of contemporary American Culture. Sure, musicians are going to see what nonsense this list is, but the general public will not.
People think all guitar playing begins and ends with rock and roll. That's the only style of guitar playing, or music in general, that matters, and anybody who plays anything else is insignificant.
Question: What do Mozart, Beethoven, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Willie Nelson and Hank Williams have in common?
Answer: I don't know. I never heard of any of those people. JIMI HENDRIX RULES.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Olli Haavisto
From:
Jarvenpaa,Finland
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 12:29 am
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These lists mean nothing, as relevant as the 10 sexiest men/women lists etc.
Ignore.
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Olli Haavisto
Finland |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 5:15 am
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The problem I have with these lists as generated from a magazine is their motive. They are simply trying to sell a story and make money. Therefore, giving it any credence is essentially buying into it and supporting it. Even if we rail against it, we are still giving it some sort of power it doesn't deserve. The general public will always be just that: general. For most people, music is entertainment and it doesn't consume them 24/7 like it does musicians. An artist like John Coltrane will always be obscure because he is not accessible in the slightest. His music and that of his peers is difficult and without a standard form that the general public needs in order to digest it. It is fruitless to to try to get the public to think deeper about music in this way. Sure, Richards is up there on the list. He's one of the most recognizable guitarists to the general public. Therefore, he's prominent on the list - to attract the maximum amount of people to the magazine and subsequently sell more ads.
Regarding Duane Allman, only guitarists and music aficionados will ever care who he is or what he's done. In the seven or eight years that he recorded music, he only played on a few songs that could even remotely be called hits. He's just not well-known and will never be. To most he's one of the blonde brothers who played in a Southern Rock band. Some probably think he's still alive. We musicians place too much importance on this stuff. Sure we recognize his great talent, but we can't expect many to care too much.
The public needs a guitarist to be connected to a popular group or a widespread hit in order to connect the dots. This is why all the great jazz guitarists of the 40s and 50s aren't up there. Nobody cares, unfortunately. Jazz prides itself on being unaccessible. Sub-genres such as smooth jazz have attempted to access a wider audience, and have succeeded through artists such as Kenny G only to be rebuked again by purists. There is no way to have your cake and eat it too when it comes to people accepting and embracing inaccessible genres.
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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Joachim Kettner
From:
Germany
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 5:51 am
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I used to read Rollig Stone from time to time starting in the early seventies. The record reviewers could be quite funny... I read one about a Mother Earth record where it was written that the dobro sounds sh##y, or about a Stills song that starts with the line "Everybody wants to hear the music in my head..." the reviewer said something like "Not me".
Then slowly with the years it turned into a mainsteam magazine with their advertisements and features about main stream artists.
But it's still a music magazine and I guess quite influential on younger listeners and musicians.
Btw, I remember reading an article on Sonny Rollins a few years ago.
_________________
Fender Kingman, Sierra Crown D-10, Evans Amplifier, Soup Cube. |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 6:16 am
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| Well said, Chris! |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 7:14 am
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| Quote: |
| Question: What do Mozart, Beethoven, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Willie Nelson and Hank Williams have in common? |
Willie Nelson was on the list as one of the 100 greatest guitarists. I think most Americans know who any of these people are.
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| He's just not well-known and will never be. To most he's one of the blonde brothers who played in a Southern Rock band. |
Perhaps, but I think a lot of people - and anybody who is/was into the Allmans - know who Duane was and what his role was. He also made this top 10 list.
The truth is in the middle. True, most people don't care like musicians care. It's getting to be more and more true that younger people are tuned out of music as it was 20-60 years ago - hip-hop is in, even rock has been declining. But there is a pretty good subculture, even among younger people, that has reacted differently. It is not the end of civilization as we know it.
To me, these lists are just stupid. No matter who you put in the Top 10, 50, 100, 200, or whatever - there are just too many great guitarists/musicians out there to ever really do it justice. It always comes down to a popularity contest, unless you have some type of 'technical' grading system, which is equally bogus. Music isn't a sport, and isn't amenable to its rating methods. That doesn't stop the yahoos from making them, but it's best to just laugh at the whole charade.
My take. |
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Brint Hannay
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 29 Nov 2011 9:22 am
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| Rolling Stone has been by definition a periodical about rock music and its associated culture from its very beginning in the Sixties. Why should anyone be surprised or upset that its "Greatest 100" list would reflect that? A "Down Beat" list wouldn't include Keith Richards or Willie Nelson--because it's a magazine about jazz. Big whoop. |
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