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Topic: Raising string 9 a semitone? (E9) |
Rob Fenton
From:
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 30 Aug 2011 12:58 pm |
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I've done a couple of searches, but couldn't find anything.
Wondering if anybody out there raises string 9 a semitone on their E's raise lever, to avoid that low-voiced b9 clam potential in the A+F position?
I also raise string 7 a semitone on another lever. Coupled with this, it would allow nice diatonic runs in all positions. If I need to, I can re-lower string 9 with RKR, and that should probably work out reasonably in tune, no?
Are there reasons I shouldn't add this pull?
Thanks for your advice,
Rob. |
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Brett Lanier
From:
Madison, TN
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Posted 30 Aug 2011 3:14 pm
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I raise 9 a half tone on the lever that raises 1 & 2, and lower six on a separate lever. I like it because it's there if I want to experiment, and it doesn't interfere with anything I'm already doing.
My main reason for not putting it on the F lever would be playability. |
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Justin Griffith
From:
Taylor, Texas, USA
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Posted 24 Sep 2011 6:41 am
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You might get in touch with Jim Loessberg. He raises his 4th string a 1/2 tone on his 4th pedal along with the normal C-6th pulls on that pedal.
He may not do this on all of his guitars, but I know for sure one of his Emmons does this.
Ask him. He is a nice guy and will surely be glad to help.
Justin
_________________
Emmons/Sho~Bud/Blanton, Fender/Peavey.
Telonics pedal |
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Rick Schmidt
From:
Prescott AZ, USA
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Posted 24 Sep 2011 2:32 pm
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Rob.......don't do it!
The coolest and easiest to get diminished chord (actually a dim7)is achieved by raising your E's to F and playing strings 9,8,6, &5. As with all dim chords, you can play the same combination every step and a half up the neck to get the inversions.
FWIW, I do raise string 9 a half step on a zero pedal on my extended E9. It's a fairly useful change on it's own, AND in conjunction with the E-F KL, but NOT at the expense of that diminished chord! |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 24 Sep 2011 10:34 pm
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This inability to make the diminished Chord Rick just described is the one thing I regret about having a U-12 without the D string.
I know one player who does raise the 9th strings, so he can get a scale pattern with the A pedal and E-F Raise.
Too bad we all can't have everything.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Rob Fenton
From:
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 25 Sep 2011 5:29 am
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Thanks for your responses everyone.
My interest in doing this was mainly to open up scale options in the lower end of the guitar. I figured I had another way to make diminished seventh chords, so it wouldn't be a bad thing to give up one note out of that F lever dim7. I also figured that I won't really need a harmonic tetrachord as much as a major tetrachord in the low end, but I think I'll just leave it for now.
It's just one of those things that occurred to me after practising scale patterns on the bottom 5 strings for a week. Man, would it ever be easier if I was able to raise string 9! Not having an extra lever to try it out on, I got to thinking it might work on the F lever without too many sacrifices, but in the end it's probably not worth it.
In fact, I'd forgotten about it for the last couple of weeks, so I must be doing okay without it...
Thanks again,
Rob. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 25 Sep 2011 8:05 am
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| Rob Fenton wrote: |
Thanks for your responses everyone.
My interest in doing this was mainly to open up scale options in the lower end of the guitar. I figured I had another way to make diminished seventh chords, so it wouldn't be a bad thing to give up one note out of that F lever dim7. I also figured that I won't really need a harmonic tetrachord as much as a major tetrachord in the low end, but I think I'll just leave it for now.
It's just one of those things that occurred to me after practising scale patterns on the bottom 5 strings for a week. Man, would it ever be easier if I was able to raise string 9! Not having an extra lever to try it out on, I got to thinking it might work on the F lever without too many sacrifices, but in the end it's probably not worth it.
In fact, I'd forgotten about it for the last couple of weeks, so I must be doing okay without it...
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I used to have that change back in the mid-70's on my E-F lever, at the expense of the diminished chord. I considered it a trade-off, like much in the steel guitar world.
I showed it to Stu Schulman back in the day and I think he might still have it on his guitar.
That change somehow got lost in the late 70's and I never found it again. Nowadays I only lower s.9 and not all that often either.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 25 Sep 2011 8:40 am
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Herb, when I posted earlier in this thread that I knew a player who raised the 9th string, I was thinking of you. If you recall, we had a discussion about the 9th string in general a few (maybe more than a few) years ago.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 25 Sep 2011 10:24 am
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| Rob Fenton wrote: |
I figured I had another way to make diminished seventh chords, so it wouldn't be a bad thing to give up one note out of that F lever dim7.
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Maybe you could still play the D natural on string 9 while that lever is raising E to F and D to D#, assuming that you have a lever to lower string 9 a half step. It would probably be almost in tune when raised and lowered at the same time.
You might as well put the D to D# change on that lever. If you don't like it you can make it go away in 3 seconds with the nylon tuning nut. |
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Lonnie Portwood
From:
Jacksonville, fl. USA
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Posted 25 Sep 2011 1:16 pm
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I have a related question. I have a single 10 tuned to standard E9. Would it be practical to lower my 9th str.to C# with my RKL, which lowers my 4 and 8 to E flat?Would that interfere with anything else? Or should it be on another lever/pedal? I'm experimenting with getting as many "B6" moves as possible with S10.
I had Ed Fulawka change (was 12 str) back to 10 because I could'nt get used to string spacing. I kept 8 pedals so as to keep as much potential for B6 tunings as possible on 10 strings. My "A" pedal is the "franklin", and my LKR raises 1st st from F# to A flat, and 2nd st to E.
Herb, this is for you primarily, but anyone is welcome to chime in. If you were starting from scratch with a 10 Str. E9, and you had access to 8 pedals and five Knee levers, how would you set this guitar up? If this is asking too much to share this much of your expertise, I will understand if you'd rather not. Thanks for listening. Lonnie Portwood
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Music is probably the most "spiritual of mankinds emotions, and when practised with a pure heart, can lead one into the presence of God, who invented it. Lonnie Portwood |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 26 Sep 2011 8:29 pm
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Lonnie, I hadn't really ever thought about an 8/5 E9 S-10 before... it's never been a viable option for me. But I imagine there'd be a Franklin pedal in there, and I'd include a pedal that lowers s.10 a whole tone (B-A) and s.9 a half tone (D-C#).
I'm sure others here are more "outside the box" than I with their own personal approaches to the tuning. I'd invite them to chime in as well. I'd be definitely interested in other opinions.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Tommy Boswell
From:
Virginia, USA
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Posted 28 Sep 2011 6:13 pm
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| Rick Schmidt wrote: |
| As with all dim chords, you can play the same combination every step and a half up the neck to get the inversions. |
Hey, it works! Like magic! I'm impressed!
Thanks for the tip about dim chords and inversions. Seems like I learn something new every day about this complex instrument. |
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