| Author |
Topic: how would this be done in U12 or ExtE9 |
Adam Moritz
From:
Cedar Rapids, IA
|
Posted 19 Mar 2011 5:25 pm |
|
This image shows a set of triplet notes down the Am pentatonic scale. I am fairly familiar with the E9 10 string neck and pedal changes. for instance I would do the following on the bottom four strings to play all but the last four triplet sets because they are pitched too low for the E9 10 string: (fyi, E lowers 8 1/2, D lowers 9 1/2)
| Code: |
7 --15---------------10--------------6---------------1-------------------------
8 ----15----15---------10---10---------6E---5----------1E---1E-----------------
9 ------15D---15D--------10---10---------6D---5----------1D---1D---------------
10 --------------15--------------10--------------5----------------1-------------
|
1) How would a U12 player do this? especially the lower 4 sets of triplets.
2) How would a extE9 player do this? especially the lower 4 sets of triplets?
Keep in mind I'm not trying to incorporate slurs between notes by engaging pedals/levers during the triplets. I'm just looking for three separate notes on three separate strings. I also recognize there are many other ways of going about getting these note combinations with other strings and other pedals/levers. I chose this example as a starting point to find out how others play u12 and xE9 to reach these lower phrasings. Are these lower sets of triplets possible on the U12 or xE9 with these limitations?
thanks.
_________________
Jackson blackjack s10
GFI Ultra 12 |
|
|
 |
Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
|
Posted 19 Mar 2011 6:00 pm
|
|
Obviously it depends on your particular setup. On my ext E9 for example you could just continue at fret 1, each triplet on 3 adjacent strings, except for the last triplet which would require 2 notes on the same string.
It also lays nicely at fret 3 and where the last couple of triplets use pull-offs.
Also it could work with open strings, but I don't have middle F# to G raise on most of my guitars so the G would be at fret 1. |
|
|
|
Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
|
Posted 19 Mar 2011 7:17 pm
|
|
I think I got this right...
woops... I can't find a good one for the last note.
Original run:
| Code: |
7 --15---------------10--------------6---------------1-------------------------
8 ----15----15---------10---10---------6E---5----------1E---1E-----------------
9 ------15D---15D--------10---10---------6D---5----------1D---1D---------------
10 --------------15--------------10--------------5----------------1-------------
|
Similar run on S12U with A-pedal, B-pedal, and E-lower lever:
| Code: |
-6G#|--13--------------------------------8-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-7F#|------13----------13-------------------8-------8-------------6--------3-------------1-------------------------
-8-E|----------13(Eb)------13(Eb)-------------8-------8-------------6(Eb)------3-----------1(Eb)---1(Eb)------------
-9-B|-----------------------------13A--------------------8A-------------6A--------3A----------1A--------1A--1(or)---
10-G#|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------3B------
|
On My steel I have string-9 B>Bb, and string-11 E>F#.
So I could play the very last two triplettes like this:
| Code: |
-7F#|-------------------------------
-8-E|--1----------------------------
-9-B|----1(Eb)-----6(Bb)------------
10G#|--------1A---------6-----------
11-E|---------------------6(F#)-----
|
Last edited by Pete Burak on 19 Mar 2011 9:19 pm; edited 9 times in total |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 19 Mar 2011 7:25 pm
|
|
I can't speak for U-12, but here's how I'd do it on Extended E9th:
| Tab: |
Am pentatonic triplets
F# ____1____1_______________________________________________________________________
D# ______________1D____1D___1D_______________________________________________________
G# __1______________________________________________________________________________
E ______1E___1E____1E______________________________________________________________
B _______________________1____1____1________________________________________________
G# _______________________________1___1___1__________________________________________
F# _____________________________________1___1____1___________________________________
E ___________________________________________1E___1E____1E__________________________
D ___________________________________________________1D____1D___1D__________________
B ____________________________________________________________1____1___1____________
G# ___________________________________________________________________1___0B___0B______
E _________________________________________________________________________ 3____3__0__3__0__1F
D lowers D# to C#, D to C#
E lowers both E's to D#
F lowers low E to C# |
I use this position a lot, actually. I think it's the same as what Earnest said.
I obviously run out of range on the low notes. I'd need a 13th string and a couple more pedals to place all 3 notes on adjacent strings at the end. Still, with hammers and pulls there aren't any slurs between the notes. That last note would be a quick knee action though.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Adam Moritz
From:
Cedar Rapids, IA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 10:54 am
|
|
Yes, this is exactly what I was looking for. Thanks guys.
Pete, what is your overall copedent? I'm just curious how/why you have the B->Bb change and what pedal/lever you are using to get it. (ie, is it one of the p4-7? or is it the vertical?)
Bob, did you have the Franklin change on your xE9? I'm wondering if that'd make the last set of triplets easier to get. I noticed on another thread that after your last band broke up you changed your copedent. Are you still playing xE9? or something else? why?
I am getting a better picture on the capabilities of the 12 stringers, but still have a few questions before I feel comfortable jumping in.
On my E9 s10 I can engage D/E levers to get an inversion of the Minor7/9 or the Major 6/9. Basically, "fram" the whole deck of cards. When I look at the 12 I wonder how people approach "framming". Is it sill just 3 or 4 string combos you use for this?
Also, on a secondary related question. I'm used to the E->Eb on my LKR (and E->F on my LKL). I see all sorts of copedents in xE9 and u12 with it on the RK. Are there strategic reasons why it would an advantage/disadvantage on the LKR? I know that's a loaded question... This question and the preceding "framming" one are probably best left for new threads. If i don't see much back here I'll open new threads.
Thanks a lot to everyone who's given me ideas.
_________________
Jackson blackjack s10
GFI Ultra 12 |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 11:25 am
|
|
Hi Adam,
I'm not currently playing an Extended E9th. I traded it away a few months back because it had been sitting around for a year and I needed a D-10 for teaching. I never had the "Franklin change" on it. I mostly play the 8 string now. You can see both copedents here: http://b0b.com/tunings/blee.htm
I'll say this in support of Extended E9th: in 30 years of playing it on the bandstand, I never had one instance where a band leader or other musician complained about the fact that I didn't have a C6th neck. I covered country, rock, blues and western swing in combos ranging from duos to big bands.
All of the notes are there. It's just up to the player to find them. I didn't have any special changes on the low strings, but just having low strings made it possible for me to play a lot of rhythm parts that 10-string E9th players can't play. It was always important to me to have at least the full range of a six-string guitar. Otherwise, the middle drops out of a small combo when the guitarist takes a solo.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 11:57 am
|
|
Which notes do you want to articulate individually and which ones do you want to slur?
My inclination would be to slur the first 2 notes of each set of triplets and articulate the third, probably on a different string. I'd start on the 4th string, 5th fret, and slide the bar back to the third, then hit the nest note on the 5th string with the A pedal down.
I haven't figured out the rest of it yet, but some of the slurs would be accomplished with the bar, some with pedals, and some with both.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 12:01 pm Re: how would this be done in U12 or ExtE9
|
|
I think the answer to your question is in the original post, Mike.
| Adam Moritz wrote: |
| Keep in mind I'm not trying to incorporate slurs between notes by engaging pedals/levers during the triplets. I'm just looking for three separate notes on three separate strings. |
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 12:21 pm
|
|
| Adam Moritz wrote: |
Pete, what is your overall copedent? I'm just curious how/why you have the B->Bb change and what pedal/lever you are using to get it. (ie, is it one of the p4-7? or is it the vertical?)
|
Hi Adam,
I have all three B-strings (strings 5,9,12) rodded up to lower B>Bb on the LKV lever (If I only want string 5 to lower B>Bb, I just back off the other two at the endplate tuners).
Also, I like to duplicate my E9th changes from strings 4-8, on strings 8-12 (I think of E9th in terms of two octaves).
So the things i can do on the upper strings I can duplicate an octave lower (hence the E>F# on string 11).
Funn Stuff!
Pete B. |
|
|
|
Adam Moritz
From:
Cedar Rapids, IA
|
Posted 20 Mar 2011 1:23 pm
|
|
Mike,
Yeah, Bob said what I was thinking. I realize that with engaging and disengaging the pedals/levers during the triplet(s) (ie A->G,E) will open up a lot more possibilities. That's why for my basic understanding of traversing the 12 string neck I'd like to see how to get there without it.
Also, since it's fairly fast to get three string sets (ie. triplets together using the three picking fingers/thumb or cross-picking) I put that as a restriction for this exercise. In practice I've gotten comfortable traversing the E9 s10 neck for pentatonic runs. And I'd like to see how this approach translates for the lower two strings on u12 and xE9. This set of notes above is there to show how my E9 s10 has limitations.
The lowest note I can get is the C one octave below middle C (C3). I'd like to know how to play a position on a 12 string that allows me to get 3 notes in the pentatonic scale and gets me below C3.
_________________
Jackson blackjack s10
GFI Ultra 12 |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
|
|
|
