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Topic: Rookie here seeking advice on my first investment. |
Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 10 Oct 2010 11:50 pm |
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I miss my MSA S-10 something fierce, never got to really play it even as I was plunged headlong into dire financial straits soon after.
Things are better now, Thank God.
So my question is... I have about 15-1600 to spend on an instrument. (Pedal Steel...I already have a nice lap steel).
I want something that will last me a lifetime, is a proven brand, rugged, reliable, great intonation, good shape, etc.
I have no idea what to get, but if anyone has any ideas, please let me know. I know that I do not want any carter starter type things.. but a real instrument.
I will have the money in Hand at the latest on the 18th of this month and will be purchasing something that day. Again, I have around 15-1600 bucks. I am going for more of a Don Helms or Sneaky Pete type sound, nothing modern. I play in 3 country bands, two of which are classic country cover bands, and one is a vehicle for my own songs..
Please help guys! I bow to your superior knowledge.
please PM me here or email me at luxaeternaaudio@gmail.com
I must have an instrument soon. Been waiting too long. In a perfect world id buy that MSA back!! |
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David Nugent
From:
Gum Spring, Va.
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 3:19 am
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| My suggestion would be the GFI Expo S-10. These guitars can be purchased new for not much more than you plan to spend. Contact Billy Cooper's Shop in Orange, Va., he normally has them in stock in various mica choices and Billy and Wanda are extremely nice people to conduct business with. |
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Robert Murphy
From:
West Virginia
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 5:06 am
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| GFI! |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 7:15 am
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I just sent an email to GFI.
By the way, I was wondering what you think of Emmons P/P instruments?? There is one in the Marketplace for a good price.
and forgive my ignorance but what does push pull mean(I know what it means in the world of audio electronics/vacuum tubes, but not in this context!)
how is P/P different from other topologies?
EDIT..MSA in the classifieds too, similar vintage to the one I sold.. Lord, I wish I wasn't such a rank amateur and knew how to judge these things! |
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 7:56 am
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A GFI should serve you well, providing you like the sound. They are a touch sharper-sounding than most other brands, and also lighter in weight than most.
An old P/P Emmons sounds superior when the mechanics is adjusted well, but the "adjust" part can be a bit demanding and the mechanics not as versatile as A/P.
Most modern steels are A/P - all-pull, with easy-to-adjust mechanics that doesn't in itself affect sound much.
See push-pull http://www.steelguitar.com/steelmap/maptop/ppchangr.htm vs all-pull http://www.steelguitar.com/steelmap/maptop/changer.htm mechanics for details/difference. |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 8:33 am
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| There are a lot of fine ShoBud S-10 guitars out there priced right for you - one of those will last you the rest of your life.... |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 9:01 am
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found a great price on a new GFI expo..
think im going that way. the main man at GFI was ultra cool. |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 9:02 am
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thanks guys.
what do folks think of MSA? 70s era? Gosh, I wish I knew more about this.. I know a lot about acoustic guitars, but have no idea about judging steels!
Last edited by Teddy Ray Bullard II on 11 Oct 2010 9:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 9:03 am
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Terry, everybody here has their favorite (Mine is MSA) and tell you to get what they like. The fact is that every manufacturer today builds high quality instruments, and you will get a fine guitar no matter what brand you choose.
So rather than think about a specific brand, you should look that a prospective guitar's features. You want a guitar with 10 or 12 strings, 3 pedals, and 4 or 5 knee levers.
You also want a guitar with a minimum double raise double lower changer. To determine this, look at the endplate. You should see a vertical row of holes, some of which will have rods in them, for each string. There should be a minimum of 4 holes, 2 for the raises and s for the lowers. There may be more as many newer guitars now have 4 or even 4 or 5 raises but 2 raises and lowers are the minimum.
Try out the pedals and knee levers. Do they have a firm stop? Or do they feel spongy and squishy? Is the pedal action smooth? Or stiff?
Pick the strings, unplugged. Do they ring out cleanly of do you hear a sitar like buzz, a sign that the changer fingers have groves worn into them.
Lift up the guitar. Is it so heavy it will break your back every time you have to carry it?
And finally, if you can, ask an advanced player to look at the guitar and give you his or her opinion.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 2:59 pm
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Thank you Sir.
Due to my location, I doubt ill be able to try anything out before I buy it..which is why it is crucial to me to get feedback.
I am seriously torn now between the GFI Expo and the MSA in the classifieds. |
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Joe Smith
From:
Charlotte, NC, USA
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 3:43 pm
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| I also like the GFI. Just my humble opinion. I would stay away from a Emmons Push Pull. Don't get me wrong, they are great guitars, but can very complicated to setup. I have a GFI single10 keyless and I love that guitar. It stays in tune, is very light weigh and has a great tone. |
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 3:47 pm
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If, as I read from your posts, the choice is between a new GFI EXPO and a more than 30 year old MSA in unknown condition, and you have no chance to see and test either, then the new GFI would be the safe choice.
Myself, I may have a preference for the MSA sound over the GFI sound, but not much and certainly not enough to advice someone who may not be able or can afford to fix weaknesses in an old PSG to buy one.
If you can present the two PSG models you have in mind here on the forum - (links to) pictures and info, you'll probably get more qualified advices. |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 4:43 pm
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| Teddy Ray Bullard II wrote: |
so it looks like GFI then...
I will tone any overly brightness with my steel guitar black box.  |
I think you should use your right hand instead
The GFI, as most steels, delivers the best sound when its PickUp sees a high impedance - 1Mohm or more. Picking an inch or so further away from the bridge/changer than one would on other PSGs, will make the GFI sound less bright - and you'll have the advantage of being able to "cut through" when you need to just by moving your hand a little.
The tone definitely is in the hands on a GFI ... (I can't believe I said that  ) ... more so than on most heavier PSGs, IMhO. |
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Carson Leighton
From:
N.B. Canada
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 4:44 pm
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| Those MSA guitars were well built back in that time,,if I remember correctly..I think the fretboards were silk-screened on them..The undercarriage was really well designed and worked very smooth...That guitar looks to be in great shape,,and as long as it hasn't been tampered with,,it would be a darn good buy...If I needed a steel,,I wouldn't hesitate to buy it...Carson |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 5:08 pm
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Gee Teddy, that's a huge decision. One I wouldn't suggest you make without at least looking at and hearing several guitars.
I don't know where you are in the deep south, but there are steel guitar associations all over the place....Mississippi, Alabama, New Orleans, Ga. You really need to meet some of the guys around there, go to some of the shows and at least check out a variety of steel guitars if you can. Talk with some of the guys and try to narrow down your choices.
Just because someone else is happy with a particular one doesn't mean you will be. You need to get the one that speaks to you and feels right for you, particularly if you're planning on spending the rest of your life with it.
Many recent built guitars come up for sale here from time to time. If you're patient, some good prices show up occasionally.
Mullen, ZumSteel, Rains, Rittenberry, Williams, Derby, Carter Pro are all good choices as well as several others. No personal experience with the Zum Stage One, but hear good things about it for a basic/intermediate sgl. 10. Some say it's a step up from starters and even gig-worthy.
You need to be careful when buying an older guitar. It may be just fine, but there may be some issues that will need repair down the road. That's why you need someone to help look for things you may not be aware of like worn out components, grooved changer fingers, etc.
Certain MSA's, Sierras, LaGarrit, 'Buds etc. may be good values. Depends on condition.
Welcome back to the steel guitar and Good Luck with whatever you decide. |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 6:58 pm
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thank you Guys for your continued advice.
I am actually in Chillicothe, Ohio now, I moved here because my wife got a fantastic job working for the VA(we are both recently out of the army Veterans) and I wanted to go to TOSU for their really good Arabic Studies program(which I am in now).
Steel guitar info/sales are hard to find here in this corner of the world..lotta bluegrass, but cant find any steelers
One question I had about the GFI.. and forgive me if it is dumb...but are those built in such a way that any competent tech can handle them?? I mean.. ive had equipment in the past(mainly guns,but same difference) that were built with proprietary techniques and as such one had to find a "XY CERTIFIED TECH" to work on it because noone else could..
but I suppose there isnt anything revolutionary in steels now..given how old and established the instrument is? arent they all built in a similar way?
that is the only thing keeping me from the GFI now..concerns about longevity/parts availability/ease of repair/setup, etc.
and I do *not* want any *starter* instrument. I want something I will use and never get rid of. I realize my budget is not fancy, but 1600 is the best I can muster!!..which is why I am looking for used gear as well.
Last edited by Teddy Ray Bullard II on 11 Oct 2010 7:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 7:18 pm
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Ok, ive been researching..
it is DEFINITELY between that GFI and that MSA..
Ima pray on this one.... I dont want to bother with trying to hear a bunch of guitars, I just want to get something good and get on with it. Shoulda never sold my first MSA, but I had to.
feel free to tell me which way to go! Ive no doubts whatsoever that they both will live to expectations... so it is essentially , for me...what makes better sense as an "investment"? the new GFI or the older MSA? I want something that any steel player wouldn't be ashamed to play, you know a pro instrument. im not educated enough in the mysteries of the PSG to even know what sounds I prefer.. i just want to get one and start the honeymoon. whatever I choose, this one will be with me until my dying day. I will never sell another instrument.
teddy |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 9:33 pm
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As I said, I'm partial to MSA, but this one appears to have only 3 knee levers.
If this is true, and the GFI has 4, than get the GFI.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Teddy Ray Bullard II
From:
Pocatello, Idaho
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 10:03 pm
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Thank you sir!
so it is settled. Ive been asking around, talking to GFI owners/players, and after getting the specs on the Expo, thats what im gonna do. GFI S10 3 + 4
Cant wait!
thanks to all who provided input. What a thrill to own a new instrument!
GFI Expo Single 10/ 3 Pedals - 4 Knees
 [/img] |
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