The Floating Body Guitar

Karlis Abolins · From: (near) Seattle, WA, USA

Introducing the Floating Body Guitar.

I have assembled my project guitar for the umpteenth time and now have it playable. I am doing "engineering trials" to see what works well, what needs changes, etc. The body is a piece of 2 x 10 fir that I have used as a stand-in for the nice piece of tone wood that I have ready to cut.

What makes it a floating body guitar? The body of the guitar is attached to the undersides of the changer and tuner. It does not touch the frame at any point thus is floating. The changer and tuner are attached to cross-plates via columns that go through the body but do not touch it.

The guitar has two Alumitone pickups spaced approximately like a telecaster except the bridge pickup is not angled. I originally had a pair of pickups custom-made for me by Jason Lollar but since trying the Alumitone pickups, I have decided to go with them. Th Lollar pickups are a P90 for 10 strings and a stringmaster clone for 10 stings. The pickups are run in parallel through a bend pot.

Last night I took it to our weekly practice and had my socks knocked off. The guitar begs to be played with a light touch of both the bar hand and the picking hand. I spent most of the night sliding rather than pedaling because it was so smooth and mellow. My bandmates will have to put up with this new approach until I adjust to the new guitar. Changing the blend knob gave me a number of different sounds with no other tone adjustment, I normally play through a Tech21 Blonde because I keep an amp at our rehearsal space as well as my amp at home. The tech21 Blond gives me the ability to have a consistent sound with minimal changes. the Tech21 is a really nice fit for the new guitar.

I intend to play this for a while, keeping track of changes that I want to make. Then I will finish the real body. I haven't decided how to do the aprons yet. Wood? Plastic? Anodized aluminum? It will come to me.

I do have to say that the fir body with its cracks and all sounds great. I can't wait to hear the tonewood body.

With the floating body concept, the body can be made of any material. Different wood bodies would give it variations in tone much like six string guitars.

I originally set out to make a guitar that would sound more like a six string guitar. I have felt for a long time that the sound of the steel guitar has evolved into a paradigm that is unique and distinctive. I wanted to avoid that paradigm and opted instead for a more neutral sound. I think I have met that goal. I feel like I have exceeded my expectations.

Karlis

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

Rich Peterson · From: Moorhead, MN

I am envisioning a body of Empress wood (Paulownia.) Extremely light, very, very resonant and can have beautiful figuring. Fascinating concept.

Per Berner · From: Skovde, Sweden

Wow! This looks like a really interesting concept, very well executed. Please keep us updated!

Sonny Jenkins · From: Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx

I think the Anapeg is also a "floating body" guitar. I am modifying an MSA 12 string that I'm thinking about making into a floating body. I don't know why all the manufacturers keep copying each other.

Karlis Abolins · From: (near) Seattle, WA, USA

Sonny,

The Anapeg was one of the inspirations for my project. Jim Flynn's skeleton was another.

Karlis

Jim Pitman · From: Waterbury Ctr. VT 05677 USA

Cool! Nice job.
Have you measured the detune?
ie - play your middle G# without pedals and use a tuner to get it exact then raise the adjacent B with pedal one and see how much your tuner needle deflects.

Dave Zirbel · From: Sebastopol, CA USA

I like it. I can almost do that with my old Fenders which are attached to the frame with only 4 screws. So that is a solid piece of wood instead of the traditional cabinet style?
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Dave Zirbel-
Sierra S-10 (Built by Ross Shafer),ZB, Fender 400 guitars, various tube and SS amps

Scott Swartz · From: St. Louis, MO

The predominant path for vibration to travel from nut to changer is the metal frame it appears to me.

The wood body would be a secondary path and I would guess would have a relatively small effect on the tone.

The overall concept seems similar to the Sierra design (which I like the tone of BTW), ie an aluminum frame with a wood neck.

In any case, nicely executed!
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Scott Swartz
Steeltronics - Steel Guitar Pickups
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Greg Gefell · From: Upstate NY

Nice job Karlis!

I built a non pedal steel a while back with 2 pickups and a blend knob. That option alone has a huge impact IMHO on the overall tone of the guitar. I wish my pedal steels had 2 pickups as well.

Did you manufacture all/most of the parts yourself?
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Karlis Abolins · From: (near) Seattle, WA, USA

Jim - When I press A + B while sounding my E, the display on my Peterson VSII moves very, very slowly to flat. I don't know how many cents (or fractions of a cent) it represents. I will try adjusting the cents to see what the value is.

Dave - The body is a solid piece of wood 1 x 8 x 29. It currently is fir (I had a 2 x 10 fir board available in my scrap heap).

Greg - I made all of the parts except the legs, changer fingers, and pickups.

Karlis

Johnny Baker · From: Southport, Fla

Very Interesting, good job, good thought, I love the
idea.
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I am currently running a Simmons SD10, Peavey Nashville 400 that's packing a 15" BW, Peavey Delta Fex effects processor, and a Match Box. Best rig I've ever run and the sound is truly incredible.

Jim Smith · From: Midlothian, TX, USA

The original design of the Dekley was to "float" the body top in the surrounding aluminum channel frame, with no screws attaching it to the sides and ends of the frame. Only the neck, changer, and machine head housing would be attached to the top. After experimenting with it for a while, we determined that whether the top was screwed down or not, it didn't sound any different. Your design is different, so I hope it works for you.
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Jim Smith
-=Dekley D-12 10&12=-

Bob Kagy · From: Lafayette, CO USA

That's a nice piece of work. Very interesting idea. You've obviously spent a lot of thought, time and effort. I hope it comes close to satisfying you.

The pull rod tuners look innovative. Also looks like a few "non-mainstream" selections on pulls.

Any way to post a sample of the sound you're getting? (I understand the fir is a temporary stand-in)

Karlis Abolins · From: (near) Seattle, WA, USA

Here are some sound samples. I did the same test at three different settings for each series. The first of a series is bridge pickup only. The second is blend of the two pickups. The third is neck pickup only. The routing is pickup to DI box to mixer to sound card to recording program. There are no effects in the chain.

The first series is an open e chord across the guitar.
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track1.mp3
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track2.mp3
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track3.mp3

The second series is pedals A+B at the third fret.
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track4.mp3
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track5.mp3
http://home.comcast.net/%7Ek.abolins/test/track6.mp3

Karlis

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

After fellow Forumite and myself had extensively tested a LCT (Left Change AND Tune) concept adapted onto and older MSA, we decided to experiment which some other aspect.
One was the FFSB idea (Free Floating Sound Board).

MSA pedals steel guitars of the vintage like the one we used, basically have a 360Deg. aluminum chassis/frame. The "cabinet", which on these models only has an apron on the front, is screwed tightly onto that frame - the whole becomes virtually ONE.

Our changer system was designed so it would not stop against the end plates but a bar connected directly to the wood. That allowed us to loosen the cabinet and still play the guitar.
Obviously, the guitar's cabinet not having been designed to miss the strength of the chassis, the tuning went "South" for a while. We re-tuned and let it sit for a while.
When we plaid it, we found that the guitar had taken a "deep breath". The sound was "bigger/wider"-fuller (less thin and compressed).
We later on proceeded to knock off the apron. The tuning went WAY South but the guitar took yet another, yet actually even bigger "breath".

Our conclusion was twofold:

FFSB is preserves guitar's natural vibrations and feed back into the string
Aprons, U-channel designs do not seem to help to a bigger sound, much to the contrary.

Certainly, there are stability issues which need to be resolved.

... J-D.
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Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"

A Little Mental Health Warning:

Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.

I say it humorously, but I mean it.

Sonny Jenkins · From: Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx

I think I have info, diagrams etc on the Anapeg (i.e. how it is built) somewhere if anyone is interested

Bob Kagy · From: Lafayette, CO USA

I listened to the sound files - sounds like you've got something going there. I appreciate your doing that.

And while I'm at it, I still use your Guitar Map every now and then and appreciate that too.

Thanks, bk

Allan Munro · From: Pennsylvania, USA and Scotland

Elton Smith · From: Texas, USA

Great job Karlis.One idea you might think about is a reverse wound pick up in the center.That is what gives a stratocaster its quack sound.I don't know if they make a reverse wound pick up for steel guitar.Might be worth the experment.Might even be done with coil tap.Please keep us posted,seems like yer on to something.By the way the tone sounds very good.
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