how to get the steel channel on a Vibrasonic like a FDR

Scott Appleton · From: Ashland, Oregon

Here's a question for the super tech's. I have a vibrasonic and have been using a Deluxe reverb for small gigs .. Its just punchier and warmer .. the two circuits look just about the same only the addition of a mid control all the other components are the same values. Why then it don't sound the same .. is it the bigger power amp section or the 15" compared to a 12"
? is it something in the buffer stage? If I could get the same sound out of the Vibrasonic that would be
fantastic for larger shows ..

Tom Wolverton · From: Carpinteria, CA

I have never been sucessful in getting 6L6 tubes to sound like 6V6 tubes. Just my 2 pesos worth.
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Scott Appleton · From: Ashland, Oregon

I think you may have a point .. it just ain't never gonna be a 6v6 .. too bad .. any other suggestions
out there .. I see the twin circuit is a bunch different than the DR or the Vs.. and seems to capture more of the warmth I am talking about with the DR ..
What can you attribute that to?

Jerry Sherbahn · From: Georgetown, Tx

I get great sound running out of a stereo delay pedal ( Boss RV-3 ) into both channels of my Vibrasonic. It really kicks

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

I have 5 or 6 different amps I use depending on my mood. One of my favorites is my 1996 Fender Vibrasonic. I did not like it at first. Here is the key I found to adjusting the knobs. Turn all the knobs wide open, then start backing off what you don't like. This worked great for me.

John Groover McDuffie · From: LA California, USA

Other than the obvious differences in power section and speakers, there are only a couple subtle differences.

The "Vibrato" channel of the Deluxe Reverb has a bright cap wired across the volume pot. It is like having the bright switch on all the time except it uses a smaller capacitor than what is used for the amps with bright switches. The "Normal" channel does not have this.

The midrange control is replaced with a fixed resistor of a value roughly equivalent to having the midrange control on about 8.

But the higher power of the Twin (of which the Vibrasonic is a variant) makes the amp sound very different. I often feel like rented Twins have a piercing upper-mid frequency that is pretty much impossible to dial out.

I recently put a 15" EVM in a SF Pro Reverb, which had 2x12" Fender-Eminence speakers and the difference was startling. I expected it to be a bit fuller, but it is waaaay fuller, and I have to run the treble on that amp on about 7-8, when with the 12s I was running the treble between 3 1/2 and 5 depending on the situation. So speakers can make an astounding difference.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Are you talking about

1. An 70s silverface Vibrosonic Reverb - http://www.ampwares.com/amp.asp?id=120

2. An early 60s brown Vibrasonic - http://www.ampwares.com/amp.asp?id=119 - or

3. The more recent (90s) Custom Vibrasonic - http://www.ampwares.com/amp.asp?id=121

Ah, I see - you mention "Steel In", so I assume you're talking about the Custom Vibrasonic:

The 90s Custom Vibrasonic is a very different amp from even the silverface Twin/Vibrosonic Reverb circuit. Read the comments at the ampwares link given above. This was made in the middle of the "Evil Twin" era, they did some strange things to try to economize while at the same time giving more gain options and so on.

Even for a silverface Twin/Vibrosonic Reverb - different output tubes (6L6 vs 6V6) + different power supplies & plate voltages + different transformers plus some other differences make for very different sounds, even using the same speakers. If it's one of the ultralinear 135-watt Twin/Vibrosonic Reverbs, they will sound very different.

There have been some amps that used 4-6V6 power tubes to try to get some of the Deluxe Reverb vibe at a higher power level - the Jim Kelly amp comes to mind.

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

I guess I am reading that we are trying to turn a mid 90's 100 watt amp with a SS rectifier, (+450 vdc) into a 22 watt ,(+415 VDC) tube rectifier amp.

This may take some work !

t
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Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

I agree with John in this for sure:

"But the higher power of the Twin (of which the Vibrasonic is a variant) makes the amp sound very different. I often feel like rented Twins have a piercing upper-mid frequency that is pretty much impossible to dial out. "

Even the voltages used by Fender over the years has an effect on the same series of amps! I find that a 6L6GC tube sounds a lot warmer in a Tweed era amp where the plates are around 390-400 volts. As they went into the Silverface era the voltages got higher and the tone got more brittle to my ear (such as a a Twin Reverb compared to a 1950's Tweed Twin). By the time they got to the 135 watt Twin the voltage on the plates was close to 500 volts. That amp sounds the least warm of any of the older tube amps. Still it is a good amp, lots of headroom for a steel, just not the warmest tone on the planet! For me all my amps but one clone I built of the 1964 Vibroluxm(2-10" amp) are in fact Tweed era amps I have built. I finally found the tube sound that I love. Of all the Blackface and Silverface amps I prefer the Vibrolux, Deluxe and Deluxe Reverb over all the others from that era.

As you said, the circuit is pretty much the same preamp as a Vibrasonic, Twin Reverb, Pro Reverb, Super Reverb, Super Reverb, Vibrolux and the Vibroverb. Yet all these amps sound different! Different speakers, cabs and power amp sections change the voice of the amp. Also notice that the Deluxe reverb has no bright switch. It has a bright cap on the reverb channel that is on all the time.

Speaker choice can also great affect the amps. I used a 1964 Deluxe for many years with a D120F. At low volumes a stock Jensen or Oxford was clearly a warmer speaker. Yet at stage volumes the JBL would shine and out perform the cheaper speakers!

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