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Topic: LKV Knee Lever - Needed? |
Jon Steel
From:
Bay Area, California
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 1:55 pm |
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Here is the setup of my new Jackson Blackjack Custom E9th, 3 and 4, being built by Jackson as we speak ....
I have all the pedals and levers shown on this chart except the LKV - LV in chart above - (5th/10th string lowered from B to B flat). Do I need LKV, or can I do without it (will cost me $200.00 extra)?
_________________
1940 Kay bass
1939 Rickenbacher Model B 6-string lap steel tuned C6
Jackson Steel Slideking LS 6-string with pitch change hand pedal, tuned Open E
Jackson Steel Sho-Bro 7-string dobro with EDGE hand pedal pitch changer, built by Buddy Emmons and Shot Jackson himself in early 70's, tuned Open E
Hand pedals above take you from the I to the IV. |
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Billy Carr
From:
Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 2:21 pm Lkv
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| Whenever I want try something different, I usually use it on the LKV, if possible. Right now, I lower the #7 F# string from a F# to a E note with a half stop on the F. |
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Paul Crawford
From:
Orlando, Fl
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 4:04 pm
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On an all pull guitar, it's extremely useful because it also adds C in combination with the pedal. I would put it on there as well worth the extra cost.
On a push pull, not so much. |
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Joe Gretz
From:
Washington, DC, USA
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 4:20 pm Vertical Knee
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Jon,
First, congratulations on your selection of a FINE instrument! 
If I was in your shoes, I'd have it done now. It is usually cheaper to have it done when the steel is being built, rather than later...if for no other reason, you wont have to pay for more shipping!
I'm actually getting my V installed this Friday. Wish I had done it sooner!
Joe
_________________
Dattebayo!!!
Last edited by Joe Gretz on 2 Feb 2010 4:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Stu Schulman
From:
Ulster Park New Yawk (deceased)
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 4:21 pm
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Jon,There's a few very cool voicings that I use that lever for,If you can afford it it go for it. 
_________________
Steeltronics Z-pickup,Desert Rose S-10 4+5,Desert Rose Keyless S-10 3+5... Mullen G2 S-10 3+5,Telonics 206 pickups,Telonics volume pedal.,Blanton SD -10,Emmons GS_10...Zirctone bar,Bill Groner Bar...any amp that isn't broken.Steel Seat.Com seats...Licking paint chips off of Chinese Toys since 1952. |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 4:50 pm
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Go for it - in my case, at least, lowering the Bs is my third-most-used lever (after raising and lowering my Es).
I certainly think it more important than your RKL on the chart. That's a good pull, but not as useful as the Bs to Bb. (Incidentally I lower my Bs on RKL - it's so important to me that I didn't want to assign it to LKV which I find less easy to reach than a normal lever.)
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Barry Hyman
From:
upstate New York, USA
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 7:37 pm
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I use the B to Bb lower about once every ten seconds. See my recent post called something like "More Uses for the B to Bb Lower." It is incredibly useful. But then I use them all a lot...
_________________
I give music lessons on several different instruments in Cambridge, NY (between Bennington, VT and Albany, NY). But my true love is pedal steel. I've been obsessed with steel since 1972; don't know anything I'd rather talk about... www.barryhyman.com |
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Olie Eshleman
From:
Seattle, WA
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Posted 2 Feb 2010 9:27 pm
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I am having Jim Palenscar add this same pull and lever with tuning splits on my MSA classic S10 as we speak.
Also adding a 0 pedal with F#1 and 7 raise to G# and D#2 to E.
But I digress, i spent many an hour trying to think of a better use for that lever on my E9 neck and couldn't.
Do it and let's report back. |
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Gil Berry
From:
Westminster, CA, USA
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 3:16 am
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| hmmm...are you sure you want your E to Eb and E to F changes on the same knee? If that's what you're used to, so be it, else maybe switch the pulls on RL and LR knees? |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 4:42 am
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There's an obvious logic to having the E raises and lowers on the same knee - we never use them simultaneously! I don't see what can be gained by splitting them between right and left legs; it simply reduces our options.
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Barry Hyman
From:
upstate New York, USA
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 5:31 am
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Roger is 100% right on that!
_________________
I give music lessons on several different instruments in Cambridge, NY (between Bennington, VT and Albany, NY). But my true love is pedal steel. I've been obsessed with steel since 1972; don't know anything I'd rather talk about... www.barryhyman.com |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 5:51 am
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Barry said:
"I use the B to Bb lower about once every ten seconds."
I went for seven hours without using it at all last night - but I was asleep in bed at the time.
Actually I think I use it at least as much as my E-Eb lower. E-F would be #1, then B-Bb and E-Eb almost a tie for second! Then would come lowering the ninth string to a C#....
....the most fun you can possibly have without your golf-shoes on!
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 7:52 am
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| Quote: |
| There's an obvious logic to having the E raises and lowers on the same knee - we never use them simultaneously! I don't see what can be gained by splitting them between right and left legs; it simply reduces our options. |
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| Roger is 100% right on that! |
Be sure to tell Paul Franklin that! 
I prefer not to have both changes on the same leg. I like to get a nice, smooth whole step raise or lower on the two E strings. That's difficult to do with both changes on the same leg. There's that little gap that occurs when your leg leaves one lever and hits the other lever.
Lee, from South Texas |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 8:09 am
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"Be sure to tell Paul Franklin that! "
And why would Paul Franklin be interested in what I thought?
(OK - I know you were being sarcastic! )
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 8:13 am
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I'll concede that the smooth whole-tone raise/lower is an advantage, but not enough reason for me to limit my options.
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Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Ben Jones
From:
Seattle, Washington, USA
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 8:39 am
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| Barry Hyman wrote: |
| I use the B to Bb lower about once every ten seconds. See my recent post called something like "More Uses for the B to Bb Lower." It is incredibly useful. But then I use them all a lot... |
I'll have to check that out. Ive used it for one lick in four years. It IS a killer lick tho.  |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 8:40 am
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Roger - In addition to the whole tone raise/lower, I find it easier to move smoothly from one chord to another. There's a little less "knee action" going on with one leg. It spreads the work between the two legs and is much more efficient for me.
When we play out, I already have enough fans that are just completely mesmerized, perhaps even enthralled, with my fancy footwork and knee-work. If I had both of those changes on one knee, it would draw even more attention to my side of the bandstand. 
Lee |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 9:13 am
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Lee
I'm pretty static on E9 - occasionally I'll migrate to my P4 (Isaacs change) and more frequently to my P1 (Day set-up) - but I'm like Fred Astaire on C6th! Well, if feels that way, at least.
Ben:
For me the B-Bb is a vital 'chord' pedal - not so much for licks. Quality of life without an ergonomically-placed B-Bb lever would be severely compromised for me!
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Last edited by Roger Rettig on 3 Feb 2010 9:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 9:44 am
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I don't think of LKV as being an extra/add-on cost item myself (should be standard issue, imho)... but I would get the LKV with B>Bb if it were me, and specify that you need to have a way to tune the C note when playing A+LKV, and the Bb note when just using LKV, individually (there are a coupla methods).
My 2cent
pete b. |
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Jon Steel
From:
Bay Area, California
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 10:52 am
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Thanks all. Took the leap, paid my $200.00 for a LKV lever B down to B flat.
_________________
1940 Kay bass
1939 Rickenbacher Model B 6-string lap steel tuned C6
Jackson Steel Slideking LS 6-string with pitch change hand pedal, tuned Open E
Jackson Steel Sho-Bro 7-string dobro with EDGE hand pedal pitch changer, built by Buddy Emmons and Shot Jackson himself in early 70's, tuned Open E
Hand pedals above take you from the I to the IV. |
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Barry Hyman
From:
upstate New York, USA
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Posted 3 Feb 2010 1:31 pm
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Here are my latest ideas on what to do with it:
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=176181
_________________
I give music lessons on several different instruments in Cambridge, NY (between Bennington, VT and Albany, NY). But my true love is pedal steel. I've been obsessed with steel since 1972; don't know anything I'd rather talk about... www.barryhyman.com |
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