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Topic: Max-Tone Mod in St. Louis? |
Tommy Gibbons
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Posted 21 Sep 2009 2:20 pm |
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While in St. Louis I saw a booth for the Max-Tone Mod. I never did get a chance to stop and find out what it was.
What exactly is it? What does it do?
Thanks...Tommy |
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Mark van Allen
From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
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Posted 21 Sep 2009 6:01 pm
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| Sshh... it's a mystery... |
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David Hartley
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 12:29 am Hi Tommy
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I did see the guys there on that stall. I was asked to play a Rains guitar which had the Max Tone mod. to see what think to it. Firstly, I couldn't compare it with another 'un-modded' guitar and secondly, apart from telling me it was not an electronic mod, they wouldn't explain exactly what it was. The reason they gave me for not telling me, is that Rains guitars would do this mod to all their steels if they told me what it was. So yes, it is a big mystery!
I wish them both all the best and would like to thank them for letting me try it out, but an explanation of this mystery mod would be nice.
Regards
David Hartley |
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Dick Wood
From:
Springtown Texas, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 7:10 am
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Aren't Max Tone and Max Headroom related in some way?
_________________
Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night. |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 10:43 am
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| magical mystery mod |
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 2:45 pm
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Smoke and Mirrors Mod ! 
_________________
14'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
08'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
94' Franklin Stereo D10 9+8
Telonics, Peterson, Steelers Choice, Benado, Lexicon, Red Dirt Cases. |
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Al Moss
From:
Kent,OH,USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 5:09 pm
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| -sounds like Tommy Young's work. I'm pleased with the setup he had done on my Mullen a while back. |
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Rick Campbell
From:
Sneedville, TN, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 5:51 pm Re: Hi Tommy
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| David Hartley wrote: |
I did see the guys there on that stall. I was asked to play a Rains guitar which had the Max Tone mod. to see what think to it. Firstly, I couldn't compare it with another 'un-modded' guitar and secondly, apart from telling me it was not an electronic mod, they wouldn't explain exactly what it was. The reason they gave me for not telling me, is that Rains guitars would do this mod to all their steels if they told me what it was. So yes, it is a big mystery!
I wish them both all the best and would like to thank them for letting me try it out, but an explanation of this mystery mod would be nice.
Regards
David Hartley |
Since you play a Rains, and you couldn't make a determination without a side by side comparison, I'd say it's not a lot to be concerned with either way.
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Nick Reed
From:
Russellville, KY USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 7:26 pm
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| post deleted |
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Ernest Cawby
From:
Lake City, Florida, USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 22 Sep 2009 7:45 pm see how this sounds as an explanation ?????
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Lets say you found a way to improve the sound of the guitar and did this for a livelyhood,
Then you told every one how and what you did to improve the guitar,
alas --- you just lost what you gained by learning something no one else knows, and lost the income your knowledge gave you as advantage over others.
So if Tommy told you what he did to improve a guitar he just lost his income, every one could do it for himself, If you were in his place would you tell what you know??????.
Some very knowing people, and very good players have stated he improved their guitar to their satisfaction.
Tommy is a very nice man and a good guy and well versed on steel guitar, Tommy I think you for being a good friend from afar, keep up the good work and let them wonder what it is you do so you can keep on helping people's guitars sound better.
ernie |
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Billy Carr
From:
Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 4:43 am mod
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| I think you nailed it Ernest! Your exactly correct. |
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Dan Burnham
From:
Greenfield, Tennessee
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 5:41 am BMI will offer the Max-Tone Mods as an option in the future.
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Do the Max-Tone Mods work? Yes!
In the future we will offer Max-Tone Mods as an option when you purchase a new BMI.
Who is getting Max-Tone Mods at BMI?
1. Cowboy Eddie Long - His next Keyless BMI will have the Max-Tone Mod.....
2. Zane King - will have the Max-Tone Mod on his new BMI Keyless as well.....
I can't say it any better than what Ernest said it. I've seen what he does, I've heard the results, and that is why we at BMI are making it an option.....
Dan (BMI)
_________________
BMI S12 Zane Beck's Tuning
www.danburnham.com |
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Andy Sandoval
From:
Bakersfield, California, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 9:21 am
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Isn't there a patent on it? wouldn't that solve the problem of someone stealin the idea?  |
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Roger Crawford
From:
Griffin, GA USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 9:36 am
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| Seems like that would be like getting a patent on tuning a car engine. I've not heard of any parts that are changed, just tweeking what's already on a guitar. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Dan, since you've seen it done, why not do those adjustments yourself as the guitar is built? |
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Allan Munro
From:
Pennsylvania, USA and Scotland
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 9:59 am
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I have come up with a design for some work (hard to find the right description here) that I am currently experimenting with on lap steel. I am not telling anyone what it involves at this time either. I don't blame the Max-Tone people for keeping things to them selves.
My own design involves some changes to convention and some new (extra) parts. The purpose of the mod is to improve sustain to a marked degree and experiments tell me it is working so far. Patenting the concept is being looked at but that is not an easy thing to do. I wish the Max-Tone guys all the best if they have a working, sale-able idea.
_________________
Only nuts eat squirrels.
Television is the REAL opiate of the masses! |
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David Hartley
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 10:12 am Hi again
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I am finding this thread interesting and continue to follow it.
It probably works and works well I am sure and as I said, I sincerely wish the Maxtone mod guys every success with their 'mod'.
I was trying to think of another item I have ever bought that I didn't know what it was that I was buying.
Or, what if I sold you the Hartley mod? It will make you sound loads better but I can't tell you what I do to your $4000 guitar! ??
Just a couple of thoughts for forumites.
And I hope I am not poking a bees nest here.
Perhaps a list of players with Maxtone Mod and their comments would help my thoughts on this.
Regards
David Hartley |
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Chris Schlotzhauer
From:
Colleyville, Tx. USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 10:14 am
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I had Gary Carpenter do his "Mod" on my Rains. I watched him do it. It improved the mechanics and sound.
Just because I know what he did, doesn't mean I would steal the idea and want to go into the business of modding steels.
If I pay someone to do something, I think I deserve to know exactly what I'm getting. |
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Allan Munro
From:
Pennsylvania, USA and Scotland
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 10:30 am
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Let me make it clear that I agree with David and Chris in what they say.
Coming up with a 'potentially valuable' concept that is essentially copyable is not an easy thing to manage. If that concept falls into the 'Damn, why didn't I think of that - it's so obvious!' class then it is even harder to keep some control over.
The concept I mentioned above is being looked at from the point of view of obtaining some kind of legal protection. If that doesn't prove possible then I guess it will become public domain as soon as the first version of it appears outside of my shop.
With regard to David's point, if my work is accepted it will be pretty obvious what you are getting for your money!!!  (So it should be too!)
Regards, Allan.....
_________________
Only nuts eat squirrels.
Television is the REAL opiate of the masses! |
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Cliff Kane
From:
the late great golden state
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 11:15 am
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| I totally respect people's right to capitalize from their inventions and to own the rights to their work. I think what's weird about this is it doesn't sound like it's a product, so I'm assuming that it's a technician's "trade secret". I think a lot of people are assuming that that's what it is, but a lot of these "trade secrets" (if that's what it is) are shared and openly talked about. For example, Jim Palenscar has some pretty good tricks that he does when he tweaks my guitar, but he explains them and I don't think he would mind me watching him work if I wanted to. Jim did some very clever tweaks in different ways to my guitar, and I still take the guitar to him because I know he can do it and I would rather have him do it because he's pro and very good. Can these things be owned? Is this truly intellectual property? Is it an evolutionary technique that different people are doing in different places, sort of like how the wheel appeared around the same time in different places? Some techs will route chambers into an electric guitar's body to improve the sound, but everyone knows about this mod, clients do not attempt it themselves because they would rather have a pro do it, and companies continue to make guitars the way they designed them in spite of knowing that the improvement exists. I think what frustrates people about this is that even the type of work that is being performed is being obscured. |
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Pat Comeau
From:
New Brunswick, Canada
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 1:53 pm
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When i pay for something it's because i can't do it myself, but if i would pay someone and then figured i could of done it myself  ...i don't think it's something you can patent, if it takes special tools or special parts to do the thing that's something else, i know alot of people pays for something they can do themself but not all, i have a friend who fix small engines for a living and when i need to get something fixed or tuned up he always tells me how to do it...but if it needs to have a part changed or fix then it's a different story.
_________________
Comeau SD10 4x5, Comeau S10 3x5, Peavey Session 500,Fender Telecaster,Fender Stratocaster, Fender Precision,1978 Ovation Viper electric. Alvarez 4 strings Violin electric.
Click the links to listen to my Comeau's Pedal Steel Guitars.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2GhZTN_yXI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvDTw2zNriI |
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Rick Campbell
From:
Sneedville, TN, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 2:25 pm
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| Roger Crawford wrote: |
| Seems like that would be like getting a patent on tuning a car engine. |
You can tune a fiddle, but you can't tuna fish.
In high school I had a hot rod with a Dodge 440, so I tuned it to A.
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Brint Hannay
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 2:36 pm Re: BMI will offer the Max-Tone Mods as an option in the fut
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| Dan Burnham wrote: |
Do the Max-Tone Mods work? Yes!
In the future we will offer Max-Tone Mods as an option when you purchase a new BMI....
I can't say it any better than what Ernest said it. I've seen what he does, I've heard the results, and that is why we at BMI are making it an option.....
Dan (BMI) |
This is quite interesting, as it is the first instance I know of of a steel guitar builder openly endorsing Tommy Young's "mod".
I'm genuinely curious, this isn't a hostile question or a challenge--Why are you only offering Max-Tone mods as an option?
Is it because you feel some customers might prefer the sound of an un-"modded" guitar?
Or is it because it involves sending the guitar to Tommy himself to have the mod done after you have finished building it?
This raises once again the question of whether the term "mod" is or isn't appropriate to describe whatever it is that Tommy does. If it amounts to an expert setup and adjustment, then the term "mod" really is somewhat misleading. If, on the other hand, it involves alteration, substitution, addition, or subtraction of any parts, that fits the definition of "mod" as used elsewhere, e.g. in the world of amplifiers.
So is offering "Max-Tone mods" as an option saying "For an additional fee (or not), we'll send it to Tommy Young to set it up his style", or is it in effect making him the optional last step in the BUILDING process?
Or, do you apply the mod in your own shop? |
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Kevin Hatton
From:
Buffalo, N.Y.
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 3:46 pm
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| Four down, and three to go, Kitty Carlyle your next. |
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John Lockney
From:
New Market, Maryland, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 4:13 pm
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I stopped by the Max Tone booth at the ISGC last year and honestly, at first I had the sensation that I was talking to a crazy person. You make guitars sound better, you won't say how, and you want money for this... ? Right.
But, I stayed a while and played some of the modified guitars. There may be other changes involved in the mod but, I found the sustain at the high-end was truly unbelievable. At the 24th fret and above it felt and sounded like you were at the 5th fret. I asked him to turn the reverb off, took off the headphones, etc. It wouldn't go away. |
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Cliff Kane
From:
the late great golden state
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Posted 23 Sep 2009 4:22 pm
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| John Lockney wrote: |
| I found the sustain at the high-end was truly unbelievable. At the 24th fret and above it felt and sounded like you were at the 5th fret. I asked him to turn the reverb off, took off the headphones, etc. It wouldn't go away. |
Hey, that sounds like my push-pull! Yea, I got the Buddy Emmons mod. Buddy invented it years ago, and it always sounds better.  |
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