E-66 or Tru-Tone

Chris Harvey · From: California, USA

I know this is obviously a preference and we're talking single coil vs. humbucker, but thought I would query the group as I am still new to this instrument and am in search of tone. I had a GFI II pickup that I did not like the sound of and placed a tru-tone on and, through my old fender vibrosonic, could zap you with a bright note on occasion. I was able to pick up another GFI, with an E-66 and it sounds, to my ear, very smooth while not being dull or mid range "honky". This is driving me crazy as I'm sitting looking at my new wallace pickup and am struggling with how darn good the e-66 sounds.

Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

Whenever I have a GFI, I've had real good luck using the George L 10-1's in each one. However, on other brands I prefer different p/u's, including the Truetones.

Chris LeDrew · From: Canada

I've used the E66 as well as the BL 710 and 705 for E9, and my preference is the E66. It's got a nice presence with a warm zing to it. I like the 710 as well, although it always sounds a little bit lacking in presence to me, like you always need to add high end to the amp (this can be a good thing, though). The 705 sounds closer to the E66 than the 710, to my ear anyway. I have a Truetone in my current steel (Fessy SD10) and it's fine, but I might switch it out for an E66 to give it a whirl. The Truetone sounds a bit mid-rangy for my liking, at least with this guitar anyway.

It all comes down to the guitar, in the end. Some guitars seem to sound better with certain pickups. A lot of players use a Truetone as a Sho~Bud replacement, while others use an E66 in an Emmons-type guitar. (I've heard players refer to an E66 installed in a Sho~Bud as a "tumor"). If I were stuck with one choice - whether it be single or double - i would choose the E66. But you will not find a whole lot of love for the E66 on the forum. Some players find them "plastic" sounding. As I've said, it's all about preference. Just do a history search in Pedal Steel about "E66". Some good threads should pop up.
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Bill Terry · From: Bastrop, TX

Per Berner · From: Skovde, Sweden

My '75 p/p had an E66 on the E9th neck when I bought it, and it sounded great then. Glassy highs, growly, good string separation - definitely "the" p/p sound. When the restoration is finished, the original single coil will still replace it – at least to being with.

Des Hetherington · From: New Zealand

On my 2006 Rains SD10, the pickup says George Ls, but there isnt a number or namesake on it, anyone have an idea what model that may be? cheers des
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David Nugent · From: Gum Spring, Va.

Chri...I believe it would depend on to what value the Truetone pickup was wound. The GFI being an inherently bright sounding guitar would require a pickup wound to around 19K or greater IMO. Jerry(Truetone Pickups) wound two pickups specifically for my GFI and they improved the tone greatly without being overly bright..... Des..The George L pickup without a number configuration is known as the "10-1".....Bill..the early model Carters were shipped with an "E-66" on the E-9, and a "10-1" on the C6. At that time, some owners were reversing this arrangement ("10-1" on E-9, "E-66" on c6) and most reported a favorable improvement.

Des Hetherington · From: New Zealand

David, thanx for that info, i like the pickup, my only wish is. if i could get the G# 22 plain string to ring out more at the twelth fret, it really dose die there, not sure whats causing that,
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Barry Hyman · From: upstate New York, USA

I'm too poor to be constantly trying new pickups (I do music for a living) but I gambled (never having used one) and had a George L E-66 installed on my Williams when I bought it in May, and I love it! It can be as sharp as anything anybody would want if you bite right into it near the bridge, but it can also be sweet and rich and mellow out over the frets, closer to the center of the string. My reasoning was this: since the Willy has a wood body and a wood neck, it might have been too mellow unless I put a really bright pickup on it, and I have absolutely no regrets. It has as full a range of tones as I could ask for.
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Bill Erchul · From: Raleigh, NC, USA

Chris, I have played mainly Sho-Bud and Emmons guitars over the past 30+ years and have found the E-66 to be an outstanding humbucking pickup in both for my purposes. Given your original post, I unfortunately don't have any experience with GFIs but have no reason to believe that an E-66 wouldn't deliver a great sound. Single coil pickups clearly have their place and certainly offer a greater dynamic range over humbuckers but overall my experience suggests the E-66 does a great job.

Bill

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

for me it was just shear logistics. I think the Truetones are awesome and I also have no issues with the H'buckers ( E66).

I played a club regularly with horrific bandstand "noise/hum" and it was the logical choice to remove the Trutones and go back to the E66.

If the Steel was capable to swap PUPS very easily I would still have the Trutones and would use them regularly.

Barry Hyman · From: upstate New York, USA

I'm with Tony -- I chose a humbucker over a single coil because I too play regularly in a club where the electromagnetic background "noise" is so intense I couldn't even tune my old single-coil MSA when I was plugged into a digital tuner -- the tuner would just go crazy -- up and down, back and forth, with no readings possible! I tried new batteries in the tuner and a new tuner too... Humbucker solved that problem instantly, with no discernable loss in sound quality, maybe an improvement...
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Michael T. Hermsmeyer · From: Branson, Missouri, USA

Now that's the kind of question that will get a multitude of answers, LOL...

It sounds like you just need to test various pickups with your rig. A lot depends on your guitar, neck material, pedal, amp(s), effects, cables, etc...

Usually you can find a lot of different used pickups here on the forum. Buy one, try it out, and if you don't like it, sell it or trade it and you won't be out much money and you will gain a lot of knowledge.

Also, it is important to measure the resistance of the various pickups you are trying, even if they are the same brand or type. My original '73 Emmons are 17.5k single coils and I have a Truetone 18k that is darn close in my LeGrande.

In my experience...
Sho-Bud SC in Pro-I or LDG = Bright and smooth.
George L's PF-1 in LDG = Smooth, round, vibrant.
George L's E-66 in LDG = very electronic, awful to my ear. Went back to Sho-Bud single coil.

These were both wood neck guitars.

George L's 10-1 in a Thomas SD-10 (wood neck)= dang near perfect!! and I have an Emmons push pull!!

Emmons 17.5k single coils in my '73 push pull (aluminum necks) = the often recognized standard of pedal steel guitar tone. Perfect-depending on the other variables I mentioned before. It's not for everyone.

Emmons 108 humbuckers ??k ohms in 1992 Lashley LeGrande (aluminum necks)= muddy, through most amps. Not bad through an Evans or Fender amp. I went through a lot of great amps before realizing I didn't like these pickups.

Truetone 18k single coil in 1992 Lashley LeGrande (aluminum)= as close to the PP tone as I have gotten. This pickup made the E9 neck sparkle and sing.

If I had and E-66, I'd trade you for that Truetone!!!

Remember that the E-66 was developed by George Lewis and Buddy Emmons to make an MCI steel sound like a 1966 Emmons PP to Buddy's ear. So it would be most at home in this type of setting.

I realize that depending on your location that you may have a noise problem with single coils as I did at the Jim Stafford theatre in Branson. I had to reinstall the 108's in my LeGrande because of this.

I hope this helps.

Describe your rig:
Guitar model:
Neck material:
Match Box?
Volume Pedal:
Effects:
Amp(s):

What kind of tone are you looking for or wanting to hear? What player(s) have the best tone to your ear?

That might help us make suggestions to better help you achieve your goal.

Thanks,
God Bless,
Michael T.
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Tommy Shown · From: Denham Springs, La.

They are both good pickups, I had an E66 on the E9 of my Sho-Bud.And it was a decent pickup. I have friend of mine that has the Wallace True tone on his Emmons and the sound quality can't be beat.

Ulf Edlund · From: Umeå, Sweden

In a guitar with a natural bright tone the E66 might be a little harsh, but in a guitar with less overtones it can be a really good choise.
If you find the TT dull in your guitar, chanses are that you would like the E66.
A used E66 is not very expensive, you could find one here on the forum and try it. If you don't like it you can sell it on the forum again and most likely get your money back.
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James Quackenbush · From: Pomona, New York, USA

There are so many variables to the"what sounds best " scenario .....What sounds great to me , might not sound so good to you ......Then you have basic talent where someone with good chops could sound good playing just about ANY steel with ANY pickup ..... The reason I say this is because I find the E66 probably my most UN desireable pickup that George L makes ....If I'm looking for a single coil tone , and need the humbucker qualities due to noise problems , I will most likely go to a B. Lawrence pickup ... A friend of mine bought a wooden necked Williams and brought it over to my house and that steel was BRITE !!!....WOW it was ear pearcing brite .....He thought that maybe it would be toned down by ordering it with a wooden neck ....Now I see Barry H. posting that he loves his with an E66 pickup on his Willy !!! Whoa!

...... That combination to me sounds like it would cut like a lazor !!!...Again, this is ALL a matter of personal preference and what strength the pickup was wound, and what steel it is on .... If I have a steel that want to smooth out because it is too brite, I will go to the George L 10-1 similar to what the GFI players did when switching pickups on the early GFI's ....I couldn't agree more ....My Excel is a BRITE sounding steel ....I put a B. Lawrence XR16 in it because it still gives me the highs that I want , but pushes the mids and low end a little more than a 712 ( I play a U-12) ...With that added push in the mids and lows , the strength of the pickup , and the added small amount of GOOD distortion from a tube amp , and I get the tone I'm looking for .... Plug into a S. S. amp and I get the sparkley clean that most players look for .... To sum it up, SO MANY variables ....Jim

Barry Hyman · From: upstate New York, USA

I'm surprised. My wood neck wood body Williams sounds fantastic with the E-66. But maybe that's because I play without picks, sometimes even with the skin of my fingertips rather than fingernails? This baby purrs like a cat or growls like a bear -- I doubt very much anybody hearing me play it would say it sounds electronic or harsh. I run through an antique tube amp with bass always a bit higher than treble. It sounds creamy and warm, not harsh. But I can also cut like a sharkbite when I want to. I love it.

...Which sustains my argument that 90% of tone is in the fingers... My Williams doesn't have a "tone." It plays whatever tone I choose to get out of it!

And that depends most on where I pick, how hard I pick, what angle I pick at, what plane I set the string to vibrating in, which finger or thumb I use, and what part of my finger I choose to pick it with...
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I give music lessons on several different instruments in Cambridge, NY (between Bennington, VT and Albany, NY). But my true love is pedal steel. I've been obsessed with steel since 1972; don't know anything I'd rather talk about... www.barryhyman.com

James Quackenbush · From: Pomona, New York, USA

Barry
Every steel sounds different ....Your Williams does have a tone....Your hands and fingers mold that tone into what you want it to sound like .... We finally ended up taming the briteness in my buddy's Willy running a George L 10-1 .....I'm glad your Willy setup worked well for you, and you are happy with it ....They're great steels !!....Bill makes some great ones !!... ....Jim

Bill Duncan · From: Lenoir, North Carolina, USA

On my '77 MSA D10 I have an E-66 on the E9 neck. The E9 has ample sustain and I can keep notes picked once going for several frets and moves without problem. I like the lively tone I get with the E-66.

I kept the original MSA Supersustain pickup on the C6. I like the way it sounds there.
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chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

what is the difference between an e66 and an original single coil emmons pickup?

Steve English · From: Baja, Arizona

Here's some good info from the Carter Steel Guitars site:

http://www.steelguitar.com/resource/pickups/pickupin.htm#E-66Description
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Ulf Edlund · From: Umeå, Sweden

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