More Windows 7 Info from Vista Newsletter

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

Here is more info from the Vista Newsletter on migrating to Windows 7.

Close Encounters of the Problematic Kind: Issues You Might Run Into When You Migrate to Windows 7

Whether you're already running the release candidate, or have no experience at all with Windows 7 but anticipate upgrading when the retail version is released in October, you're probably wondering what to expect in making the transition to the final version. Having installed the final code (RTM) on several machines recently, I can tell you about a few issues you might encounter when you take the plunge.

Of course, the easiest way to upgrade your OS is to buy a new computer that has it preinstalled. But if you have a perfectly good computer already, one that has plenty of processing power and memory, there's no reason to go out and make a big ticket purchase just to get the benefits of the latest operating system. However, there may be a few "gotchas" that you should be prepared for when you install any new OS. And even if you've been running the beta and RC happily, there are a few changes in the final code that might pose problems. And there are also the challenges that you always face with a new installation - but there are ways around some of those that we'll tell you about here.

First, of course, is application compatibility. You might think that if a program runs fine on the Windows 7 RC, it's going to work on the final version too - but that's not necessarily true. I was completely surprised to find that one of the security programs I had used on both the Windows 7 beta and RC wouldn't install properly on my shiny new RTM installation. It seems the driver won't load. The program vendor is well aware of the issue and working to develop a hotfix, which will no doubt be out long before the general public gets Windows 7. But it illustrates how even small changes such as those made between RC and RTM can cause unexpected behavior.

Many Vista apps actually will run fine on Windows 7 - except that they won't install. That's because the application's installation program does OS version checking. It's programmed to install on the operating system(s) specified in the program (for example, XP and Vista, designated by version numbers 5.x and 6.x). If it checks the version and doesn't see one of those operating systems, it refuses to install and you get a message saying something like "This application requires Windows XP or higher." Yes, Windows 7 is higher, but the program isn't smart enough to know that. Luckily, you can overcome this problem by running the installation program (usually Setup.exe) in compatibility mode. To do that, right click the shortcut or executable and click the Compatibility tab. Select the appropriate operating system from the drop-down box.

Application compatibility isn't the only issue you're likely to encounter when you decide to switch to Windows 7. If you're using Vista, deciding whether to do an in-place upgrade or a clean installation can be a dilemma. If your Vista installation has any problems, installing Windows 7 over it might fix them; this happened with my laptop, which had both performance problems and application errors that were cleared up by an upgrade to Windows 7. On the other hand, you may bring the problem along with you or even exacerbate it. We upgraded the HP TouchSmart (our kitchen computer), hoping that the graphics card crashes that started just recently would be fixed. Instead, in Windows 7 it was worse: instead of only crashing when Media Center was on and idle, it now crashed at random times even when Media Center was closed.

A clean installation, however, can present problems of its own. On my Core i7, I kept the RC intact and did a clean install of the RTM on a separate partition. But of course, with a clean install, you lose all those configurations that you spent hours or days or weeks or months getting just the way you wanted them, along with any applications you installed and their configurations. I decided to try to shave some time off the setup of the RTM by using the Easy Transfer wizard that's built into Windows 7. It lets you save the user account information, wallpaper and desktop icons, custom Explorer settings, documents, e-mail, music, pictures, videos, IE favorites, etc. from the old computer or installation to a hard drive, USB key, or network location. Then you can restore it to the new computer or installation. I saved all my info from the RC and transferred it to the RTM. Generally, it worked great; you can read about my experience (and see the screenshots) in the Amazon EndUser blog at
http://www.vistanews.com/IWRY1T/090813-Win7-Migration

One of the nicest things about Easy Transfer was the way it migrated the settings for my Office applications - even before I installed the programs. My Word custom quick access toolbar was there. My Outlook profile was there, with my preferred view, autocomplete list, etc. However, I discovered there was a problem with Outlook. I don't know whether it was something that got messed up during easy transfer, or a result of the errant security program I installed that wasn't compatible with the RTM, or something else entirely, but after a day or so I started getting errors upon opening Outlook, saying that the data file didn't close properly. I tried turning off cache mode, which usually fixes this problem. I then tried doing a repair installation of Outlook, but the problem was still there. Next I tried creating a new profile for my Exchange account. That fixed the problem - but now I was back to where you are after a normal clean installation. The most annoying thing about that is that all those addresses I had in autocomplete were gone.

However, you don't have to use the Easy Transfer tool to get those in your new Outlook installation. Those addresses are kept in a file with an NK2 extension. I knew that, but I at first I couldn't find that file. In XP, it's in \ Documents and Settings \ \ Application Data \ Microsoft \ Outlook. But in Windows 7 and Vista, it's at C Oh Well

Users \ \ AppData \ Roaming \ Microsoft \ Outlook. You can find yours, and edit or delete information in it, with a handy little program called NK2View from NirSoft. It's a free download at
http://www.vistanews.com/IWRY1T/090813-NK2View

Once you find the NK2 file, just copy it over to the folder referenced above on your new computer or installation. There's a trick, though. If you've created a new profile, as I did, you'll need to rename the NK2 file. By default, it's named Outlook.NK2 because "Outlook" is the name of the default profile. My new profile was named Deb, so I had to rename the file to Deb.NK2. Then I had all my autocomplete addresses back, and Outlook worked great. Sweet.

In general, reported problems with the RTM have been few, but when the final version is released to the public, we're sure to see some interesting issues pop up on various configurations with different applications. If you're running the RTM, tell us about any new problems you've come across (or problems from the RC that have been fixed). Do you have any tricks and tips for the smoothest transition from Vista to Windows 7 based on your own experiences? If you haven't tried Windows 7 yet, what problems do you fear most? We invite you to discuss this topic in our forums at
http://www.vistanews.com/IWRY1T/090813-Forum-Discussion

Wiz Feinberg · From: Mid-Michigan, USA

Let the games begin! I think Jack and I will be very busy trying to help people upgrade to Windows 7. I hope I can even afford to purchase a copy of the final product, to install it as a dual boot on my XP Pro computer.
_________________
"Wiz" Feinberg, Moderator SGF Computers Forum
Security Consultant
Twitter: @Wizcrafts
Main web pages: Wiztunes Steel Guitar website | Wiz's Security Blog | My Webmaster Services | Wiz's Security Blog

Mitch Drumm · From: Frostbite Falls, hard by Veronica Lake

Wiz:

I installed the 64-bit RC as a dual boot with 32-bit Vista SP2 on a Core 2 Duo PC within the last 24 hours. I had installed the 32-bit version on an old P4 about 2 weeks ago without incident, but I ran into a few oddities during the 64-bit install:

My Vista boot drive is a Seagate and I have a separate internal WD drive with one partition and plenty of space. I shrank that partition in Vista and created 30 GB of unallocated space. I partitioned the space, but did not format.

I booted from my DVD drive and was immediately presented with a menu asking me to choose either CD ROM boot type 1 or 2, with no explanation on screen of what that meant.

I arbitrarily chose 2 and was told the choice was a non system disc.

Choice 1 resulted in “press any key to boot from DVD”. The PC booted to Vista before I could even make a choice from the presented menu.

On the second boot I chose 1 again and it began to load files and I thought all was OK.

I chose custom install and chose the unformatted partition. The advanced option for format at the "choose partition" screen was greyed out. I selected the correct partition and continued, figuring it would stall due to lack of format. It did stall in the “expanding files” portion at 0%. I cancelled with escape, made the same choices and this time expanding files worked.

There was no confirmation any formatting was going on or that the install was in fact going onto the correct partition.

In a few minutes, it rebooted and I thought it would proceed automatically, but I again saw the 1 and 2 menu. I chose 1 as I had on the earlier boot and nothing happened. Chose 2 and got system error. Pressed a key and for 3 seconds saw a boot menu with Vista and Win 7, with Win 7 as the default.

Before I could make a choice, it continued with the installation. Went through another auto restart and I again chose 2. I got another non-system disc error. Pressed a key and got a good menu with some time to choose Win 7 or Vista.

Things proceeded pretty well from that point and I got to a desktop.

Attempted to import favorites from the MIG file I had made earlier with Easy Transfer.

I was asked for a "key". I had no idea what that meant as I did not get one when I ran Easy Transfer earlier within Vista. The separate bookmarks import function in IE asked for a bookmarks.htm file. I was able to go back to Vista, locate it, and install it--but the Easy Transfer thing proved useless in my case. Apparently, there is something about it I don't understand.

Windows 7 shows my Vista boot drive as E, my Vista E backup drive as D, and my Vista D as F.

It seems to be OK for now, but I have no explanation about the DVD drive business during the install.

Seems to be snappy enough with 2 GB of RAM.

I like the "library" capability. I have not yet had any folder view or Explorer window issues like I did continually in Vista.

There are web explanations of how to install from a USB drive, but I didn't try them. Maybe I will for laughs later.

Chip Fossa · From: Monson, MA, USA (deceased)

OH GOD!

Not again!?

I was told this Vista-Win7 was gonna actually be pain free.

I should've known.

Microsoft should get in the habit of sending a bottle of Excedrin with every CD upgrade.

But, Wiz, what do you think? Would this be a time to bring Acronis in and use it to do a complete re-install? (Even asking this makes me shutter)

I'm really thinking just doing a regular non-uninstall upgrade.

UGH! Sad

PS - I already bought the Win7 upgrade via Amazon for the $49+ promo deal, so I'm stuck with it, now.
I now think MS should move up the release date from projected Oct.26 to October 31. It's that scary. BOO!
_________________
Chip
Williams U-12 8X5; Keyless; Natural Blonde Laquer.

Wiz Feinberg · From: Mid-Michigan, USA

Chip;
YES! Backup the entire computer with Acronis True Image, just before you try to upgrade to Windows 7. Be sure to create a complete "image" of the boot disk (usually the "C" drive) and validate it before you begin the upgrade. Also, test the saved file by rebooting with the Acronis recovery bootable CD in the CD tray, which you should have already made. You should be able to boot from that disk into the recovery interface, then browse to the location of the saved image and validate it.

Make sure you include the master boot record (MBR or Boot Sector) in the image backup.

Do not save images on the same drive as your boot files are on! Save to a second internal or external drive, or to DVDs, or to a network location accessible from a DOS bootup (requires a bootable NIC, not usually installed in personal computers).

If the upgrade goes well, pat yourself on the back. Otherwise, recover the last saved image from the backup location and overwrite the bad upgrade.
_________________
"Wiz" Feinberg, Moderator SGF Computers Forum
Security Consultant
Twitter: @Wizcrafts
Main web pages: Wiztunes Steel Guitar website | Wiz's Security Blog | My Webmaster Services | Wiz's Security Blog

John Cipriano · From: San Francisco

Two things:

1. keep backups
2. don't panic

and everything will be fine. By having a good backup you drastically limit what can go wrong, in fact you limit it to the set of problems that you can recover from with an hour and some coffee.

And basically Wiz just said this but it bears repeating.

--

Mitch, I read that the "CD ROM boot type" message shows up when you put the DVD in a Mac because they use EFI to boot rather than a BIOS. I am under the impression that only one of the choices will work for a particular machine. Your experience seems to be the same so that part's nothing to worry about.

I think you like pain because you kept picking #2 Very Happy

The key I think you're supposed to get from the site when you download the ISO. I haven't done it but I believe someone here said that, maybe Jack.

Having the system drive other than C is common and has to do with the order in which the hardware gets initialized. Often happens with USB card readers. In your case Win7 is not on the first disk so it makes sense. You can change the drive letter in the Disk Management console (in XP at least you right click on My Computer and hit Manage). If you want it to be C, change it now before you have more time invested into that installation, in case for some reason it causes an issue.

Other than that everything is good, right? I'd feel bad if I pushed you to install the RC and something went wrong...

Chip Fossa · From: Monson, MA, USA (deceased)

Gosh - a - roni.

Thanks Wiz & John.

I'm lost.

I can't comprhend what you guys are trying to tell me.

But I still wuv ya. Shocked

_________________
Chip
Williams U-12 8X5; Keyless; Natural Blonde Laquer.

Chip Fossa · From: Monson, MA, USA (deceased)

OK, in a more structured pattern of thought...

When I make an Acronis backup it's always for a complete new backup of Drive C and Data D.

I have 2 WD external storage drives. The one labeled "K" is used exclusively for Acronis backups.

Instead of doing 'incremental' and/or 'differential' backups, I decided it was much easier just backing up the entire C drive. The time spent is inconsequential, to me. Data D is not all that critical. I think I could find it on C drive, maybe.

Wiz, I made an ACER factory default disc (2). Is this what you mean? I don't think I have an Acronis bootable disc; or created one. And what the heck is the Master Boot Record?

I simply save the entire C drive with the proper date on it to "K" drive, and then delete the previous entire C drive 'save'.

And, I do validate. That's all I do. But you once told me to actually see if the saved image is indeed 'saved', that I would have to take the external "K" drive over to some friend's house and try it out on their PC; or any other PC.

Maybe I got this wrong.

Confused

_________________
Chip
Williams U-12 8X5; Keyless; Natural Blonde Laquer.

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

I don't think there is any need for "panic" right now. We are several months from the actual Win 7 release. Some of the problems noted in my post may never occur for any given installation. In fact, most of the upgrades from Vista will probably be relatively smooth. Just remember to "clean up" the PC BEFORE the upgrade - any incompatible programs removed, get rid of the "junk" on the PC, etc.

Chip Fossa · From: Monson, MA, USA (deceased)

Thank you Jack,

But you guys are so experienced at computers, that a wise warning of caution is never to be underestimated.

I bought my 1st PC almost exactly 11 years ago. August of '98. Windows 95.

I haven't migrated too much, but with all the great help on this fantastic Forum... NO REGRETS at all.

Once again, all you professors, thanks for the invaluable info. Very Happy

_________________
Chip
Williams U-12 8X5; Keyless; Natural Blonde Laquer.

Mitch Drumm · From: Frostbite Falls, hard by Veronica Lake

John:

No sweat, I got through it with only slight annoyances.

Eckshilly, if you look at my account above, you will see that I chose CD choice 1 three times, and chose 2 several times as well. The annoyance was the complete lack of on screen messages--no clues at all. There are only two choices to make on any given reboot, so you will eventually stumble into the truth, and I did. There didn't seem to be any consistency--1 might work on this boot, and 2 on the next boot---but just keep fiddling.

Not sure I follow your point on the key ("you're supposed to get from the site when you download the ISO"). I had no issues with the installation product key. I was asked for a key in conjunction with the Easy Transfer tool. If you meant that the product key should also be used with Easy Transfer, you may be right--but there was no such implication in the onscreen message I got. Maybe I should have made the inference, but I didn't--I had run Easy Transfer before on other OS and never was asked for a key. Could be because this is an evaluation copy?

I think I won't rename any drives: By default, my Win 7 boot partition is recognized as C in Win 7 and my boot partition in Vista is still recognized as C in Vista--of course they are actually different partitions on different drives. I don't want to mess with that--I can deal with the fact that my data is on F in Win 7 rather than D on Vista.

Here is the preliminary report on some of my most often used apps, mostly 32 bit, on 64-bit Windows 7.

These are installed and seem to run OK:

Spyware Blaster
Spybot Search and Destroy
AVG Free antivirus 8.5
I-tunes 4.9 (antique, from about 2002?)
CDex ripper/converter
Encspot mp3 evaluator
AM Deadlink Checker
Malware Bytes
Quicktime Alternative (replaces Quicktime in I-tunes)
Quick Par
MP3 Gain
MP3 Tag
7-Zip archive unpacker (64-bit version)
HJ Split file joiner
Name It Your Way file renamer (fantastic program)

Issues with:

Audacity 1.3.8 beta: I got an error about not being able to load imagingengine.dll, bypassed it, and the app seems to work OK?

Youtube: no can do because Flash is not yet available for 64-bit browsers, but I think (?) I could run a 32 bit Explorer on Win 7 64-bit??

I still have to test Firefox, Thunderbird, my burning app (Img Burn), my backup program (Second Copy), and 2 image viewers: Photoshop 4 and LView Pro (both antiques about 10 years old).

Chip:

I don't think there is any reason at all to be fearful about the install.

Come to a conclusion about whether you are going to do an "upgrade" (over the top of Vista, leaving your applications hopefully intact) or a "clean" install (wiping out Vista and everything on your Vista partition, including your applications).

I chose the latter and don't regret it. I went with 64-bit on this test system, but there is certainly no reason you can't stick with 32-bit. Your Windows 7 package will include discs for both.

The primary reason I am considering 64-bit is that I may want to load up on RAM (at least 6 gigs) and 32-bit Windows can't use more than about 3.5 gigs of it.

Save your bookmarks, email, and data to another drive, USB drive, CD, whatever.

The install proper shouldn't take over an hour--then it's just a matter of reinstalling applications and restoring data.

Chip Fossa · From: Monson, MA, USA (deceased)

Thanks Mitch,

I have 3GB of RAM. Two external WD drives (one is 160GB and the other is 350GB). One of these drives is exclusively for Acronis backup.

I've got 3 internal drives:
C,D, and F. C is about 155GB with 90GB free. D is 155GB, too, and 153GB free. And F is 250GB with 239GB free.

So I guess I got enough room.

I was about to ask what is the advantage of 64 bit vs 32 bit, but you explained it above, about 64 bit allows for more RAM.

I just hope that Win7 doesn't compromise my 3GB of RAM. The machine is running fairly well right now.
_________________
Chip
Williams U-12 8X5; Keyless; Natural Blonde Laquer.

John Cipriano · From: San Francisco

Mitch, I did think you were talking about the product key. That was a mistake on my part. I've never used the Easy Transfer tool.

It could be that it wants the product key but I don't know about that. I thought you meant the installation wanted one.

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