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Post new topic Fifty Years Ago
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Author Topic:  Fifty Years Ago
Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 4:02 am    
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1959 is considered by many as a golden year for jazz. Quintessential albums such as Miles Davis' Kind of Blue and Dave Brubeck's Time Out both set jazz standards, that year. Here is a live, 1959 performance of the Horace Silver Quintet performing his "Senor Blues", which appeared on his 1956 album Six Pieces of Silver.

I recall this as being THE song which got me interested in jazz. I first heard it on George Shearing's 1958 album In The Night, which my dad had.

Anyway, again, from a 1959 live performance, here's Horace Silver doing "Senor Blues":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOu5iWhexE0

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn


Last edited by Glenn Suchan on 24 Jul 2009 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Russ Wever

 

From:
Kansas City
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 8:58 am    
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Good call, Glen -
Horace Silver wrote some of
the 'catchiest' jazz melodys.
A lot of these melodies (heads)
along with his left hand comping
during soloing is some of the
funkiest rhythms, back before
'funk' was out there as a style
unto itself.

His autobiography came out
last year and is a great read.
A portion of it can be read here.
He's lived a 'clean' life, never
given to some of the excesses that
took out many of his peers in the
that era, and is still active in
music, although in a limited way.
~Russ
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 9:42 am    
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Very cool. Cool

What's the chord that's being played in place of the IV in the 5th and 6th measures? I hear that substitution in minor jazz progressions a lot, and it always stumps me.
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 10:07 am    
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Hi Russ,

You're absolutely right about Horace Silver's impact on jazz music. So many of his hits have been standards for decades ("The Preacher", "Doodlin", "Ecaroh", "Opus de Funk", "Cool Eyes", "Sister Sadie", "Filthy McNasty", "Song For My Father", and of course, "Senor Blues").
Thanks for the link to Horace Silver's autobiography. I see where it's available in the Fine Arts Library, here on the UT campus. So, guess where I'm headin' this afternoon.

BTW: I really like the way you play Horace Silver's "Song For My Father". I few years ago you'd advised me about a way to play the signature triplets in that song. It helped me immensely. Thank-you. Smile

Keep on pickin', amigo!
Glenn
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Russ Wever

 

From:
Kansas City
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 10:13 am    
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BoB,

If you think of the relative major
key, it would be a IV chord -
The basic changes would look like

VIm VIm VIm VIm
IV IV IV IV
VIm VIm VIm VIm
III II VIm VIm

The VII tone is common
to all the chords so
the VIm becomes VIm9,
the IV becomes IV9#11,
the III becomes III7 and
the II becomes II13.

~Russ
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Brint Hannay

 

From:
Maryland, USA
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 10:29 am    
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b0b wrote:
Very cool. 8)

What's the chord that's being played in place of the IV in the 5th and 6th measures? I hear that substitution in minor jazz progressions a lot, and it always stumps me.

Sounds to me like bVI(B - technically Cb)9#11. (song in Ebm)
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Russ Wever

 

From:
Kansas City
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 10:32 am    
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Glen,
Oops, I didn't notice your
reply when answering bOb.
Thanks for your kind words,
glad I could be helpful.
~Russ
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Brint Hannay

 

From:
Maryland, USA
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 10:39 am    
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I think Russ and I are saying the same thing! Only I tend to think of minor keys as existing in their own right, rather than defining them in terms of their relative majors. But, as I think about it, maybe his approach is better--because which type of minor do I use? If I consider Eb minor to be the key with six flats (i.e. relative to Gb major), and Ebm as I, then Cb (B) is VI, not bVI. I called it bVI because my theory education, such as it has been, was jazz-oriented, so I tend to think of "minor" as Dorian. Oh Well

Well, at least I got the chord right! Cool
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 12:19 pm    
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Okay then, to simplify the idea I would think in A minor:

Am Am Am Am
F7 F7 Am Am
E7 D7 Am Am

So, maybe it's like the V chord of the minor key, raised up a fret? Pretty cool sounding. Cool The b7 of the chord (Eb note of F7) steps out of the minor key scale for some really interesting riffs.
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David Doggett


From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
Post  Posted 24 Jul 2009 1:34 pm    
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Another way to look at this is from the standpoint of the Latin Phrygian scale (this is a Latin jazz piece). In the key with no sharps or flats (C major in Western theory), the scale is E F G A B C D E; thus, in terms of the half- and whole-step pattern, it is half, whole, whole, whole, half, whole, whole. In the harmonized Phrygian scale, the IV is minor. This functions as sort of the relative minor in Phrygian mode; and Latin pieces are often harmonically rooted on this minor. In Gb, the relative major key for Ebm, the Phrygian mode scale is Bb B Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb. So, thinking in terms of the Phrygian mode, Russ’ progression looks like:

iv iv iv iv
II II II II
iv iv iv iv
I VII iv iv

Or:
Ebm Ebm Ebm Ebm
B B B B
Ebm Ebm Ebm Ebm
Bb Ab Ebm Ebm

It’s a lot easier to visualize in the key of C, E Phrygian mode:
Am Am Am Am
F F F F
Am Am Am Am
E D Am Am

Throw 7ths, 9ths, etc. into the chords and it's jazz.

This may seem like a complicated explanation from the standpoint of Western theory. But if you are use to playing Latin music, the Phrygian mode is second nature, and this progression is very simple. Note that Phrygian has in common with Dorian that the 7th is a whole step below the tonic; thus it has a familiar feel for jazz musicians who come to the Dorian and Phrygian modes from the pentatonic tradition.

And no, I don’t think in these theoretical terms when I play. But it is interesting to pick it apart and figure out why certain progressions make sense. This vi IV III II vi progression doesn’t make much sense to me from the standpoint of the standard harmonized scale. But for the Phrygian harmonized scale it does. For example, in the key of C, an E major chord has to pull that G# from outside the harmonized scale. But there is a version of Phrygian mode called the Gypsy Phrygian mode that has that note in the scale.
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 4:41 am    
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Brint said,
Quote:
Sounds to me like bVI(B - technically Cb)9#11. (song in Ebm)


I got a hold of Horace Silver's piano transcription for "Senior Blues" and Brint is correct on this.

It's in the key of Ebmi, in 6/8 time. The chord progression is:

Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9

Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9

B9(#11) B9(#11) B9(#11) B9(#11)

Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9

Bb7 Bb7 Ab13 Ab13

Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9 Ebmi6/9


[Bridge]

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11)

B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11)

Bb7 Bb7 Ab13 Ab13

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 8:00 am    
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Bridge? I don't hear no bridge.
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 8:14 am    
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Hi b0b,

I guess, technically, the first part could be called section A and the part I was calling a "bridge" is section B. If you're familiar with the lyrics, it's at:

"Well, he's tall and good looking
And he always knows just what to say
Yes, he's tall and good looking
And he always knows just what to say
By the time that they love him
Senor Blues done gone away...." Smile

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 8:22 am    
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Here's another version on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUAu_3R0VPI&NR=1

I still don't hear that bridge anywhere.
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 8:34 am    
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b0b,

Check out this YouTube of Taj Mahal doing a very faithful rendition of Horace Silver's transcription. Listen for the lyric. Keep in mind, the chords are really the same but with slight modifications (note changes or additions). The structure is a 24-bar blues:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpPXgjsjgAw

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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Brint Hannay

 

From:
Maryland, USA
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 9:50 am    
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I noticed that Horace always added the 11 to the Ebm6/9 in the second twelve, but I missed that the same note also was added as the 13 of the B9#11. Cool!
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 10:27 am    
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Glenn Suchan wrote:
b0b,

Check out this YouTube of Taj Mahal doing a very faithful rendition of Horace Silver's transcription. Listen for the lyric. Keep in mind, the chords are really the same but with slight modifications (note changes or additions). The structure is a 24-bar blues:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpPXgjsjgAw

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn

Sorry, I still don't hear it staying on that B13(#11) for the 4th line of the bridge. It always sounds to me like it goes back to the i before going to the V.
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 10:50 am    
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Hi b0b,

I'm not sure why there is a discrepancy. What I posted previously came from Hal Leonard's "Artist Transcriptions" series on Horace Silver. The transcription was done by a gentleman named Alex Smith. ISBN 0-7935-4046-1

I'm not very good at theory or reading music, so I trust the transcription is accurate. My point is, although it appears as a distinct difference in writing, it is very subtle, sonically. One of the aspects of Horace Silver's music that I really enjoy is it's ability to convey emotion and swing along with technicality. His "Senor Blues" really demonstrates how intricately blues and jazz are intertwined, compared to say, Thelonious Monk's "Brilliant Corners".

The reason for starting this thread was to draw attention to a great jazz artist/composer. How differently each listener interprets the music is part of the fun of sharing these YouTubes. Smile

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 28 Jul 2009 11:47 am    
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b0b,

Ya' know, I just went over the transcription, comparing with Taj Mahal's recording and I think you have a point. The 4th line of section B (or bridge) does go back to Ebm6/9(#11) for four bars.

Section A of the transcription is written with both treble and bass clefts for each stanza. On section B it abruptly changes to just the treble cleft. In my hast to post, I got mixed up as to what line the B13(#11) starts. So, section B (bridge) should read:

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11) B13(#11)

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

Bb7 Bb7 Ab13 Ab13

Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11) Ebmi6/9(add11)

Good call, b0b! Very Happy

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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Gerald Menke

 

From:
Stormville NY, USA
Post  Posted 31 Jul 2009 8:07 am    
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Dear Glenn,

Thanks for posting this, man for some reason I had never heard Horace Silver's music, he is/was definitely some kind of mad genius, there's another clip of them playing this song that has what might be the most intense solo I've ever heard anyone take on a piano, totally out of this world.

1959 was an insane year for jazz, Coltrane's Giant Steps, Bill Evans' Portrait in Jazz, Ornette Coleman's Shape of Jazz to Come, and Duke Ellington's soundtrack to "Anatomy of a Murder". What a year!! And now I must add Horace's album to my collection of music I am building from that year. Thanks again man, this music was like someone telling me a really cool secret.

Gerald
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Glenn Suchan

 

From:
Austin, Texas
Post  Posted 31 Jul 2009 9:59 am    
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You're welcome, Gerald.

Are you referring to the clip that b0b posted from the 1959 Newport performance? If so, you're absolutely right. It is quite a musical journey via his piano solo.

I'm hearing all sorts of right-hand sub melodies and flurishes (at 3:41, something that sounds like a cross between Edvard Grieg's " "Peer Gynt Suite", Op. 46: no. 3 "Anitra's Dance" and "Mary had a Little Lamb"; at 5:22, I her what sounds like a variation on a theme from Gershwin's "Summertime"; at 7:30, I hear "reveille"; at 7:45, I hear what sounds like a variation on the main theme from Prokofiev's "Peter and the Wolf"). All the while his left hand is playing the signature vamp. Cool

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn
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