I wonder.......................

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

Are many of you folks........really deep thinkers?

I recall my good friend Rick Aiello's comments just prior to his artistic solo work at one of the many steel guitar shin-digs he attends with enthusiasm. In essance, he stated:

"I'm not trying to copy JERRY BYRD but if I could just achieve Jerry's sound, just once, I'd be very happy".

Now that's not an exact quote but I think you'll be able to get the gist of what he was saying and what I'm attempting, with great difficulty, to repeat here for YOUR benefit.

While listening to YOUR favorite artist.......and REALLY listening and digging into the dark recesses of your mind...do you EVER think "in this next phrase, here's what I'm going to do" but when your favorite artist gets to that point, he does something totally off the wall and nothing at all like you would have opted to do.....like his bar position, pedals or strings plucked...so different from what you would have used?

I always used to try and out-guess JERRY BYRD and then to try and understand WHY he did what he did, where he did it, instead of him doing it the way I would have chosen to do it. Surely, there's a simple solution of "WHY"........but it's quite elusive.

I could NEVER answer that question, whether he chose his route out of convenience of bar position/movement or whether it was a selection of strings used, or was it "A SOUND" he was trying to attain by using a lower wound strings up high, rather than small strings down lower. OR, in his mind, did he toss something into the mix that HE KNEW would stifle the minds of his most loyal followers?

Of course, doing this all of the time, would be futile but on occasion, it can be a real learning experience. When your 'star' is not right there with you, it does enable 'a student' to get almost right inside their head and yet, the outcome is most likely, YOU would NEVER HAVE DONE his way!

What has been your learning exprience?

Charley Wilder · From: Dover, New Hampshire, USA

Ray, I say this with due respect. I enjoy your posts. But is there a chance you're trying to hard here?
I would think that Jerry, as great a musician as he was, his musical and technical motivation was somewhat like any musician's. He did what he did because it was the best way to express what he heard. Musical expression by technical convenience for want of a better phrase. Is this too shallow an attempt at a definition?

Twayn Williams · From: Portland, OR

I've never consciously tried to imitate anyone, it's only after the fact that I find I might approach a musical moment the same way as someone else. Every now and then I might hear a lick I want to learn from someone, but it's pretty rare. I've never understood folks who try to play like their heroes, note for note, inflection for inflection. Always seemed weird to me, but to each his own!
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Primitive Utility Steel

chas smith R.I.P. · From: Encino, CA, USA

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

I've NEVER attempted to COPY an artist in an attempt to 'replace' him or to become a clone.

I have done so at length however, in an attempt to learn new instrumentals that were coming out all the time, back in the olden days prior to 1980..... It made no sense to me, to labor at attempting to learn and/or play a unique steel guitar tune......in other than the exact tuning in which the song was recorded.

This was the way it was in days of olde....prior to tableture and instructional course. No sense to attempt to play Speedy Wests' "Stainless Steel" in a C#min tuning or with Herb Remington's "Jean Street Swing".......in other than the tuning it was recorded in.

The purpose of my post was merely an effort on my part to learn if anyone else ever used the theory of "REVERSE ENGINEERING" to enable them to figure HOW and/or WHERE a musical phrase came from.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Well, of course, most players do the reverse engineering thing to some degree, especially in the early stages when we're learning and trying to develope techniques and feel. It leads us down an endless road of discovery, but rarely do we know the situations, circumstances, or minutiae that helped make the recordings sound the way they do or what was in the players mind at the time. And trying to replicate all that is virtually impossible, no matter how much fun and instructional.
But it reaches a dead end eventually, because the player being copied was (usually) creating and (generally) not copying, which is where we all have to go.

I tell fellow beginners to just listen to what they like repeatedly until the tune plays itself in their mind effortlessly, and then your own ideas will start to seep into the tune and suddenly you start developing your own style and voice, irregardless of the tuning, etc.

There's a lot I love about JB, Murph, Speedy, Kelii, Pahinui, Ingano, but I don't want to copy them ver batim, just get the overall gist and take it from there. I'll never get to the foot of their level anyway, so why try too hard.
Like Gabby always said to those who would try to play like him, "don't do what I do, do what you do".

Jim Kennedy · From: Brentwood California, USA

I only have a couple of years on steel, but quickly found it quite difficult to truly "copy licks." I now concentrate on position and phrasing, getting close, and sounding as good as I can, I suppose sounding like me. Who knows why a "true artist" does what he does. Everybody who plays rock guitar learns Johnny B. Goode. I wanted to try and play it like Chuck Berry. I found a transcription of the original recording, and it was dead on to what he played and I learned it that way. Out of curiosity I watched three youtube videos the other day. In those video's he never played it the same way. I wouldn't be surprised if he never played it the same way twice. But what an inspiration to generations of rock guitarists. I suspect their Spontanaiety is part of what makes them what they are. Of course, ti's all in their head too, and unfortunately not mine.
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ShoBud Pro 1, 75 Tele, 85 Yamaha SA 2000, Fender Cybertwin,

c c johnson · From: killeen,tx usa * R.I.P.

I'll try my best to read music. Here goes; EM you sss,eye, sea. cc

Pete Burak · From: Portland, OR USA

fwiw, I have had a great time copying Buddy Emmons as close to note-for-note as possible using his 'Swinging" series of lessons (the solo's he plays are tabbed out, note-for-note).
Two that I really like alot are Boggs Boogie, and Lil' Brown Jug.

I find there's room for all types of learning/playing.
Parotting your hero's is a great way to learn a ton of cool ways to play things.
Learning music theory, scales and modes, etc, and then using that knowledge to create melodies and harmonies is cool too.

Funn Stuff!
Pete B.

chas smith R.I.P. · From: Encino, CA, USA

Ken Byng · From: Southampton, England

[quote="chas smith"]

Bo Legg · Posted 23 Jul 2008 3:59 am

It's OK UK. I'm sure he speaks of the same wank. It is a national pass time in this country as well.

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