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Topic: Another Bridge to Burn 2 |
Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 10:39 am |
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click here http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=c7rq7R-x_rY
VIDEOS HAVE BEEN REMOVED
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick
Last edited by Calvin Walley on 10 Feb 2008 12:35 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 10:53 am
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| Calvin, your getting there, when you hear the count in carry on counting in your head, also first play only when there is no singing, .... |
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Don Brown, Sr.
From:
New Jersey
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 12:14 pm
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Folks, I know to many on here, I probably sound like I'm a really crude, and rude person. Which in fact I'm seriously not at all.
I simply don't think it's right in not telling anyone the truth and total truth when they ask a question. And I believe it's very detrimental to their own learning process, when in fact they are not being told the absolute truth.
Now I know I'm among every level of steel player there is on here. And with that said, I then also have to say, that if others can't hear that Calvin's steel, (regardless of how far out of tune with the recording he may be playing which has absolutely nothing to do with the steel itself, being properly tuned) Can't here it, then it's my hearing that's sure way off on intonation. And, if that's the case, then it's me who's making a fool out of myself.
"I'm willing to put it all on the line if that's the case."
On the other hand, if anyone else (that may be on here that Cal WOULD listen to, (so he possibly could start sounding somewhat better) I sure wish whoever that is, would step up to the plate.
I'll say this: He's damn sure got more guts than what I'd have, and if someone would be completely honest with him, just as I've been, he may stop thinking I'm picking on him, and come to realize I'm the only person who's been telling him the total truth on things from day one.
I put one H''l of a whole lot of my time in trying to help him. Now I understand why it was, that he didn't or couldn't use any of it. It was definitely stuff well over his head as to why he didn't use any of it. I'd been going on how far along "he said" he was in playing, before I'd ever heard him play a note.
None of you nor myself, can help anyone with anything if we're not absolutely honest on exactly where they are at, and what's wrong. And even moreso when they feel quite differently themselves, about where they are at in their playing ability.
Possibly just possibly if more would step up or just one that he'd be willing to listen to, that could be the total changing point needed to get through to him.
I give him credit for trying, but I don't for telling what simply isn't the truth on my ability to hear when an instrument is indeed in tune. Don 
Last edited by Don Brown, Sr. on 9 Feb 2008 12:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ray Jenkins
From:
Gold Canyon Az. U.S.A.
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 12:19 pm
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Calvin,everyone on this Forum that sees what you post started exatly where you are now.You are doing great and as time goes by you can look back and check your progress. Be a little more agressive on the tune and don't be afraid to try something that you think may work.Don't stop posting your tunes .
Ray
_________________
Steeling is still legal in Arizona |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 12:28 pm
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thanks Ray
Don
the only thing we know about you is that you
take great pleasue in putting me down
but at least i put my playing out there for all to hear
do you???
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Don Brown, Sr.
From:
New Jersey
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 12:37 pm
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NO Cal. I don't.. Most folks have heard me in one way or the other anyway.
And one day you'll realize I've been honest with you. I give you credit for not being afraid to put it all out in the open. What I don't give you credit for, is for refusing to see where it is you're really at on your playing level. And that's not putting you down at all. You yourself said you've been playing five years. I didn't say that, you said that. And in all honesty. I do hope you one day make me look like a complete jerk. I honestly do, in you becoming one of the best players there are.
From my heart I say that.
And give you my best.
Don |
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Stephen Gambrell
From:
Over there
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 12:59 pm
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Calvin, Don's right. It looks like you're watching that monitor, instead of listening for the chord changes. Use your ears, read the tab ahead of time, before you even TRY to play the song. While you're just starting out, and trying to find the chords, stick to one grip, then add more as you progress. Keep at it. But there's not gonna be a "breakthrough"
moment, where everything falls in place dramatically. There WILL come a time, though, when you can hear the changes, play over them, and make yourself a happy steelman. Good luck!! |
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Mike Winter
From:
Portland, OR
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 1:20 pm
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I agree. I think "hearing" is the most valuable ability a musician can have. It's foundational, especially with a fretless instrument. The ability to hear if you're out of tune, to hear when your intonation is off, being able to hear where the song is going...anticipating chord changes, progressions, etc. This song is only four chords, so the suggestion offered before to play with the fretboard covered, eyes closed, in the dark, whatever...just listening and playing along without looking at anything, would help give an honest picture of where you're at. But again, the inate ability to "hear" where you're at is critical. If you can't hear if you are flat or sharp, if you can't hear when the chord changes take place, then I think that's going to be a hard row to hoe.
I obviously haven't been in the loop as far as correspondence between these two parties, but I have seen a bunch of honest, helpful suggestions, tips, and lessons being offered. They have helped me, so I assume they will help anyone honestly searching. The lights do come on if you persevere, though. 
Calvin said:
"Don the only thing we know about you is that you
take great pleasue in putting me down
but at least i put my playing out there for all to hear do you???"
I don't know that and really don't see it that way. I don't know Don, but I have seen him offer up some really sound, helpful advice. |
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Don Brown, Sr.
From:
New Jersey
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 1:55 pm
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If this comes through ok, and since you feel I'm picking on you. I went back and listened to your playing in greater detail.
Of all of them, the 1982 was probably the best, due to the fact, that you were half way, trying some single string notes. That added more to what you were doing.
So, once again, here I go out on that limb. If Another Bridge To Burn is in "F" Why not try going up two frets above the Bb open position, and as soon as he sings CROSSED, Have your B&C Pedals ready to push, Pick strings 3,4,5, (as a group) just as your pushing your pedals (BC combo) down, then hit the same strings once again fast, slide back one fret, keeping the BC down, pick them again, and as you slide down to the next fret pick them again, letting off your pedals so your then in the Bb open position. But the timing has to be right, before it will work. Practice. It should flow as in.
then slid up to your open C position, and you'll pull him right into the V position for his EVERYTHING
Try it and see if you can get it to fit. It's hard when I'm not use to thinking about what it is or how I'm playing, when I'm playing. But it may open up some new ways for ya to keep ya going.
I'd rather have checked it sitting at a steel, instead of making it up in my head, but down she still is, so if it works that's all that counts. Someone here will sure let me know if it doesn't.
Last edited by Don Brown, Sr. on 9 Feb 2008 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Eric West
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 2:06 pm
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Calvin, and Don.
I'll step up.
It's imperative that you find a REAL LIVE TEACHER. One that you can sit either next to, or across from, record, and learn simple, precise, and definite licks from. RECORD the lessons, and play them back as you learn the exact notes and how they should sound.
The PSG is not an instrument that you can strum and doodle on. That's what you are doing.
You have to play EVERYTHING with DELIBERATION, and AUTHORITY.
Me?
I was lucky enough to find Bud Charleton 32 YEARS ago. I took weekly lessons from him for three years, except for the times he told me to take TWO weeks to study up and get it right.
You think people might be "putting you down"?
Try Buddy Charleton.
I left more than one lesson in tears, and I'm a tough guy.
I didn't get to move on to playing ANYTHING until he was satisfied that I could play the SIMPLE things that he was teaching me, and more than once told me that I was wasting his time.
I'd play some noddling thing over some chord changes, and he'd just shake his head.
I went home to the barracks and WORKED 8 to 10 hours a day getting the simple song Bud's Therapy, and Bud's bounce down nuts on. It took me more time than I'd like to admit to do both.
I had so much desire, and loved the enthusiasm and the glow of his spirit when he played so much, that I didn't let ANYTHING detract me from learning how to play a pedal steel guitar.
You REALLY need to find a REAL LIVE TEACHER.
Noodling comes a LONG TIME after you learn the basics.
You don't have to sweat blood, and fall from the ceiling of the Cistene Chapel every time you try to learn something, but you'r certainly going to have to learn Basic Precise String Attack Technique, and at least three basic patterns to move from one chord to another, EXACTLY how many notes and beats you are playing, and how to pick EACH NOTE out with deliberation.
Until you do, you'll find people that won't hurt your feelings, and like me, think that discouraging a new steel player is a very bad thing.
Until you do what I suggested.
You're wasting all of our time, as well as your own.
That's what Bud Charleton told me.
Off to a gig at the Salem Eagles.
Probably number 3xxx.
EJL |
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James Sission
From:
Sugar Land,Texas USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 2:24 pm
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Calvin,
I would suggest you contact Ricky Davis and ask him for his "drone tone" intonation course. It will help you hear notes and match the sound with proper bar placement. I know it helped me a great deal....James |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 2:25 pm please close
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i'm sick of this
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Don Brown, Sr.
From:
New Jersey
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 2:33 pm
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Cal, you can do it, if you're willing to listen to the ones who are being truthful, honest, and open to you.
You can handle it, it takes practice and willingness to call a spade a spade. Not to call a spade a club, and think it's the truth.
Continue on practicing and you will eventually achieve. I'm still going to tell you that your steel needs to be tuned first. And that's simply a fact, not criticism. |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 2:38 pm
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Calvin,
If I may throw a few things out there.......
I notice that you're anticipating the next change by landing on it and picking it before the change actually happens. If you work on your bar technique a bit, you should be able to get there in time and sound the chord at the exact time the song changes. Some of Joe Wright's bar exercises are great for tone, accuracy and speed.
Working on your right hand technique will also improve your accuracy and speed. Simple exercises (especially Newman's Right Hand Alpha) will help tremendously with this. I only found my playing improving after I put in some solid time in boring, repetitive right hand drills. I took a lap steel on the road a few years ago for a week and just picked away in the van for hours at a time. Soon enough, my right hand started doing its own thing automatically.
I have a video on youtube as well and am open to critique if you'd like. I'm always looking for tips to improve. The sound's a bit wonky but the basic idea is there. I just noodled around a bit:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VVgAQEiO_A
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:09 pm
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your not going to beleive this BUT
a campground owner saw my video
and wants ME TO PLAY THERE THIS SUMMER
i have not answered him yet haha
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Walter Stettner
From:
Vienna, Austria
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:10 pm
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Calvin,
Why are you asking to close this thread? A whole lot of comments came back ( you were asking for that), with lots of good suggestions how to move along (especially Eric's tip to try to find a teacher is a good one, I had one to get started, without his help I would have probably ended up in no man's land). The steel guitar is really a complex instrument, one should always be on the lookout for assistance. We are so lucky these days that, with the help from the internet (and all the great guys on the forum), we can get more comments, help and advise than players in previous years could get in their whole lifetime.
Getting tips and comments from others can be such a tremendous help, I am taking advantage of this whenever I can. I bet you can do it as well.
Keep on keepin' on!
Good luck and kind regards, Walter
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www.lloydgreentribute.com |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:13 pm
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Chris
your right but please take into consideration
that the main reason for doing the videos is to
force myself to get over being so damned nervous
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:35 pm
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Hey Calvin,
I was nervous putting up a video too. That's why I only posted the best takes.
There is some benefit to what you are doing here. By posting these clips, you are generating discussion and debate. I know you're not interested in learning theory, so why not hone in on the physical aspects instead? That's where I was coming from with my suggestions.
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:42 pm
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Calvin, do you know anyone that plays guitar and sings that could come to your home and play some songs with you on steel,
I do think it would be of help to you to play live so to speak, if they are a friend it would also help with the nerve thing.... |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:46 pm
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i have postphoned my trip til monday so
i have a little more time
i am thinking hard about just selling it
on one hand every one tells me how bad i am
at the same time somone else wants me to play for the public...go figure???
i have quit before only to buy another one
so i have some thinking to do
John
not a single soul
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 3:59 pm
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| Eric West wrote: |
Calvin, and Don.
I'll step up.
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Eric, you spoke the truth there. And man what a teacher you had! If only your words could be taken to heart and applied in the right way.
I applaud you for a very truthful, concise post there, Eric.
Calvin, please read it one hundred times and take some learning from it. |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 4:03 pm
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Calvin, quitting pedal steel is a very easy thing to do. A lot of people give up when they realize how much time and effort it takes to get some control on the instrument, let alone play it well. Most people don't even bother to try at all, because it is hard and takes commitment. How bad do you want it? I think you want it bad enough to stay at it. You wouldn't be going through the trouble of videotaping yourself if you didn't love the instrument. I don't think quitting should come into the picture here at all.
When I saw the late Jeff Newman (God rest his generous, talented soul) on his Right Hand Alpha video, he made me feel like if I quit, he'd come hunt me down like Clint Eastwood. I've been afraid to quit ever since.
_________________
Jackson Steel Guitars
Web: www.chrisledrew.com |
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Jerry L Miller
From:
Sublette, Kansas, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 4:05 pm
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Calvin i got my steel in 1989 no teachers here in sothwest ks. very few steel players so i played like you did on your video. it didnt take long to see i was going no where except i learned a lot of bad habits. so Newman courses, right hand tech, playing with an attack. Franklin tapes, i had to learn all over again, now i scan this forum for ever tid bit i can find on playing better, no body on this forum is putting you down, may i suggest that you play the whole song while the singer is singing, play over the top of him. after you can play it this way. then start playing in between the lines. this is how i learn a new song. hope this helps.
just dont give up. ahhh that place that wanted you to play . GO DO IT just be a little more aggressive! |
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Calvin Walley
From:
colorado city colorado, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 4:22 pm
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right now i'm in a different state ..not Colorado
so i called my teacher and played the video for him over the phone
...first thing outa of his mouth was
how bad were you shaking ....
he knows first hand how bad it is.
he said to me ...if they ( you guys ) only knew how far you have come they would understand.
guys, i just don't know any more
_________________
proud parent of a sailor
Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!
Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick |
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Dick Sexton
From:
Greenville, Ohio
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Posted 9 Feb 2008 4:28 pm Who is he?
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Calvin, what is you instructors name?
Dick Sexton |
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