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Topic: To Anyone Who Has Recorded an Album |
Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 12 Sep 2007 8:10 pm |
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I'm getting close to finishing my first record. (I still call them 'records' or 'albums'  )Many of the songs are my own, but some are covers. The question is: How many of you with CD's or records using others material have paid for the use of those songs?
I intend to pay the necessary fees through the Harry Fox agency. Can anyone give me any insight on that?
Thanks for any response.
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com
Last edited by Joe Savage on 13 Sep 2007 8:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
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basilh
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 2:12 am
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Joe, beware, and be aware of the fact the the Harry Fox agency will TRY to claim royalties on songs/tunes that they DON'T have the rights too. Songs that are "Trad".
Do a search on Google for Harry Fox disputes and of the music section here for Harry Fox. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 2:55 am
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Joe, I think it is wise for two reasons..
One is that someone else owns the Music, perhaps a fellow Musician..
and two
It's the legal thing to do
Now regarding the Traditional songs, that would be easy to search and define.
When applying for the license you can get a minimum qty and always increase it should your CD sell a million, which I hope it does.
I offer a handdful of CD/Tab projects which I have been fortunate with. I obtain the license for each for them. I spoke with a few folks in St Louis that offer tracks,one said he did the other said he pays approx 5K a year for all the licenses .
Here is the bottom line OPINION from me, if we are offering a program for sale and are using others material, the licensing is part of the production cost. Start with a small number as you can always increase it. Be aware that there is a fixed service fee so you may want to consider this FEE in your calculations.
I suspect there are several ways to obtain licenses, the easiest is to PAY the fee thru Harry Fox, you pay a Service Fee because they are making it easy. It takes a few hours to get the license once it as been requested. No leg work, no fuss ...
Will anyone ever approach you and ask for license proof ? I doubt it...
but if they do.....
Good luck with your project, I'm sure it will be excellent
tp
PS, just my take... |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 3:16 am
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I paid Harry Fox when I did my CDs. At the time it was $91 per tune, per 1,000 CDs pressed. Fortunately I only needed the mechanical licensing for one tune on my Firebird Suite CD, as all the other material is now public domain. But ALL the tunes of West Side Story are owned by the Bernstein Estate and I had to pay a small fortune to get the licensing.
Pay the fees. It's better to have all the legalities squared away and avoid a possible lawsuit.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Jack Musgrave
From:
Springfield, Missouri, USA
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 3:21 am
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do fees have to paid for intrumental versions of songs?
after all, you re not using any of the words. I have not recorded any personal cd's but if I do someday, it might be something good to be aware of |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Billy Wilson
From:
El Cerrito, California, USA
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 3:45 am
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| Now days the manufacturing folks won't do their job for you unless you can show them the license. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 5:43 am
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fee's even have to be paid if you are just making a few tracks of songs and giving them to your friends and family. Now will they come hunt you down ? I doubt it.
the fee is for mechanical or any form of copies or distribution ,not sales.
it's wise to be legal.
my opinion.
tp |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 7:52 am
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When dealing with "traditional" songs (songs that are considered in the public domain), you also have to be careful. An arrangment of a PD song (the specific way it's played), can also be copyrighted...so it's best to just go ahead and pay the license fees - or write your own material.  |
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 8:08 am
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Thanks, guys. Basil, I found a couple of interesting posts in "Music". Good idea. I intend to do it in the proper, legal fashion. Thanks to all responders. I was just wondering how other steel players handle that stuff. What if your particular arrangement is unique?
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com
Last edited by Joe Savage on 13 Sep 2007 8:33 am; edited 3 times in total |
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 8:23 am
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Donny, we must have been writing at the same time. I had asked about arrangement copyrights.
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com |
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Alan Brookes
From:
Brummy living in Southern California
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 2:48 pm
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| Joe, are you putting together the CD to circulate to friends or sell commercially ? It sounds to me that you're putting them together yourself as opposed to recording in a professional studio. If you contract with a record company they will usually do the copyright work for you. I don't imagine Frank Sinatra did his own copyright searches. |
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LJ Eiffert
From:
California, USA
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Posted 13 Sep 2007 9:29 pm
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| Hey Joe, you're better off checking with BMI 0r ASCAP before go to Harry Fox because 9 times out of ten the Publisher(s) and or song-writer(s) will work with you.I've been doing this for over Forty years as Publisher & Song-writer and if they haven't had any active sometimes you can work out a 50/50 deal on your Recording of your arrangement as a one time cut on that song only. Business-Music. Leo J.Eiffert,Jr. & Pigeons with Clip Wings. PS: Don't tell the world I said this because everydody will know how the real Music Bussiness works! I've said it,OH well slap my hands! |
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 14 Sep 2007 12:03 am
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Alan, I do plan to sell commercially. I don't have a record contract, so yes, I'm doing this myself. I think I will get some airplay locally and hope to shop my stuff for film and radio. I've been playing around Minneapolis for close to 25 years and have alot of friends that are interested in my work. We'll see.
L.J., I'm not really sure what you mean. Can you explain that again?
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com |
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Mark Wayne
From:
Wisconsin, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2007 9:57 pm
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Joe, here's a link to some potential public domain songs, both secular and Gospel:
http://www.pdinfo.com/list.htm
I know it's not what you were asking about, but may be helpful to somebody.
_________________
Mark Wayne Krutke
****markwayne.biz**** |
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Delvin Morgan
From:
Lindstrom, Minnesota, USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2007 3:09 am
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Joe,
How are you to market your new CD, through the theater in Sandstone, local merchants? I will buy one for sure, and friends of mine will as well.
Good luck on it. |
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 15 Sep 2007 5:47 am
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Hey Delvin. I was planning to check into some local merchants, like "Homestead Pickin' Parlour", perhaps through the theater, (although, it's not really "country") and online through myspace and my website, if I ever get that going. I'll let you know when it's done. Thanks.
Mark, thanks for that link, I just glanced at it briefly, but will check it out further, soon.
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Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2007 8:49 am
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| Quote: |
| Pay the fees. It's better to have all the legalities squared away and avoid a possible lawsuit. |
What Mike said - also others regarding arrangements of PD songs. The PD "arrangement" thing is a real gray area, because small alterations may or may not be a "rearrangement". But years ago, My bluegrass band recorded some stuff, did all the legal deals, sold the requisite 250 copies and gave 500 away (grin) - and ended up in a battle with another local band who swiped our particular arrangement (hey, come to think of it - they swiped our fiddle player too!) of a traditional tune (we had heard it played on a radio show live and knew they were in the studio). It was a very strongly-identifiable arrangement, and a letter from an attorney convinced them to NOT release it, since they didn't want to play.
I played on some sessions for a local Christian artist a few years ago, and he *didn't* follow the law - didn't get sued, but he ended up paying through the nose "after the fact".
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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LJ Eiffert
From:
California, USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2007 9:36 pm
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| Hey Joe,seem to me after 25 years in the Music circle you would know what BMI or ASCAP means.The people who will be giving you air-play,oh that right,you said,I think I will! Well alot of your friends interested may help you. Read again what I wrote and open up your mind,It's Music-Business.If it to recorded these songs for friends & family,their not coming after you for a few Hundred Dollars. It would cost them more to get it from you then what you're putting out. Now,if you're making real big money on this,that's a new game,Court.Good luck and God Bless you.If you still don't understand what I'm writing,I'll write it more openly and let the chips fall. Leo J.Eiffert,Jr. & Pigeons. |
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 15 Sep 2007 10:15 pm
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LJ. Of course I know what ASCAP and BMI are. Thanks for your input. I'll figure it out as I go, it seems. I've always been a sideman and this is my first personal recording, so even though I've been playing music for a long time, alot of this Music-Business, as you say, is new to me.
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com |
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LJ Eiffert
From:
California, USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2007 7:44 am
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| Hey Brother Joe,Now that you said this is new to you it makes more sense to Educate you.If you're recording these cover tunes-songs,like I said just for friends and Family members then the legal formulations is to put on your production copies, Not For Sale or Promotional copy only.What you're doing here is Promoting the song or songs.How ever,if you sell one copy and some one can prove it.then you're in a legal court game.With BMI & ASCAP is just to make sure you know who wrote and Published the songs. Leo J.Eiffert,Jr. |
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Mark Lind-Hanson
From:
Menlo Park, California, USA
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Posted 17 Sep 2007 11:54 am
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I put out a cd of cover tunes this year and ended up paying a large sum to Harry Fox for songs they control.
It IS best policy to not ignore your responsibility to the writers- but Harry Fox don't happen to control EVERY song in the world. Some people I had actually a difficult time hunting down their publisher to pay the compulsory licenses. It ended up costing me around 5-600.oo for all the Harry Fox stuff and everything else- about a third the cost of the cd!
Needless to say my next project is entirely of original music and nobody's gonna profit by it except myself. |
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LJ Eiffert
From:
California, USA
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Posted 17 Sep 2007 7:31 pm
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| Hello Mark lind-hanson,you got it right! Do your own songs and you'll never go wrong.Start your own Publishing company too. If you got good songs the right deal will come alone,but,it's what you agree to in that paper work or who you're dealing with as to if you'll make any money. Good luck & Joe, too! Leo J.Eiffert,Jr. & Pigeons |
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Jennings Ward
From:
Edgewater, Florida, R.I.P.
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Posted 17 Sep 2007 8:07 pm
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JOE, BE SURE TO CYA.... MAY BE A TALK WITH AN ATTOURNEY THAT HANDLES COPPY RIGHTS AND INTELECTUAL MATERIAL WOULD BE IN ORDER....
IN ANY CASE, WHEN YOU DO FINALLY DO THE CD,L MAY I BE THE FIRST TO BUY ONE??? GOOD LYCK,, YOUR FRIEND ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
JENNINGS ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
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Joe Savage
From:
St. Paul, MN
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Posted 18 Sep 2007 2:40 pm
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Hey Jennings. When I get finished, I'll let you know and we can talk! Good to see your furry self in those pictures from St. Louis.
_________________
Joe Savage
www.savagejoe.com |
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